Civ6 visually independent (ie separated from the center) districts have bothered me from the start, I like how HK screenshots show cities really sprawling outward.
Humankind Game by Amplitude
- Thread starter AtlantisAuthor
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Boris Gudenuf
Deity
From the screenshots so far, Humankind appears to differentiate the various kinds of Districts/Quarters with just one building or 'center' while the rest of the district is more generic buildings appropriate to the Era (that clue comes from the latest 'trailer' which shows much larger, Industrial Era looking apartment buildings in the city as opposed to the thatched huts and smaller buildings in earlier shots). Whether that makes it difficult to tell exactly what kinds of districts you have is still to be seen, but it results in a much more 'organic' sprawl to the city, without changing the in-game effects of the districts: I would assume you could still add 'bonus' structures within the district as in Civ VI, while still keeping the 'background' of generalized smaller buildings to blend into the neighboring tiles.
I will be interested in seeing how flexible Humankind's 'districts' are: can we 'rebuild', say, an Industrial/Production district into a residential or science-producing district later? (I'm thinking of the old industrial lofts and buildings in New York City that I remember from the 1970s, which were being repurposed as residential and retail spaces).
I don't mind it based on how they originally described districts (i.e. satellite cities), and the fact that I generally build cities like how sprawl works in real life, but I really do love the Endless model of districts so much. I like playing Endless Legend just to build cities the way they are built.
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Harappans
https://twitter.com/humankindgame/status/1207042833712132098?s=19
Emblematic unit: Runners
Emblematic Quarter: Canal Network
Description: Agrarian
https://twitter.com/humankindgame/status/1207042833712132098?s=19
Emblematic unit: Runners
Emblematic Quarter: Canal Network
Description: Agrarian
SupremacyKing2
Deity
Interesting. I wish we had traits on the Runner unit. The description says that the Harappans preferred peaceful pursuits instead of war, so is the Runner unit a civilian unit and not a military unit?
Canal Network is interesting too. I wonder what exactly does it do. Does it add food to your city?
The Runner seems to have a small sword, so I wonder if it's a scout/light infantry hybrid type
Boris Gudenuf
Deity
I don't think there's any evidence for transportation canals that early (the earliest I know of was a 'canal' around the rapids on the Nile in Egypt from about 1900 BCE, which is at east 500 years after the 'Harappans' and about 2000 km distant from them) but the Indus Valley Civilization that Harappa was part of did practice pretty extensive irrigation, so my bet is on some kind of Bonus to Food Production.
Making the possibly rash assumption that Amplitude is going to stick somewhat to their pattern in their previous Endless Legend game, Humankind will probably have a relatively few Core Requirements, like Food, Production, Science. EL had 'dust' which was an obvious Analog for Gold in Civ, so something similar is also reasonable.
Using that framework, it would make sense that many of the Emblematic buildings or districts would be related to a Core requirement or function, and having the Harappans have a Food Production bonus makes sense: they were early intensive agriculturalists, had large cities for their day, and managed the water through irrigation and internal water use (had some of the first indoor plumbing anywhere!).
They also had extensive trade networks - contact with the Near East and Central Asia, for instance, which might mean that the 'Runner' is some kind of non-military or semi-military unit that allows you to set up a Trade Route with some other entity more easily than anyone else in the early game - like 'Runners' being able to establish physical or diplomatic contact with someone to start negotiating a trade route . . .
acluewithout
Deity
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Canals as base content. For real.
That’s all I came to say.
That’s all I came to say.
conorbebe
King
I'm pretty sure canals in this case refer to irrigation rather than ship transportation. The people of the Indus River were the first to irrigate their cities in this way.
I am somewhat perplexed by this "Runner" however. A unique civilian unit or trader would have fit better in my opinion, but then again we still have no idea if civilian units are even present in Humankind.
I am somewhat perplexed by this "Runner" however. A unique civilian unit or trader would have fit better in my opinion, but then again we still have no idea if civilian units are even present in Humankind.
