GOTM 28 Spoiler 2 - End Of Middle Ages, All Contacts, Full World Map

[ainwood]

Another point on flipping & defenders: IIRC, the AI gets a chance to rush units. If they can, then they often do, hence the occasional second defender.

 

[civ_steve]

v1.21f

Here's my quick post:

I entered the Middle Ages in 30AD; I'd already taken Persepolis (and the Pyramids), and declared peace with Persia leaving Xerxes about 5-6 cities. I had contact with Carthage (who built the Great Lighthouse), and my hastily rushed galleys had already found the safe transit spot to the West, and contacted Rome.

Two of the first level Medieval Techs were already known (Mono and Engineering, I believe), so I researched Feudalism as quick as possible, and was able to trade for the other two. I researched Theology quickly also , then started a slow 40 turn research on Education. By this time a suicide galley had successfully gone East, and I had gained all contacts. Greece had the Great Library, and Carthage was the other good researcher. Everyone else was at least a step or two behind, and Babylon was being dismembered.

Peace with Persia lasted 20 turns, then it was bash some more on Xerxes time! I went fairly slowly, as I was trying to get a GL to rush a palace in Persepolis (I'd already built the FP near Delhi). No luck, so I finally did in Xerxes in 560 AD, and with some set-up I abandoned Delhi and Jumped the palace to Persepolis. I revolted that same turn, and had a new palace and a new Republic government in 570 AD. About Time! The maintenance on those cultural buildings was starting to mount up!

My goal was a 100K culture victory, so I crammed a city in nearly every spot possible on the continent. I ended up with 43 cities; with slightly better placing 2 or 3 more might have been possible, but I'll move forward with this set. I was pop-rushing Temples, Libraries and Cathedrals at every oppurtunity; once I was Republic the populace could breathe a little easier.

So I started a bunch of wars, and used Techs to get allies; my goal was to slow down Carthage and Greece, and the Romans, Germans and Ottomans were happy to help! I finally got Education, well after the leaders, but was able to trade for Invention, and I got Chivalry as part of an alliance deal. Then I kicked up the research to learn Astronomy. Started to build some War Elephants, with the intention of landing just enough inside Carthage to get a Victory and start my Golden Age and build lots of universities. What do you know? Carthage lands a single Longbowman on my continent! I put two defenders in the adjacent cities, making sure they were unfortified, and moved a War Elephant up. Fortunately the Longbowman won (1 hp left), and my WE finished him off, starting my GA without having to do an invasion. This was in 860 AD.

I pretty much did maximum research from that point on. I traded for Gunpowder, Chemistry and Metallurgy, and researched Banking, Navigation, Physics, Magnetism and Theory of Gravity, reaching the Industrial Age in 1080 AD (just after the GA expired.) I've kept the rest of the world pretty riled up; Greece and Carthage are a bit beat up, and the Celts are now even with them. I have exclusive knowledge of Physics, and of course TofG and Magnetism, and I'm missing Democracy and Military Tradition. My Cultural Value is just over 23,000, gaining 500 cpt. I figure I should achieve the 100K victory in the mid-1700's or so.

BTW, a 3rd source of Iron has shown up in my Territory.

 

[Phillip_martin]

……Phil wanders in from the desert, rubs the sand out of his eyes.

“Have I missed anything ??”

I might even get a game in this month as I am several turns from a 20k cultural victory

 

[zagnut]

Welcome back, Phil.

Now get to work and finish that game.

 

[Justus II]

Well, just qualified for this thread, and won't see the next one!

I have "crammed" one of my fasted GOTMs, both in RL and game time, over the past few days, and will post a more detailed report tomorrow. I was actually quite excited about my early domination victory, only to see SirPleb (as expected) beat me by nearly 200 years. I already knew a couple mistakes I made, I built a couple stacks of cats/cannons that never made it to the front, and struggled short of cash so I could get to Cavalry, when Elephants would have won it with more temples rushed earlier. Anyway, here is the victory screen, until I can post the rest of the report tomorrow:

 

[AlanH]

Well done, JustusII. You may be comparing with SirPleb, but you beat my domination date by a country mile. I look forward to seeing your write-up, as I also finished with Cavalry. My game finished late and my elephants hardly saw action because my overseas invasions were delayed by my failure to realise until very late that there was a safe coast-to-coast crossing to Carthage

 

[Justus II]

1.27f

Predator

Ancient Age Post

The Rest of the Story
The rest of this game seemed destined to prove the old saying, Knowledge is Power. In my Ancient Ages post, I referred to my anonymous friends, which I had made with the help of the Great Lighthouse. The Lighthouse completed in 950BC, and I (with the help of the whip) I had 3 galleys ready to go. Two headed east, one west, and two turns later, the one to the west made contact with Carthage. I could see a red border, so I held off on trading for another turn until I met Rome. Both had Iron working, Carthage had Math but was short Polytheism, and Rome had Code of Laws and Horseback, while short Mysticism! So in 875BC I traded Carthage Polytheism for Mathematics, Iron Working and 10g, and traded Rome Mysticism for 35g, then Polytheism + Math for Code of Laws, Horseback Riding and another 35g. Just in time, as Persia had declared on me in 1000BC, only to discover I have no iron either! But Persia does, I had already seen a regular Immortal by now. Still, Catapults would help, and now I knew where to go pillage.

