I found a gem from the past

[insaneweasel]

The IGN guide for Civ 4.
http://au.guides.ign.com/guides/896712/page_20.html


For all the new players out there who weren't around when this was first written, the guide is pure gold when it comes to comically bad advice.

The guy makes some horrible statements with regards to nearly everything, including:

-"Creative is the single-most powerful attribute, as it allows cities to expand their borders without any upgrades, which leads to research, which leads to powerful units, which leads to a military blitz like you've never seen."

-The Holy Roman UU is awesome

-Slavery is bad.

-Specialists are overrated.

Now, just so you don't think I'm an ass, I don't have any problem with people being noobs. I was a noob once, and so was everyone else. I also have no problem with people writing guides. However, if a noob writes a guide, then something is wrong.

He gives a sample match:
http://au.guides.ign.com/guides/896712/page_12.html

Some of the things he does on this noble game:

-Starts as Zara, and goes for ALL THREE of the early religions (gets two)

-Builds a stele in his capital

-Builds a stele in another city (as creative Zara) while he is a few turns away from stonehenge in the capital

He loses. But at least he had the balls to show it. However, he blamed it on ONE mistake.

It makes for good humor. And for the noobs, a lesson in what NOT to do.

 

[Dragonxander PR]

You might want to change "And for the noobs, a lesson in what NOT to do." to size 7, & change "NOT" to bold, italic, underlined & with some bright color.

 

[Ataxerxes]

Ah, yes, the famous IGN article. It's been justly maligned many times in the forum. This is probably the most famous article referenced in CivFanatics. Comically bad.

 

[insaneweasel]

Ah, yes, the famous IGN article. It's been justly maligned many times in the forum. This is probably the most famous article referenced in CivFanatics. Comically bad.

Is there any place I can see the old posts? Maybe they have it in polycast?

 

[mariogreymist]

"The former USSR, the United States, China... these three countries have generally been the world leader of power at some point or another in the last two millennia,"

Wow...apparently their ignorance goes deeper than TBS gaming.

 

[TheWilltoAct]

Is there any place I can see the old posts? Maybe they have it in polycast?

This isn't quite what you had in mind but here's a thread that sidetracks into a discussion on bad online guides and how they deceive new players.

Here's the thread: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=356642

Here's a post from that thread on your topic: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=8988000&postcount=54

And here's another silly guide I found back then, for general amusement: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=8981673&postcount=30

 

[insaneweasel]

This isn't quite what you had in mind but here's a thread that sidetracks into a discussion on bad online guides and how they deceive new players.

Here's the thread: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=356642

Here's a post from that thread on your topic: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=8988000&postcount=54

And here's another silly guide I found back then, for general amusement: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=8981673&postcount=30

Thanks

 

[Gamma]

"The Incans and Zulus are the weakest two civilizations in the game, and because of Huayna Capac's attributes, the Incans are easily the worse of the two. Although the combination theoretically gives the Incans a good economy, they won't be able to take enough land to suck in the resources and churn out enough money to offset their weaknesses. In other words, they suck, and no amount of gold they make will change that. If you're going for a handicap match, have the better player pick the Incans to even things out."



http://au.guides.ign.com/guides/896712/page_24.html#ixzz11augRCBu

 

[TheWilltoAct]

I think it's odd how these reviewers pigeon hole different civs into "good" or "bad" categories, when really traits and UU are more about flavor than anything else. It's not like each civilization has a unique tech tree, you basically get the same stuff as the other guy (assuming you survive the early game where some civs roar mightily with their UU).

 

[G-Max]

I think it's odd how these reviewers pigeon hole different civs into "good" or "bad" categories, when really traits and UU are more about flavor than anything else. It's not like each civilization has a unique tech tree, you basically get the same stuff as the other guy (assuming you survive the early game where some civs roar mightily with their UU).

Hey, Praetorians and a few other units are total game-changers! I can easily exterminate half of the civilizations on a map before Civil Service comes around.

 

[TheWilltoAct]

Glad to see you read my whole comment. X)

I think the point I'm trying to make is this: in a toss up between civilization specific bonuses and player skill, I think your skill at playing the game is the bigger factor. And some reviewers seem to forget that.

 

[Derakon]

In other words, it wouldn't take too much extra skill for a player to play a leaderless nation with no unique unit/building and random starting techs. It'd hurt, sure, but it's not like you absolutely must have those extra bits to run an effective civilization.

