How not to lose the tech race?
- Thread starter Kolyana
- Start date
I was going to write a separate wha post (as in, boo hoo). I really suck at this game, I've played 3x on warlord level and lost 2/3; tech race, to peaceful civs. Once I was very peaceful with 4-6 well developed cities. The other times I was a conqueror, Ghandi got it. Anyway, I have no clues, but I would imagine building libraries etc as soon as possible would help. Seems like the usual conquest mode is very difficult to win, since taking each city takes alot of planning and several rounds of siege, not to mention you can only move one square per turn in enemy territory.
Marcus_Aurelius
The True Emporer
It's frustrating for me, I generally go for Libraries and Universities etc. very early but still can't get far enough ahead to have an early space ship win or a good lead in military tech. I guess the way to really get ahead would be to approach it like a cultural game, where you have dedicate all of your great people and wonders to producing, in this case, science and nothing else. I think the AI has a tendency to overpopulate it's cities, so it makes alot of great people. Maybe that is why they always seem to be ahead.
FriendlyFire
Codex WMDicanious
Get alpahbet earlier and trade tech aggressively
HeadBlend
Chieftain
Also, manage the ecomony. Build courthouses in cities far from the capital. Use specialists in high food production cities and keep trading.
Canuck Bill
Chieftain
- Joined
- Oct 7, 2005
- Messages
- 51
High $'s = more beakers. Make sure the cities you are building science improvements are high in commerce. The use of specialists is important as well. Golden Ages can help with the extra cash and I find using a GP in early to middle ages to rush a tech can help. Some National Wonders can help. Ensure you plan where to place them.
Alphabet can help too though I have not had too much trouble staying even or ahead but I am just a NOOBLE so far and have almost finished my second game (which I will handily win with many victory choices available - not culture though). I find I do not receive much for my techs and have hoarded most of them to the ire of other civs.
Alphabet can help too though I have not had too much trouble staying even or ahead but I am just a NOOBLE so far and have almost finished my second game (which I will handily win with many victory choices available - not culture though). I find I do not receive much for my techs and have hoarded most of them to the ire of other civs.
HeadBlend
Chieftain
Canuck Bill said:
Personally, I avoid using a GP for rushing a tech. I seem to get them when I can research in 4-6 turns, so it just seems to be a waste - I'd rather have the academy, great work or Wonder rush - possibly even a GA!
Still my game play is changing as I learn more - next month, I'd play it different again....
I played on Noble. This is a strategy I used when I am behind in tech. If they don't want to trade with you, FORCE them to give it to you.
1. wage war on someone near you (who is way above in tech).
2. Pillage all their resources, surround his cities if you are too weak to take them.
3. If his troops come after you and your combat odds are low, move slowly back to ur city (the troops will chase you just make sure they are one tile behind you ). That means you can destroy them based on ur strong home defense easily if you reach home before they attack.
4. After a couple more rounds when the AI proposes peace, get the max no of techs you want from him. Be aggressive very aggressive in negoitating. Keep negoitating till he gives you everything you want. You just have to keep clicking the option of "Are you ageeable?" (cant rem the exact line).
5. Go on peace 10 rounds. Build ur army again. Wage war again. begin the whole process again.
6. not only does this cripple the damn civ, it gives you free tech. if they are afraid of you, you can even demand tribute as and when which is what I do as well.
7. That's how I moved myself up in the tech race on Noble. It actually works very well even if you have a small military but you need to make sure the units are efficient.
1. wage war on someone near you (who is way above in tech).
2. Pillage all their resources, surround his cities if you are too weak to take them.
3. If his troops come after you and your combat odds are low, move slowly back to ur city (the troops will chase you just make sure they are one tile behind you ). That means you can destroy them based on ur strong home defense easily if you reach home before they attack.
4. After a couple more rounds when the AI proposes peace, get the max no of techs you want from him. Be aggressive very aggressive in negoitating. Keep negoitating till he gives you everything you want. You just have to keep clicking the option of "Are you ageeable?" (cant rem the exact line).
5. Go on peace 10 rounds. Build ur army again. Wage war again. begin the whole process again.
6. not only does this cripple the damn civ, it gives you free tech. if they are afraid of you, you can even demand tribute as and when which is what I do as well.
7. That's how I moved myself up in the tech race on Noble. It actually works very well even if you have a small military but you need to make sure the units are efficient.
Simple, military conquest. I played a world map with 18 civ all in corrected position. I played england and by 500 AD, I control all of western and eastern europe. Now I'm on a verge to spread out my 8 legion(15 infantry each, 3 canon) to take over the rest of india, china and the arabs persian nations. I should be able to finish the game by 1100 ad imo. I'm almost on modern era. THe more land, cities you control, the more technology you can research!!
corruptionsucks
Chieftain
- Joined
- Sep 10, 2003
- Messages
- 23
I'm playing with the new patch 1.09 on monarch, and the tactic of waging war, then demanding technology for peace doesn't work like it used to.
