HOF Mod Support/Suggestions

[da_Vinci]

Let me import from the GOTM thread a problem that might be an HOF mod issue:

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=5737446&postcount=66

The short version is:

My dual install went well, game loads, etc. But if I open the option screen, the exit button won't exit, and I am dead in the water. I can change the options, but can't get back to the game. Have to minimize Civ and kill it in task manager.

Same issue in all the new mods: HOF 1.74.001, HOF 2.13.001 and the SGOTM 05 mod. NOT a problem in the unmodded installs of 1.74 or 2.13. Maybe something to do with the new HOF mods?

Not fixed after a reboot.

If one always saves before going to options, that is at least a workaround.

The fact that unmodded does not cause a problem, but modded does, makes me wonder if there is a mod issue?

I am running vista, and it has a habit of following a lot of installs with a window that says something like "XXX may not have installed properly". Often they seem false alarms. I got a couple in my install process, I think it might have been with the HOF mods.

I'll try a reinstall of the mods when I get home, see if that helps.

In the SGOTM 05 maint thread http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=232704, remconius had the same problem but magaged to tweak his way out of it. But he's not sure which of several tweaks did the trick.

dV

 

[ArcadicGamer]

I encountered a problem with the newest patch's HOF mod. It told me my assests were modified from what they should be. I have the STEAM version of all 3 games, and had read a thread elsewhere that the STEAM and BOXED version are showing as Modded to each other in MP games. It should be noted that the STEAM version automaticly patches to the most current build for all games it owns. So i know i have 1.71 and 2.13. Any help is appreciated as i really wish to give gm24 a good attempt.

 

[Denniz]

Let me import from the GOTM thread a problem that might be an HOF mod issue:

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=5737446&postcount=66

The short version is:

My dual install went well, game loads, etc. But if I open the option screen, the exit button won't exit, and I am dead in the water. I can change the options, but can't get back to the game. Have to minimize Civ and kill it in task manager.

Same issue in all the new mods: HOF 1.74.001, HOF 2.13.001 and the SGOTM 05 mod. NOT a problem in the unmodded installs of 1.74 or 2.13. Maybe something to do with the new HOF mods?

Not fixed after a reboot.

If one always saves before going to options, that is at least a workaround.

The fact that unmodded does not cause a problem, but modded does, makes me wonder if there is a mod issue?

I am running vista, and it has a habit of following a lot of installs with a window that says something like "XXX may not have installed properly". Often they seem false alarms. I got a couple in my install process, I think it might have been with the HOF mods.

I'll try a reinstall of the mods when I get home, see if that helps.

In the SGOTM 05 maint thread http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=232704, remconius had the same problem but magaged to tweak his way out of it. But he's not sure which of several tweaks did the trick.

dV

There probably is a python exception or something. Could you turn on logging so we can see what's going on?

You have to change you CivilizationIV.ini file. There is one in each version in your "My Documents\My Games\Sid Meier's Civilization 4" and "My Documents\My Games\Warlords" folders. Either one will do.

; Set to 1 for no python exception popups
HidePythonExceptions = 0

; Enable the logging system
LoggingEnabled = 1

; Overwrite old network and message logs
OverwriteLogs = 1

; Enable message logging
MessageLog = 1

Try to repeat it and after you get out zip up and send the Python* files from Logs folder. It is in the same folder as the ini file.

BTW, are you using XP or Vista.

 

[Denniz]

I encountered a problem with the newest patch's HOF mod. It told me my assests were modified from what they should be. I have the STEAM version of all 3 games, and had read a thread elsewhere that the STEAM and BOXED version are showing as Modded to each other in MP games. It should be noted that the STEAM version automaticly patches to the most current build for all games it owns. So i know i have 1.71 and 2.13. Any help is appreciated as i really wish to give gm24 a good attempt.

I haven't heard anything about STEAM being different. Did you mean 1.71 or was that a typo? The current patch for vanilla is 1.74. All I can suggest is unistall, delete anything left, and reinstall/repatch.

 

[Bede]

There probably is a python exception or something. Could you turn on logging so we can see what's going on?