 

[mariogreymist]

I think the point I'm trying to make is this: in a toss up between civilization specific bonuses and player skill, I think your skill at playing the game is the bigger factor. And some reviewers seem to forget that.

It should be admitted though that JC and Darius are just ridiculously powerful when they can capitalize on their UU, and require all the subtlety of a jackhammer to capitalize on most (getting the most out of the forum is a bit tricky) of their power.

There are a number of other powerful early UU civs/leaders, but between the Org trait and the power of immortals and prats, those two are borderline silly. I recall a prince game on a huge map where I used JC's prats to take a continent so large I had over 80 cities on it, and was able to win a domination VC without fighting a single intercontinental war. (russia built one city on a large coastal island, but I don't count that) I built a grand total of two siege units in doing this.

And I've been involved in a war (which Izzy started while I was peacefully heading to space) of Conquistadors/muskets/Maces/Longbows/galleons/frigates vs Modern Armor, Mobile Artillery, Stealth Bombers and Mech Infantry with Darius, using similar tactics. (couldn't find the save on this one)

 

[tdy99]

The Holy Roman UU is pretty good. Basically a maceman and pikeman in one unit. Seems pretty useful to me.

 

[Jerrymander]

I think it's odd how these reviewers pigeon hole different civs into "good" or "bad" categories, when really traits and UU are more about flavor than anything else. It's not like each civilization has a unique tech tree, you basically get the same stuff as the other guy (assuming you survive the early game where some civs roar mightily with their UU).

They're too used to games like supar smash bros barwl where the choices are good and bad, and not all roughly equivalent.

 

[TheWilltoAct]

In other words, it wouldn't take too much extra skill for a player to play a leaderless nation with no unique unit/building and random starting techs. It'd hurt, sure, but it's not like you absolutely must have those extra bits to run an effective civilization.

That's exactly what I was driving at, thank you.

They're too used to games like supar smash bros barwl where the choices are good and bad, and not all roughly equivalent.

Haha.

 

[G-Max]

I think the point I'm trying to make is this: in a toss up between civilization specific bonuses and player skill, I think your skill at playing the game is the bigger factor.

Well, that's certainly true for most civs... but come on, even a total n00b can whoop some ass with Rome.

It should be admitted though that JC and Darius are just ridiculously powerful when they can capitalize on their UU, and require all the subtlety of a jackhammer to capitalize on most (getting the most out of the forum is a bit tricky) of their power.

There are a number of other powerful early UU civs/leaders, but between the Org trait and the power of immortals and prats, those two are borderline silly.

To be fair, Immortals are easy prey for Spear/Pikemen. The Praetorian has no such counter; the closest would be the Axeman, which puts up a respectable but insufficient 7.5 against the Praetorian's 8.

 

[insaneweasel]

The Holy Roman UU is pretty good. Basically a maceman and pikeman in one unit. Seems pretty useful to me.

Have you actually played with it? It looks good on paper, but in reality, most of the guys you will be fighting are longbows. They only manage to get a 50% bonus vs. maces. Not that great.

 

[mariogreymist]

To be fair, Immortals are easy prey for Spear/Pikemen. The Praetorian has no such counter; the closest would be the Axeman, which puts up a respectable but insufficient 7.5 against the Praetorian's 8.

In a human v human game, sure. The AI doesn't make enough spears to stop a dedicated immortal rush, in my experience. Also, it's a matter of priorities. When going after someone with immortals, the first order of business is to pillage any copper they might have.

But yes, an enemy who builds lots of spears is immune to an immortal rush. If you really want to see something silly, play Darius on a large or huge map at marathon speed. If you get horses anywhere near the capital, and start on a reasonably large land mass (at least 1, but preferably 2-3 neighbors) you can take it all with immortals nine times out of ten at any difficulty up to emperor. Then let Darius' traits kick in as you cottage spam, and see if you can't have tanks in the 1700's.

 

[insaneweasel]

They're too used to games like supar smash bros barwl where the choices are good and bad, and not all roughly equivalent.

Well, to be honest, I think that the Holy Roman empire is bad. Two weakest traits+crappy UU makes for some boring games. However, it does have a sweet UB and a skilled player can make it work (I wish I was one of them!)