How do archers shoot?

[Salamandre]

Yeah as it says. I have no option to shoot so when I click on enemy unit, my archer attacks as a warrior and always die. Please

 

[lymond]

In unmodded Civ IV archers melee attack. However, it should be noted that archery type units get first strikes. First strikes essentially are free rounds of attacks based on the number of first strikes (Drill promotion line adds first strikes as well.) You don't see first strikes, they are just in the combat algorithms, and although they basically give those units a little bonus it's not all that much. But it is additive.

Some mods exists that give archery units and siege units range combat...that is, you attack a tile from a distance causing collateral damage with no harm to the attacking unit. I know Fall from Heaven has it, as do some of the larger kitchen sink modpacks. I believe there is a "mod component" as well that can be installed to work with the base game, but I've never used it. (I do recommend learning how to play IV normally though..it is a great game)

Just note that if you are playing regular BTS, archery units have some uses - like mainly early barb defense in emergency - but are not good units on the offensive. I rarely tech archery (it is a dead end tech) myself except if needed for Horse Archers.

I suspect you are coming from V and are quite new to the game. Combat is very different in IV and there is no ranged units until you get to air units like airships.

 

[Salamandre]

Thanks, you nailed it, I played a lot civ5 lately so I was expecting something similar in archery mechanics. What it bothers me is that the archer is moving to the attacked tile, that doesn't make much sense.

 

[lymond]

Well, it does in this game since, as I mentioned, archers are essentially melee units. The "range" aspect essentially simulated in the innate bonuses they get.

Also, IV is not 1upt like 5, it is basically stack warfare. Range is more effective/applicable to the 1upt scenario which also has the zone of control - IV does not.

So basically when playing IV you have to totally rethink combat.

Experience with the game of V is basically no preparation for this game in almost every respect, and IV is much deeper.

 

[elmurcis]

1 tile is ~32 x 32 km big in civ IV if I'm correct (its show 1000 square km). Even if you would have best Longbows of the world, how far they could shoot with good accuracy? 200 m? So until Cannons, Artillery, Destroyers/Battleships, Guided Missiles etc. its more precise how it is Archers get 1st shot (in real battle) but most times they would need to "run, run, run" to survive versus most of regular melee
And welcome to Civ IV world

 

[Live trash can]

Archers are nice! Aren't they?

 

[Lennier]

They beat warriors, but not much else.

 

[Live trash can]

As a defence unit, they are certainly formidable!

I mean city defence of course

 

[vincentz]

1 tile is ~32 x 32 km big in civ IV if I'm correct (its show 1000 square km).

It really depends on the Map size doesn't it And sizes (and time) doesn't really make any sense in Civ. F.ex. as the turn step goes from 10 year/turn to 5 year/ turn, but the units move the same distance. Did they suddenly find a new and VERY efficient way of traveling, and its not even part of a scientific discovery

But regarding archers, could'nt they just stand on the edge of one tile and shoot into the neighbor tile?
OTOH what about rifles? Wouldn't they too needed to be ranged (in CIV V)?

TBH the worst (IMHO) about civ IV is the Suicide Sieges. THAT doesn't make any sense whatsoever.
The archers should have been some sort of a support troop instead of a direct attacker, and the sieges should (again IMHO) have been ranged.
The later I did in my mod, where catapults, trebs and bombards are range one (along with Frigates, Iron Frigates and a few other ships), cannons (and some ships) are range 2 and artillery, mobile artillery, battleships, missile artillery are range 3. Besides that a siege unit in a city (fortification) will get +1 in range. However, the sieges can return fire from a ranged attack, to level out the advantage.

 

[Fippy]

Archers are a last option unit usually, fogbusting warriors (to prevent barbs spawning) often are cheaper and more efficient.
If you need better units early, copper for Axes works better with bronze working also being such a good tech.
Try looking into all other options first before sitting archers in your cities Want to avoid getting into positions where something attacks them.

 

[Pangaea]

Hill Archers can certainly be brutal. As for the combat, I'd much rather have the combat in Civ 4, even with suicidal siege, than a video game version of this.

 

[Live trash can]

Archer is my hero!

 

[vincentz]

Hill Archers can certainly be brutal. As for the combat, I'd much rather have the combat in Civ 4, even with suicidal siege, than a video game version of this.

I completely agree. There is a reason why I'm still in this forum, playing this game
However, it saddens me that the devs at V + VI didnt figure out a way of making combat more interesting, without either the stack of doom or carpet of doom. I believe the solution is out there

 

[rah]

Yeah, it's called armies.

 

[Live trash can]

Because of my mental condition I have not played Civ as much as I have wanted to. I been playing maybe 8 or 10 runs at Civ4 and a little more on Civ3. I play on Monarch or the one below.

SPOILER about the stack of doom (could not find spoiler function in edit!):
I think that is why I haven't run into the Stack of Doom very much. I can only remember having encountered it once. When it took over one of my cities. And I then gave up the game. The other games I have not been able to complete, and I have a tendency to quit playing when I reach gunpowder.

But I believe the Stack of Doom is a kind of fun challenge. I am expecting to enconter it on my Monarch games. And have to prepare a defence for it; or prehaps pre-empt it somehow.

 

[Winth]

Hey Salamandre, you're a mapmaking legend. And as for the "Archer" confusion, I think it's easiest to just put the whole situation into entirely abstract terms - you have a unit with 3 attack vs an unit with 2 attack.

As for SoD, I think that SoD is mostly alleviated in multiplayer where people actually have incentive to divide up their stacks to make sure you aren't just countered by suicide catas.