It is a Vista security issue and I have a fix for it. DaV needs to tell me whether or not he has multiple user accounts then I can provide detailed directions for the fix.

I have also posted in the thread he referenced above

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=5737446&postcount=66

 

[da_Vinci]

It is a Vista security issue and I have a fix for it. DaV needs to tell me whether or not he has multiple user accounts then I can provide detailed directions for the fix.

I have also posted in the thread he referenced above

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=5737446&postcount=66

On closer look, not just the exit button in the option screen does not work, but the reset defaults button does not work either. I can change the option settings (check and uncheck boxes).

Are you referring to the fact that some folders live in C:\Program Files(x86)\Firaxis Games\Sid Meier's Civilization 4 and others live in Owner\Documents\My Games\Sid Meier's Civilization 4 ?

If so, I am curious as to why that never caused a problem with 1.61 or 2.08 and all of their mods, and does not cause a problem with unmodded 1.74 or 2.13? It only seems to cause a problem, at least for me, in the two new HOF mods, and the SGOTM 05 mod (which I assume is based on the HOF mod).

Anyway, only one user account (I have never set up any others) ... there is an owner folder and a public folder. It is Vista Ultimate, and I also run Norton Internet Security.

remconius says he fixed it with some series of reinstalls ... does that make sense? Maybe he had a different problem?

Anyway I do appreciate the help!

@ Denniz: I am using Vista Ultimate. I'll try to see if I can send you what you want. As I am somewhat of a "black box" user of technology, exactly what do you want me to "zip up" (you do mean compress, right?), what function in Vista will do that (I never have to create zipped files), and do I just attach it to a post?

dV

 

[Denniz]

It is a Vista security issue and I have a fix for it. DaV needs to tell me whether or not he has multiple user accounts then I can provide detailed directions for the fix.

I have also posted in the thread he referenced above

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=5737446&postcount=66

@Bede, could you share the instructions with us here, either or both, so others can benefit should it come up again?

 

[Denniz]

The HOF Mod has a SDK DLL which might explain the security angle.

@ Denniz: I am using Vista Ultimate. I'll try to see if I can send you what you want. As I am somewhat of a "black box" user of technology, exactly what do you want me to "zip up" (you do mean compress, right?), what function in Vista will do that (I never have to create zipped files), and do I just attach it to a post?

dV

I don't have Vista so I can't speak to it specifically. You can just attach the 3 files individually. That'll be easier.

 

[da_Vinci]

The HOF Mod has a SDK DLL which might explain the security angle.

I don't have Vista so I can't speak to it specifically. You can just attach the 3 files individually. That'll be easier.

Sounds good to me!

Additional efforts to no avail: Reinstall of HOF-1.74.001 no change. Delete folder, reinstall, no change. Delete folder, delete download, redownload and reinstall from fresh download: now the restore defaults button works in the games tab of options, but not in the HOF tabs.

Will try to generate the logs now.

dV

 

[Bede]

@Bede, could you share the instructions with us here, either or both, so others can benefit should it come up again?

That was the plan but I needed to know DaV's user set up before proceeding.

These insructions apply to Windows Vista.

For a single user machine the process is pretty straightforward as there is no need to implement file shares.

It goes like this

Right Click on the Firaxis Games directory in the C:\Program Files path and select the Properties option. In the first tab labeled "General" are two checkboxes at the bottom - one is labeled Read Only and should be greyed. Clear it so the check box is empty, then click the Apply button. A dialog box with two radio buttons will appear, select the all folders, all subfolders and all files button. Click okay and and

This will take a while as the machine processes all those files.

When that has finished in the same Properties dialog box click the security tab. In the scroll box labeled Group or user names you will find various names. Click on Users.

The scroll box at the bottom will show all Permissions assigned to the Users group for this set of files. If the permission do not include Full Control click the Edit button just above the scroll box. That opens another dialog box that allows you to change User Group permissions. Select the Users group in the upper scroll box and then check the Full Control check box in the lower scroll box. Click Apply. Get some more

You should be good to go.

For a Vista OS with multiple User accounts you also need to set up Sharing on the Firaxis Directory in the Program Files path, the Civilization 4 directory and the Mods directory and the HoF Mod directory.