My ships in the east had poked around a bit, then hopped from sea tile to sea tile and saw an orange border on an island. I met the Ottomans in 800BC who were down Poly, then Germany in 750, Babylon in 730, Vikings in 690, Celts in 630 and finally the [/b]Greeks[/b] in 610BC. Everyone was short Poly, and all but the Greeks were also missing Math and Code of Laws. Vikings and Celts were really backwards, and didn’t even have Map-Making yet.

Meanwhile, in 670BC the Ottomans discovered Construction, and Rome has Philosophy. Time for a 2-fer. I buy Philosophy for 13gpt from Rome, then trade Philo, Poly, and 10gpt to the Ottomans for [/b]Construction[/b]. Unfortunately I am still paying monopoly prices, but I am still able to resell at monopoly because they don’t know the other civs yet. I started a minimum research on Monarchy, hoping Currency would pop up soon (I don’t know why, after the past few games, I still hope the AI will research the last tech in the era, it never works, whichever tech I need ).

Back to the front lines, I described in the AA post how I eventually conquered Persepolis (and the Pyramids) and took Monarchy for peace, so I could then research Literature, and finally Currency to get to the Middle Ages in 330BC. Since I had made all contacts by now, it was time to play a little Tech Lotto and see what my supposedly scientific friends could do for me:
Civ Getting them to MA Free Tech Missing
Ottomans Currency for 130, 1gpt Feudalism (Had Monarchy, -Lit)
Greeks Currency for 28g (Gave Const.) Feudalism (Missing Lit, Monarchy)
Germans Currency for 73g Engineering (Missiong Lit, Monarchy)
Babylons Currency for 8g NOT Scientific (again!)
Persia Currency for 14g Feudalism (Have Lit and Monarchy).

I hated to trade with Persia, as I didn’t want them to get Feudalism/Pikes, but I wanted another shot at Monotheism. I gave this situation some thought. I have already seen how my knowledge of the other civs has given me power, now it was time to take advantage of their lack of knowledge! After buying an embassy to verify, Persia had no knowledge of any other civs. No one else had made it to our continent, and after studying the sea lanes, there looked to be only one path for a non-lighthouse or non-seafaring civ to make it across, from Rome/Carthage. I also reviewed the civilopedia, looking at every tech to see if they made special ships available (AKA the Odan junk at Monotheism last game), but nothing out of the ordinary. Therefore, as long as I parked a ship on that sea lane, no one would ever hear Xerxes scream.

Map of Sea Lane

(Note the wounded barb galley, apparently someone had tried to make contact, or Persia had a galley, but didn’t survive!)

The Fall of Xerxes
So, now we pick up our story again, it’s 330BC, dawn of the Middle Ages. When I got the embassy, I also saw that Pasargadea was working on Hanging Gardens, due in 19 (same as me) and did not have their Iron city connected to the capital! Although it was connected to two other cities, through MY roads! But, after splurging a little more (knowledge is power!) and investigating, the cities with iron had no barracks, so no upgrades. Average of 2 spear garrison each. Time to pay Xerxes a visit. I buy Feudalism and an ROP for Literature and 15gpt. (I don’t like ROP rapes, but in this case I am going to take advantage of the lack of contacts, and I don’t want him whipping any pikes, since I still have archers). Trade with Germany, getting Engineering for Lit, Monarchy, Feudalism, and 6gpt (They would have gotten those techs from other civs anyway). Sell Rome Literature for 72g. Move troops (2 stacks of 4 archer, 2 spear each, and 5 cats total) adjacent to Antioch (Iron city) and Bactra. I also move 4 warriors into Persepolis, which rushes a barracks. Declare war, lose 2 archers but take both cities (including the iron), killing 4 spears and an archer. Two more archers moving in the open, but I have reinforcements en route. Upgrade the warriors for 4 Med. Infantry. (Never had a swordsman). Stack with Cats moves next to Arbela, 2 archers kill 2 spear, and it’s mine also. It takes a few more turns, but Pasargadae falls in 190BC, then Sidon in 150, and finally Persia is eliminated in 50BC, and no one will ever know they existed.

