CivFanaticMan
Warlord
Ok I was sitting, reading people's rants on the forums when, all of a sudden, the shocking truth came to my head! I know why people seem to be getting borded with Civ5 so easily, and why it just isn't living up to its predecessors. Here is my theorem:
1. When we play any strategy or rpg we expect 1 of two things from the game: self immersion or competitive immersion.
Self immersion is basically roleplaying; every detail is something to geek about, and deepens the 'story' of the game. By the end of the game you have progressed through an epic story that you will remember for years to come. Its like both writing and reading a good book.
Competitive immersion is more mechanical. You aren't playing for an immersive story, you play to win. You review past games in your head, not so much as to reenact a story you made, but so you can review your strategy. This doesn't mean there is no good story. You can have a story to tell your friends but its mostly a story about mechanical gameplay.
2. Games that fall more ( and i say 'more' because most games have aspects from both styles, but the game was made to work for this gameplay type) under the Self immersion category would be: Any Paradox game, Mass Effect, Dragon Age, Civilization 4, Rise of Nations (campaign), The Sims, Sim City, ect.
Games that fall more under the Competitive immersion are: Starcraft, Total War games, Call of Duty, Civ Rev.
3. Each game in each gameplay category have something in common (besides being in the same gameplay category) is the length of each match or game. Think about it, a Starcraft battle lasts about 20 minutes on average; a Total War battle lasts about 10 minutes; a Call of Duty match lasts about 15 minutes; Civ Rev lasts about 2 hours, and thats about the max amount of time a "Competitive immersion" type game would last.
In the Self immersion category: Paradox games last really long; Mass Effect has 40 hours of gameplay; Dragon Age has a whopping 80 hours of gameplay max; a game of Civilization 4 can last anywhere from 3 hours on fastest speed to 20 hours on slower speeds; Rise of Nations can last 3 hours; And both the Sims and Sim City can be endless.
Self immersion = longer games, Competitive immersion = shorter games.
4. Why is this?
Well, in a game where your immersing yourself with the story and with the characters you want to suck every detail out of the game. Every event, every mission, every conflict, dialogue, and movement is part of an epic story. A game needs to be long so you can absorb everything and create your own story. This is why in Civ4 many people enjoy epic or marathon games; they are long enough so you can absorb all the details without them going away to fast. If an immersion game is too short the story feels un-epic, and rushed through. As humans we never want a good story to end.
When you play competitively, the game needs to be shorter or else it drags on and gets boring. The longer it takes to win, the more discouraged a player gets. And if you lose you feel that all that time was wasted. A player who plays competitively wants to win as fast as possible, while having a challenge at the same time.
5. Whats my point?
Civ5 doesn't fit anywhere! Civ5 is designed to lean towards the Competitive side because the AI competes to win as well. An AI that competes to win takes away from immersion. But Civ games last longer about the 2 hour threshold! This creates a drag for those players who like a longer game. You find yourself hitting next turn over and over waiting for you to win. The only immersion comes from the combat, which only can entertain for a certain amount of time. Civ5 lacks immersion for its length.
6. The Solution:
Either Fraxis should put immersion back into Civ5, or it should dumb it down even more and make games lasting 2 hours or less like in Civ Rev.
Try playing a game of Civ5 on the fastest game speed. Lets see if you have more fun or not.
1. When we play any strategy or rpg we expect 1 of two things from the game: self immersion or competitive immersion.
Self immersion is basically roleplaying; every detail is something to geek about, and deepens the 'story' of the game. By the end of the game you have progressed through an epic story that you will remember for years to come. Its like both writing and reading a good book.
Competitive immersion is more mechanical. You aren't playing for an immersive story, you play to win. You review past games in your head, not so much as to reenact a story you made, but so you can review your strategy. This doesn't mean there is no good story. You can have a story to tell your friends but its mostly a story about mechanical gameplay.
2. Games that fall more ( and i say 'more' because most games have aspects from both styles, but the game was made to work for this gameplay type) under the Self immersion category would be: Any Paradox game, Mass Effect, Dragon Age, Civilization 4, Rise of Nations (campaign), The Sims, Sim City, ect.
Games that fall more under the Competitive immersion are: Starcraft, Total War games, Call of Duty, Civ Rev.
3. Each game in each gameplay category have something in common (besides being in the same gameplay category) is the length of each match or game. Think about it, a Starcraft battle lasts about 20 minutes on average; a Total War battle lasts about 10 minutes; a Call of Duty match lasts about 15 minutes; Civ Rev lasts about 2 hours, and thats about the max amount of time a "Competitive immersion" type game would last.
In the Self immersion category: Paradox games last really long; Mass Effect has 40 hours of gameplay; Dragon Age has a whopping 80 hours of gameplay max; a game of Civilization 4 can last anywhere from 3 hours on fastest speed to 20 hours on slower speeds; Rise of Nations can last 3 hours; And both the Sims and Sim City can be endless.
Self immersion = longer games, Competitive immersion = shorter games.
4. Why is this?
Well, in a game where your immersing yourself with the story and with the characters you want to suck every detail out of the game. Every event, every mission, every conflict, dialogue, and movement is part of an epic story. A game needs to be long so you can absorb everything and create your own story. This is why in Civ4 many people enjoy epic or marathon games; they are long enough so you can absorb all the details without them going away to fast. If an immersion game is too short the story feels un-epic, and rushed through. As humans we never want a good story to end.
When you play competitively, the game needs to be shorter or else it drags on and gets boring. The longer it takes to win, the more discouraged a player gets. And if you lose you feel that all that time was wasted. A player who plays competitively wants to win as fast as possible, while having a challenge at the same time.
5. Whats my point?
Civ5 doesn't fit anywhere! Civ5 is designed to lean towards the Competitive side because the AI competes to win as well. An AI that competes to win takes away from immersion. But Civ games last longer about the 2 hour threshold! This creates a drag for those players who like a longer game. You find yourself hitting next turn over and over waiting for you to win. The only immersion comes from the combat, which only can entertain for a certain amount of time. Civ5 lacks immersion for its length.
6. The Solution:
Either Fraxis should put immersion back into Civ5, or it should dumb it down even more and make games lasting 2 hours or less like in Civ Rev.
Try playing a game of Civ5 on the fastest game speed. Lets see if you have more fun or not.