 

[da_Vinci]

There is a python exception when I hit the exit key (not that I have the slightest idea what that means )

Screenshot of it, and the logs are attached.

Uh, which of the 11 logs do you want?

dV

 

[Denniz]

That was the plan but I needed to know DaV's user set up before proceeding.

These insructions apply to Windows Vista.

Thanks. Will they have to do this for each new HOF Mod? (at least for the new mod folder, etc.)

 

[da_Vinci]

@ Bede: Thanks for the advice. But I still don't get why this problem does not screw up unmodded 1.74 and 2.13, or any of the prior versions for that matter. Does that make any sense to you?

I'm going to see if Denniz has some quick fix for me, and if no, I will follow you protocol, including the naps!

dV

 

[Denniz]

There is a python exception when I hit the exit key (not that I have the slightest idea what that means )

Screenshot of it, and the logs are attached.

Uh, which of the 11 logs do you want?

dV

That's good enough, thanks.

The screen print says it all:

IOError: [Errno 13] Permission denied: "C:\\Program Files (x86)\\Firaxis Games\\Sid Meier's Civilization 4\\Mods\\HOF-1.74.001\\HOF-1.74.001.ini"​

It is failing when it trys to access the HOF ini file for read/write so it never gets around to painting the rest of the form. You need to follow Bede's instructions in the post above.

Oh, make sure you turn the logging off. It can react badly with some virus scanners and slow your game down.

 

[Bede]

Thanks. Will they have to do this for each new HOF Mod? (at least for the new mod folder, etc.)

As long as the user permissions on the Program Files\Firaxis Games root directory don't change I don't think so.

 

[Denniz]

@ Bede: Thanks for the advice. But I still don't get why this problem does not screw up unmodded 1.74 and 2.13, or any of the prior versions for that matter. Does that make any sense to you?

I'm going to see if Denniz has some quick fix for me, and if no, I will follow you protocol, including the naps!

dV

The is probably a reasonable explanation that involves order of things installed, whether the folders were deleted, etc. Trying to find out will either make someone a expert on Vista's security or insane.

Since I don't have Vista, I am not going to second guess someone who seems to know what they're is talking about. His instructions make sense and seem safe enough. I recommend you try what he says.

Thanks, Bede.

 

[da_Vinci]

That's good enough, thanks.

The screen print says it all:

IOError: [Errno 13] Permission denied: "C:\\Program Files (x86)\\Firaxis Games\\Sid Meier's Civilization 4\\Mods\\HOF-1.74.001\\HOF-1.74.001.ini"​

It is failing when it trys to access the HOF ini file for read/write so it never gets around to painting the rest of the form. You need to follow Bede's instructions in the post above.

Oh, make sure you turn the logging off. It can react badly with some virus scanners and slow your game down.

What I don't get is why, if it is a file access permission issue in Vista, it does not happen in unmodded 1.74 or 2.13, and why it never happend in the two latest vanilla and warlords HOF mods, which I also ran on this machine.

Seem to me like the old HOF mods kept Vista happy, so don't we need to ask, what might be different about the new HOF mods?

Just trying to make this make sense, besides getting the fix. Like when Gyathaar explained that vista has directX9 and directX10 and needed the latest 9 (since 10 won't do ... who knew?), that solved the mystery.

In the long run, if there is a feature of the latest HOF mods that is Vista unfriendly, we ought to fix it if we can in future mods, as Vista will only become more common, and this issue will recurr in perpetuity.

Cross Post Addendum: If there is no HOF difference, and it is some sequence of install issue (which explains how remconius might luck into a fix, at least this time), then I guess we just apply the Bede fix and be happy we have that!

dV

 

[Denniz]

What I don't get is why, if it is a file access permission issue in Vista, it does not happen in unmodded 1.74 or 2.13, and why it never happend in the two latest vanilla and warlords HOF mods, which I also ran on this machine.

Seem to me like the old HOF mods kept Vista happy, so don't we need to ask, what might be different about the new HOF mods?

Just trying to make this make sense, besides getting the fix. Like when Gyathaar explained that vista has directX9 and directX10 and needed the latest 9 (since 10 won't do ... who knew?), that solved the mystery.