Dealing with Rome
Meanwhile, across the channel, Rome destroys Carthage in 210BC. I wasn’t quite prepared, but reacted quickly, and landed a settler to found Dacca in 130BC, securing Furs and Horses! A rushed library and harbor later, and I was in business. I get another bonus in 50BC, when Rome develops the Republic, but still lack Currency or Construction. I debate whether I even want it, but decide it would be good to have the improved corruption before my imminent Golden Age. So I trade Construction, Currency, Ivory, Wool, and Spices (like I could trade them to anyone else) for Republic, an ROP, (uh oh), and Furs (I roaded the horses first, furs were still 10 turns away). I am then able to sell Republic to Germany for 140g+22gpt, and the Ottomans for 47g+7gpt, because, after all, Knowledge is Power, and they had no knowledge of Rome either. Besides, I also wanted to force them to research into the MA, not waste time on Republic.

An Optimized Golden Age
Probably because this was a ‘scheduled’ Golden Age, I took more time than usual to prepare for it, making sure I would get maximum benefit. By now nearly every tile in my original empire was irrigated or mined, and roaded. I had 25+ workers running around, continuing to improve Persian tiles. I rushed 3 more settlers from Persian towns to fill in their cities a little denser, so they could get Temples during the GA. In 30BC, I revolted to Republic, both for the gold bonus, and for the corruption benefit. As it turned out, there wasn’t much net benefit after all, as my unit support outgrew my income, but when I calculated it out, I was still coming out ahead by a little over 30gpt. 10AD was my final pre-GA turn, double checking everything was in place, and 30AD the Golden Age kicks off, as I complete the Hanging Gardens. Forbidden Palace also completes the same turn in Madras (Central Mountains), I wanted that in place as well for the corruption benefit. We see a big boost in income, of course. I had 27 cities, and focused initially on completing infrastructure (Libraries/Markets where needed), and started research on Monotheism, due in 5.

I also worked to optimize production for horses. By 150AD Delhi was at 30spt, with Bombay a few turns later, and several other cities at 15spt.

I got Monotheism in 110AD, started now on Invention (due in 5), I didn’t want to get Chivalry until I was done building horses. I wait a couple turns, then sell to my trading partners, getting 100+33gpt from the Ottomans and 90+23gpt from Germany. Invention comes in 250AD, and I get 80+48g from the Ottomans and 100+9gpt from the Germans. I will need a lot of cash soon. I upgrade my 4 remaining vet archers. Celts complete Great Library, which they needed, as they are a backwards people. 290AD I get Gunpowder (Gotta love 4-turn research in the Middle Ages!). I switch to Chivalry, but back off the pace, dragging it out to 6 turns. Good news is we have Saltpeter. GA ends in 330, and Leo’s is still due in 6, I didn’t time that pre-build well enough, so I have to wait a few more turns.

Meanwhile, I notice another opportunity knocking. One of my scouting galleys notes the Vikings are down to OCC, and the Celts are moving in for the kill. Rush a settler and another galley, and head over the sea, then wait for the Celt MDIs to finish the job, and we have a foothold on their continent in 390AD.

I also settle Wine Island in 330AD, but by now I don’t think the game will last long enough to use it. In fact, at this point (in RL) I realized that there weren’t enough days left in the month for the 100K Cultural, and I would be pushing it to get a victory at all by the 29th, as we had family in town. Domination looked like the quickest way to get a win, and I thought I could get a pretty good date.

 

[Justus II]

{Continued from Above Post}

420AD Chemistry comes in, and Leo’s completes. Celts also complete Sun Tzu. Time to use all that cash:

These 40 are just on the Roman continent, I have 17 more on galleys headed to our Celtic colony. A big advantage for the Elephants is that I can upgrade on the Celt continent, even though we don’t have Ocean trade yet! Since Rome is still isolated, I position MDI’s to pillage all 4 iron sources, and move my elephants (5 stacks of 8) adjacent to his cities, with a stack of cats to help at Antium. I will save Rome to unite a couple stacks against. War is declared in 440AD, and I take 6 cities, as well as all the iron, and several legions and archers in the open. I only have 2 elite archers, so my focus now is to get some elite elephants, I still want to rush my palace over here. Rome itself falls in 480AD, Veii was the final Roman city and fell in 530AD after some unsuccessful attempts to get a leader.

Half a world away, but in parallel, I upgrade 17 horses to elephants and declare (honorably) on the Celts in 450AD. After taking Nidaros (Colossus), I start working my way south, toward Entremont with the G. Library and Sun Tzu. Research was progressing on Metallurgy, since my catapults were not that effective, but also so I could get Cav to speed up the rest of my war machine.