Morningcalm
Keeper of Records
Interesting Vice article that discusses Civilization VI and Humankind in the context of progress, colonialism, and other such controversies:
https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/4aggzm/civilization-and-strategy-games-progress-delusion
Notably, it criticizes Civilization VI's inclusion of the Cree:
The Vice article author also sees Humankind as less offensive because of the way the game is structured:
I have not yet decided if the Vice author makes some good (albeit vague) points or is making a mountain of a molehill, with insufficient in-game evidence to back up his points. In particular, the Vice author doesn't seem to take note of Gathering Storm's ways of showing certain types of "progress" (i.e. industrialization) to be harmful, in the form of mechanics around climate change, disasters, etc.
https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/4aggzm/civilization-and-strategy-games-progress-delusion
Notably, it criticizes Civilization VI's inclusion of the Cree:
The Vice article author also sees Humankind as less offensive because of the way the game is structured:
I have not yet decided if the Vice author makes some good (albeit vague) points or is making a mountain of a molehill, with insufficient in-game evidence to back up his points. In particular, the Vice author doesn't seem to take note of Gathering Storm's ways of showing certain types of "progress" (i.e. industrialization) to be harmful, in the form of mechanics around climate change, disasters, etc.
The thing about the Cree? I can see it, though my view is coming as a White British person is obviously not particularly of value. For me, I think it's an educational thing but also a limitation of the game. There are conflict-free ways to achieve victory (Diplomacy, Science, Culture, possibly even Religion), but the game does have a huge focus on conflict. That's part of the genre, but also part of human nature. Firaxis not consulting (as far as we know) with the Cree people is an issue, and one I hope they rectify in future. I wouldn't be surprised if they did the same with Kupe, and they turned him basically into a meme-machine (choice!). We know the composers have consulted with people of various nations, such as the Mongolians, but it needs to be a company-wide thing. If you're representing other cultures, they need to be done with tact and sensitivity. It also shows, IMHO, that Civ does need to expand its range of victory types and playstyles. The game does get very homogenous, but there's only so much that can be done with the tech and civics trees. I don't think we have a Civ that is anything like Austria or Venice from V in VI, which is a shame.
No matter what you do, I think there will be some people who aren't happy with the choices made. That's fine, and inevitable, but you need to reach out to these people. It needs to be part of the research, and it's their history. They should have a say in how it's represented. I would be interested to see if there's views on the other side, i.e. Cree people who support the inclusion and portrayal of Poundmaker.
No matter what you do, I think there will be some people who aren't happy with the choices made. That's fine, and inevitable, but you need to reach out to these people. It needs to be part of the research, and it's their history. They should have a say in how it's represented. I would be interested to see if there's views on the other side, i.e. Cree people who support the inclusion and portrayal of Poundmaker.
SupremacyKing2
Deity
Honestly, all the civs in civ6 are going to be inaccurate to some degree. After all, there is no way you are going to accurately capture an entire civilization with just one leader, a few game bonuses and a special unit or special district. I think Firaxis has acknowledged that they have to pick one particular aspect of the civ to focus on because it is not possible to include everything the civ was known for in the game. The only difference with the Kree is that they are still around and have leaders who decided to be speak up. Most of the civs in the game are either extinct at this point and therefore have nobody to speak for them or the contemporary civs don't really care about making a big deal about it.
King William I
King
I would like to point out that the singers on the Cree themes are Poundmakers descendants. If the inclusion was offensive, they would have said something.
Also lets not forget the Pueblo incident for Civ V. I doubt they'd put in any work without checking to see if it's okay or not because who wants to redo weeks of work?
Also lets not forget the Pueblo incident for Civ V. I doubt they'd put in any work without checking to see if it's okay or not because who wants to redo weeks of work?
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To me the Harappans represent one of the greatest potentials that HK has and highlights one of the Civ series' greatest flaws; HK can represent cultures where leaders have been lost to history. Civ requires a historical, or at least mythical leader for a culture to be represented.
SupremacyKing2
Deity
Good point. It has been said that the civ franchise has helped educate people about history or at least create a renewed interest in history. HK has the ability to do this as well. Honestly, I had not even heard of the Harappans until now. So HK is already teaching me something new about history and past civilizations.
FinalDoomsday
Prince
Not afraid to admit I had no idea who the Harrapans were until now either. I'm still thinking the Runner will be a combat unit but probably not a good one just strong enough to fend off wild animals. It will probably be a high movement unit so you can start revealing the map quickly and meeting other civs. Funnily enough I could see them being a good pick for a warmonger who wants to find their targets first before transitioning into a warrior civ in the next era!
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conorbebe
King
I've wanted to see the Harappans in Civ since I first heard about them a few years ago. Along with Egypt and Sumer, they were the first of the major civilisations to arise in human history. They were competent city builders, with evidence having been found of walls, irrigation systems, communal baths, and elevated areas to distinguish between upper and lower classes. They were also known to trade goods such as lapis lazuli with neighbouring cities and Mesopotamia. I have no doubt the only reason they have not been officially included in Civ to date is because we know of no leaders to represent them, in part due to their writing system still being undeciphered.
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