In the long run, if there is a feature of the latest HOF mods that is Vista unfriendly, we ought to fix it if we can in future mods, as Vista will only become more common, and this issue will recurr in perpetuity.

Cross Post Addendum: If there is no HOF difference, and it is some sequence of install issue (which explains how remconius might luck into a fix, at least this time), then I guess we just apply the Bede fix and be happy we have that!

dV

I understand your concern but this is going to take time to fully understand.

It seems to involve default security settings on folders/files in Vista. The fact that something as simple as the python code failing on the open of the HOF ini file for read/write tells me that it is a basic security setup issue. Nothing mysterious or sinister about that. Based on what Bede was saying, your Civ 4 path or maybe just the HOF Mod folder is set to read-only for the programs involved.

There are a lot of installs and patches involved. One of them might be setting permissions differently. The start point, order and/or method of installing might have something to do with it. For example, there are at least three different ways to patch 1.61 to 1.74 (advanced options, manually, or by installing BTS). One of those methods may be setting the security different. Starting with the folder already there vs. not could be the thing that made the difference. There are a lot of combinations.

I know Dianthus has a copy of Vista, so we will look into it. I may need to upgrade the install software to set the Vista permissions. In the end, Bede's instructions are may be the best way out of this for now.

 

[Bede]

The is probably a reasonable explanation that involves order of things installed, whether the folders were deleted, etc. Trying to find out will either make someone a expert on Vista's security or insane.

Since I don't have Vista, I am not going to second guess someone who seems to know what they're is talking about. His instructions make sense and seem safe enough. I recommend you try what he says.

Thanks, Bede.

I had noticed this behavior earlier with other mods but hadn't much thought about it. There is something very hinky, however, going on with the 2.13 and 1.74 patches as I have had an absolute nightmare trying to set up a dual install. At one point the patches refused to recognize the presence of the core game.

Something very similar happens with ainwood's CA2 utility and Civ3 under Vista, BTW. The solution is similar but simpler (just run both programs with administrative privileges), probably because CA2 uses the .Net framework to perform its magic.

I must already meet Denniz's second qualifier as I certainly am no expert.

 

[da_Vinci]

I understand your concern but this is going to take time to fully understand.

It seems to involve default security settings on folders/files in Vista. The fact that something as simple as the python code failing on the open of the HOF ini file for read/write tells me that it is a basic security setup issue. Nothing mysterious or sinister about that. Based on what Bede was saying, your Civ 4 path or maybe just the HOF Mod folder is set to read-only for the programs involved.

There are a lot of installs and patches involved. One of them might be setting permissions differently. The start point, order and/or method of installing might have something to do with it. For example, there are at least three different ways to patch 1.61 to 1.74 (advanced options, manually, or by installing BTS). One of those methods may be setting the security different. Starting with the folder already there vs. not could be the thing that made the difference. There are a lot of combinations.

I know Dianthus has a copy of Vista, so we will look into it. I may need to upgrade the install software to set the Vista permissions. In the end, Bede's instructions are may be the best way out of this for now.

I'm happy to use his solution now. And I'm not trying to be a pain, just trying to find the best long-term solution and learn something along the way.

I have looked at the properties of the 1.74.001 mod ini file, and also at the 1.16.011 (the latest for 1.61 IIRC) in the 1.74 install, and the one in the old 1.61 install of my dual install, the settings for all are the same, (regarding full control, modify, read & execute, read, write which system and admin have ... users have just r&e and read) yet one works (or I should say used to) and one doesn't. Parent folder properties are the same too.

1.61.011 mod on the old 1.61 install works fine. 1.61.011 mod will load on the 1.74 install, but hangs on the options exit. 1.74.001 mod on the 1.74 install hang on the options exit. It seems as if the 1.74 install needs a different permission on the folder than the previous 1.61 install of the game.

So maybe the HOF mod is not different, but 1.74 talks to it in a different way, that needs different permissions than Vista defaults to. So the mod, while not different, behaves differently in Vista (but not XP), because the new 1.74 version wants something different from it?

So the long term solution is to figure out what change to the HOF mod will make 1.74 happier. Short term, thank you Bede!

dV