In 490BC, I was running low on cash, and decided to cell Chivalry to some of the other AI, getting a total of 200g+85gpt, and revolted back to Monarchy. My WW was forcing my lux slider up, and unit support was over 160gpt. (More on that later). Entremont fell in 520AD, giving me Sun Tzu and Great Library (which eventually gave me Theology, but never got to Education). In 530 Metallurgy was discovered, and I started on Military Tradition (in 7). I had workers roading a salt mountain in former Celtic lands, and planned on upgrading all my cats to cannons to support my elephants. (Note to self- Cannons take Salt AND IRON!). Well, delay that order for a while. I pushed on with elephants and took Richborough, which had Iron, and by 600AD, Military Tradition came in, and I was able to upgrade a few cav and some cannons to finish off the Celts by 630AD.

This was a time of great sea movements, as I started transferring my cavs and elite elephants to Babylon, while I had upgraded over 20 cav and 12 cannons from Rome, and used a fleet of galleys to sail from sea to sea to get to Germany. I kept my ROP with Germany, and positioned to strike, declaring on Babylon in 640AD, reducing them to an island city by 670, and did the same to Germany, declaring in 650AD, and reducing them to 1 city by 680. I was at 854 tiles of 1012, so I needed more land. Meanwhile, I was struggling to rush temples and settlers in Rome and Celt lands, but I was only able to do 3-4/turn (income around 300gpt). Getting impatient, I also declared on the Ottomans in 690, taking all their cities (except an island) in 700AD. That proved to be enough, combined with border expansions, and in 710AD I passed the limit. My Firaxis score was 6771. My power graph:

You can see from the mini-map, Greece was the only untouched country, the others were reduced to their one-city islands.

Lessons Learned
I learned a lot from this game, some of which was, um, reinforced after reading SirPleb’s excellent writeup. First, and probably my biggest stumbling block, is I must decide early what victory condition I am going for, and then focus on that. I was still building libraries and cathedrals while invading Rome (holdovers from my 100K culture plan). I was also looking to settle more small towns, for the same reason. Even once I decided on Domination, I should have concentrated on more galleys, and settlers, to fill in gaps, so they were ready to go with the troops, instead of scrambling to rush them afterwards. Temples have to be rushed, but I could easily have had the settlers available. Also, knowing I would need to rush temples later, I should have stockpiled more cash. Also, I wasted production in cities building markets, aqueducts, harbors, etc that would never finish before the end of the game, they should have switched at least to wealth. I also had tons of workers roaming around Rome, improving tiles that were always to be corrupt, and many were native (i.e. I was paying support on them ) I finally started merging some in toward the end, but much later than I should have.

Second, when going for a fast-moving domination, cannons and especially catapults are not worth the effort. I invested production, transport space, upgrade gold, and especially unit support, on 25+ cannons that didn’t see action after the Celts fell. And in several cases, I delayed attacks to get them in place, only to save 1-2 hp from defenders. That’s 50gpt in unit support (plus another 10 or so extra galleys built to carry them), and 500g in upgrades, for no real benefit. For those shields, I could have had 7 extra elephants, or 16 settlers with me on the initial assault waves. And that’s not even considering the research cost of getting to Metallurgy, which brings me to point #3.

Third, Elephants were obviously effective enough to win this game. I had all but destroyed the Celts, and the Romans were long gone, before Cavalry was on the scene. Had I invested all that research money into temples and settlers, I might have already expanded enough to hit the limit, or be close. The opportunity cost was well over 6,000 gold in research, which could have been shut off in 350AD with Chivalry. I could have easily rushed 20 elephants in front-line cities with that, which certainly would have been enough to finish the job.

Fourth, SirPleb did some excellent analysis of the benefits of Republic vs. Monarchy. My own experience mostly supports his conclusions. At the time I first switched to Republic, I did have to increase lux 10%, because I had been using some MPs to balance out my largest cities, and unit support was a little high, but still a net gain of 30gpt. (I was a little disappointed that there seemed to be no effect on corruption, I thought Republic was supposed to be better). Even with higher lux during WW, Republic seemed at worst to break even with Monarchy, meaning I would be ahead during all peaceful times. However, by the end of my game, unit support was going up faster than I was taking cities, and WW was going up as I dragged out the Roman war searching for leaders, so I switched back. Had I not been religious, though, I would have gone Republic and rode it out.

Final point regards leaders. I know SirPleb’s leader article cautions about planning on a leader when you need it, and I stayed pretty flexible about it, knowing I had few elites (2 archers) when I started my campaign. My plan for the first leader was to rush a palace in Rome, since I had already build the FP in the center of my starting continent. But when that wasn’t forthcoming, even as I accumulated 10-12 elite elephants, I figured I could also get some use out of a palace in Entremont, securing Sun Tzu and the Library and generally suppressing flips in the new continent. However, for the first game I can remember in a long time, I got ZERO great leaders. In a Domination win! Luckily, none of my plans DEPENDED on it, although it meant I went the entire game with only one and a half cores. Well, at least that fits with the Conquests transition, right?

Oh, one final lesson learned: Don't put off the GOTM till the end of the month! Especially in February!!!