I was behind in technology, waged war, took 2 of China's cities, he only had one left, a 2 pop. city. I sued for peace, but he refused to give up any technology, even though he was on his deathbed.
Now, though I'm am the largest and biggest civ, with the highest score, I'm at least 10 technologies down. I will still wage war to keep my opponents honest, but I'm curious if I'll ever catch up. Fighting knights with war elephants is doable, but if this keeps up, I'll be fighting tanks with calvary.
I was behind in technology, waged war, took 2 of China's cities, he only had one left, a 2 pop. city. I sued for peace, but he refused to give up any technology, even though he was on his deathbed.
Now, though I'm am the largest and biggest civ, with the highest score, I'm at least 10 technologies down. I will still wage war to keep my opponents honest, but I'm curious if I'll ever catch up. Fighting knights with war elephants is doable, but if this keeps up, I'll be fighting tanks with calvary.
Pvblivs
Scriptor
Always care that you research different technologies then your strongest opponents. If you try to discover the same as they being behind you simply loose because they trade techs among each other with you falling behind more and more having nothing valuable to trade. So it is important to go for an alternative tech path if you know what the others <can> research.
When I discovered Alphabet (first) in my Prince game, I could dial up all of my opponents, give them some techs and take all. That's the scheme. If you know your opponents go for Education first, go for Chemistry and trade it.
Question: How do you know, what they go for? Good question, I have got no answer but: experience.
Ok, one answer I do have: if they have no Mysticism they can not go for Monotheism. How do you know they have no Mysticism? You can trade it to them. So they do not have it? Go for Theology and you have a valuable tech.
I know you will never be capable of trading Mysticism. But I had no better example at work here.
Simply look at your tech tree! Do not just research what you think could be valuable for you - research what is valuable for trading to the others too.
That works if you are diligent enough to study what your opponent is up to...
So the simple answer is: Trade is the key!
When I discovered Alphabet (first) in my Prince game, I could dial up all of my opponents, give them some techs and take all. That's the scheme. If you know your opponents go for Education first, go for Chemistry and trade it.
Question: How do you know, what they go for? Good question, I have got no answer but: experience.
Ok, one answer I do have: if they have no Mysticism they can not go for Monotheism. How do you know they have no Mysticism? You can trade it to them. So they do not have it? Go for Theology and you have a valuable tech.I know you will never be capable of trading Mysticism. But I had no better example at work here.
Simply look at your tech tree! Do not just research what you think could be valuable for you - research what is valuable for trading to the others too.That works if you are diligent enough to study what your opponent is up to...
Kolyana said:
So the simple answer is: Trade is the key!
Lullaby
peaceful builder
Rushing techs ist a great thing for a great person if there is nothing else to do, like for a great prophet that has no wonder to rush. In late game you usually don't get enough from a gp if you do anything but rushing a tech.
Another thing would be to raise you income to the max. Build many cottages, develop them quickly and use the right civics to get most from them. Or found many religions, build the shrines and spread belief like mad. I was able to get +100 gpt even when researching at 90%.
Also do check your trade possibilities every turn after someone gets alphabet. Don't research or trade for techs you don't need (drama and music for example).
Another thing would be to raise you income to the max. Build many cottages, develop them quickly and use the right civics to get most from them. Or found many religions, build the shrines and spread belief like mad. I was able to get +100 gpt even when researching at 90%.
Also do check your trade possibilities every turn after someone gets alphabet. Don't research or trade for techs you don't need (drama and music for example).
Easiest way? Turn off tech trading.
This will change the entire game scope. It will give Militaristic leaders aiming for war techs more advantage and less tolerance for those culture-loving-flower-picking-carebears like Gandhi.
Slows down the game a bit but you will see how weak the AI is without tech-trading. It's all down to you and your gamble. As long as it isn't higher difficulty, you've got an even chance to win big by going military first, secure land, R&D more war toys and unleash them on those culture-hippies.
This will change the entire game scope. It will give Militaristic leaders aiming for war techs more advantage and less tolerance for those culture-loving-flower-picking-carebears like Gandhi.
Slows down the game a bit but you will see how weak the AI is without tech-trading. It's all down to you and your gamble. As long as it isn't higher difficulty, you've got an even chance to win big by going military first, secure land, R&D more war toys and unleash them on those culture-hippies.
remconius
Deity
Check my signature on specializing cities. Build several commerce cities to pay for maintenance.
By the way the gimme all for peace "negotiations" strategy was a bug. And has been fixed, thankfully.
By the way the gimme all for peace "negotiations" strategy was a bug. And has been fixed, thankfully.
Pvblivs said:
In my last few games, particularly the one I';m playign now, I can see that aggressive trading it fundamnetal ... if you have a resource spare, trade it. It's quite possible to obtain a whole heap of cash per turn this way and boost happiness and health across the entire empire ... so this was good advice
remconius said:
I'm going to check that out right now, but actually comes back to something I was going to add to this thread today. I took some screenshots from last night's game and I want to know how people interpret these cities ... what would YOU build? What potential do you see here? How do you view these cities?
corruptionsucks
Chieftain
- Joined
- Sep 10, 2003
- Messages
- 23
Continuation of my game:
I'm down at least 10 technologies, much better than before when I was down at least 20. The exploit where you could get techs for peace has been eliminated. So unless I take down my nearest foes, I'll never catch them in techs.
I've noticed that the other civs don't research military tradition, so that's my one ace in the hole for trading purposes. However, I need to keep my monopoly on miltrad so I can have a decent chance at war.
I'm at 40% territory and population, and about 600 points up on my nearest competitor. However, to keep them from winning the space race, I have to go to war, cavs against infantry. It's going to get ugly...
I'm down at least 10 technologies, much better than before when I was down at least 20. The exploit where you could get techs for peace has been eliminated. So unless I take down my nearest foes, I'll never catch them in techs.
I've noticed that the other civs don't research military tradition, so that's my one ace in the hole for trading purposes. However, I need to keep my monopoly on miltrad so I can have a decent chance at war.
I'm at 40% territory and population, and about 600 points up on my nearest competitor. However, to keep them from winning the space race, I have to go to war, cavs against infantry. It's going to get ugly...
Persepolis: Great People factory. Farm those floodplains and grasslands. Get mines on the hills for when you need production and get start producing great people.
Susa: Science city. A really, really, really good science city.
Arbela: Conscription center. Get a barracks then pump out units.
The rest I would have pretty much balanced.
Susa: Science city. A really, really, really good science city.
Arbela: Conscription center. Get a barracks then pump out units.
The rest I would have pretty much balanced.
Harry Haller
Warlord
- Joined
- Oct 24, 2005
- Messages
- 123
To the other good advice here, I would add that it sometimes requires some management of your relationships with other civs to stay ahead in tech. Someone may have a tech that you want but they won't trade it with you because they don't like your religion or civics. If you are "spiritual" you can switch religion or civics for a turn without any anarchy and see if that opens up any trades.
Another thing to do is to try to get the computer players to go to war with each other. It's not always an option, but sometimes you can get a couple of the lower ranked CPs to go to war with the leader, which will shift everyone's production away from city improvement and to military production. You can also declare war on them yourself if you are comfortably far away, to keep them busy building units. I have rarely had any luck getting them to give you techs after the conclusion of wars, but they will sometimes. But the damage you do to your economy with war wearniness may not be worth it.
Always develop spare luxuries and resources and keep trying to find someone to trade them with. I think printing press gives you extra commerce from towns, and other civics like free religion also boost your technology. Windmills boost commerce at the cost of some production from hills.
You don't need a lot of cities to generate beakers, you just need cities that are founded in the right places and have the right development. If you use F1 to look at the beaker production of all of your cities, you might find that most of your beakers are being produced by only 2 or 3 cities. As an experiment, I played 2 games using China on the Earth map (exact same starting point and surrounding civs). In one I expanded as much as possible and captured a lot of cities; in the other, I focused on building up my empire, spreading my religion, and optimizing my luxuries, resources, improvements, great people, and trade. I wound up researching modern techs like physics and biology about 100 years faster with the builder strategy than with the expansion strategy, and won the space race against Frederick, who had a big empire and a lot of science production. In the expansion strategy I was building a lot of units, which take production time and cost money to support. In the builder strategy I was spending a lot of time with my cities producing research. I have to say, though, that the expansion strategy was more fun.
Another thing to do is to try to get the computer players to go to war with each other. It's not always an option, but sometimes you can get a couple of the lower ranked CPs to go to war with the leader, which will shift everyone's production away from city improvement and to military production. You can also declare war on them yourself if you are comfortably far away, to keep them busy building units. I have rarely had any luck getting them to give you techs after the conclusion of wars, but they will sometimes. But the damage you do to your economy with war wearniness may not be worth it.
Always develop spare luxuries and resources and keep trying to find someone to trade them with. I think printing press gives you extra commerce from towns, and other civics like free religion also boost your technology. Windmills boost commerce at the cost of some production from hills.
You don't need a lot of cities to generate beakers, you just need cities that are founded in the right places and have the right development. If you use F1 to look at the beaker production of all of your cities, you might find that most of your beakers are being produced by only 2 or 3 cities. As an experiment, I played 2 games using China on the Earth map (exact same starting point and surrounding civs). In one I expanded as much as possible and captured a lot of cities; in the other, I focused on building up my empire, spreading my religion, and optimizing my luxuries, resources, improvements, great people, and trade. I wound up researching modern techs like physics and biology about 100 years faster with the builder strategy than with the expansion strategy, and won the space race against Frederick, who had a big empire and a lot of science production. In the expansion strategy I was building a lot of units, which take production time and cost money to support. In the builder strategy I was spending a lot of time with my cities producing research. I have to say, though, that the expansion strategy was more fun.
