I still don't understand "The Matrix"

[PrinceOfLeigh]

I see then you can gasp in awe at the profundity of the Friendly fires message too if you like, whatever it takes.

I never said I thought he was right

 

[bathsheba666]

Everyone knows the answer is 42.

But what is the question?

 

[Pontiuth Pilate]

And yes, pretty much NONE of that is made explicit in the actual movie, you have to reason it out. Partly it's that the directors WANTED to leave things implicit. Partly, yes, it's poor writing the third movie was really unsatisfactory - not in plot - but in execution.

 

[azzaman333]

But what is the question?

What do you get if you multiply 6 by 9?

 

[Kan' Sharuminar]

Nice analysis Pontiuth

 

[Sidhe]

And yes, pretty much NONE of that is made explicit in the actual movie, you have to reason it out. Partly it's that the directors WANTED to leave things implicit. Partly, yes, it's poor writing the third movie was really unsatisfactory - not in plot - but in execution.

I thought it was pretty great but then I read only as much into as I say in my previous posts, I didn't really need to get the hidden messages, although I probably got many of them as the films went on. I think as an overall picture, so long as you understand what's happening at a basic level it's good enough. Mind you I have only seen the second and third films once, so I probably never spent that much time thinking about it anyway. As I said Donnie Darko is a much bigger mind f**k.

 

[PrinceOfLeigh]

@Pontiuth Pilate

I think we have a winner

 

[GenMarshall]

One thing I can say is:

"There is no spoon"

 

[Sidhe]

One thing I can say is:

"There is no spoon"

Good because it's my turn to make the tea

Of course there's no spoon you bizarre child we're in the matrix.

 

[GenMarshall]

Of course there's no spoon you bizarre child we're in the matrix.

Well, I interperated it as a mind over matter statement . And no were not plugged into some meglomaniac super machine sucking energy right out of us .

 

[Sidhe]

Well, I interperated it as a mind over matter statement . And no were not plugged into some meglomaniac super machine sucking energy right out of us .

How do you know, anyone offered you the blue pill or the red one yet? It's only a matter of time though

There is no spoon is a reference to the fact it's not the spoon that bends it's reality. What is obvious though is that there is no absolute reality, in the matrix nothing changes because the matrix is not real, and so nothing in fact changes, it's a matter of perspective or changing what the matrix is, which of course is not reality. Or am I talking s**t now?

I would of said, shut up baldy and go make me a cup of tea, but mah that's just me

 

[BasketCase]

All the mumbo-jumbo in the movies is basically the movies' way of hiding the fact that they don't know what the ultimate Truth of the Universe is either.

However, here's something that was mentioned by some Matrix fan elsewhere on the web: when people are inside the Matrix, the special effects are done in that electronic green with the flickering random pseudo-letters. Later in the series, we start seeing yellow instead of green (the first time, I think, was when Neo first met Seraph). When Neo loses his sight and begins seeing the world through his growing powers, he sees the world in yellow.

Green is "the" Matrix--what if Yellow is another Matrix that contains the green one? Another "level" of reality, controlled by some higher-dimensional Architecht?

 

[PrinceOfLeigh]

I just thought the "Yellow" were programs from the Machine World?

 

[Yuri2356]

How do you know, anyone offered you the blue pill or the red one yet? It's only a matter of time though

There is no spoon is a reference to the fact it's not the spoon that bends it's reality. What is obvious though is that there is no absolute reality, in the matrix nothing changes because the matrix is not real, and so nothing in fact changes, it's a matter of perspective or changing what the matrix is, which of course is not reality. Or am I talking s**t now?

I would of said, shut up baldy and go make me a cup of tea, but mah that's just me

I take it as a sign that the core machinery of the Matrix is relatively 'dumb' compared to the programs that operate it. It's a comparatively simple system that:

-Begins with an environment defined by the Architect,
-Reads the minds of all connected users to find our what they are,
-Places them into the environment,
-Figures out what their senses would percieve of the Matrix
-Tells them what they 'see'
-Takes their mind's reactions and applies them to the environment
-Loops until told otherwise

Now, the thing about that is, your abilities in the Matrix are defined by what your mind tell the system you can do. So if you just think you can bend spoons/run up walls/dedge bullets, it will let you. But, your mind is used to working in a reality where it knows it can't do that. Both the matrix, and your own brain, demand answers to how it's possible for you to bend that spoon and you mind tends to conclude that the act is impossible and tells that to the Matrix. So, you provide yourself with the easy way out for your brain: That's not a spoon. There is no spoon. This is a dream, a fantasy, I can do anything here. Your brain smiles and nods, and you're out jumping between buildings like nobody's buisness.

With regards to Agents, they're just programs that are given arbitrarily high abilities. The matrix reads them, and let's them do whatever their code says they can do. So, while it gives them fixed limits, it also removes the need for faith and self-deception. Tha agent can do what he does because it was simply defined. They tend to folow their settings because a) They're good enough to deal with most problems they encounter, and b) doing anything too rediculous would comprimise the illusion of the Matrix, or strain their ability to cover up glitches. Note that in Reloaded, after Smith had been killed by Neo, the Agent's abilities were improved in order to deal with the new threat. (Neo could shrug off old-Smith with one hand behind his back, but had to get right into things to fight those two outside the meeting)

So, Neo's chief power over the Agents is that he can continualy re-define his abilities in the Matrix, while the agents need to stop and patch themselves. Smith overcame this problem when he went viral and started to choose his own fate outside of the system's plans.

However, none of theose involved could quite overcome the Matrix's "kill" signal, save Neo. You could still down an Agent with a shot to the Head, even though they respawn, the rebels could still be beaten into bloody pulp or shot full of holes. When the simulation said you were dead, you died, and that was that.

 

[BasketCase]

I just thought the "Yellow" were programs from the Machine World?

If I remember correctly (I'd have to watch the movie again to make sure), Neo sees the entire real world in yellow--including Trinity when she and Neo are journeying into the real-world machine city.

Seraph is different from the other programs, in some way--he showed up as yellow even when he was inside the Matrix, whereas your normal Agent was green on the inside.

 

[Yuri2356]

If I remember correctly (I'd have to watch the movie again to make sure), Neo sees the entire real world in yellow--including Trinity when she and Neo are journeying into the real-world machine city.

Seraph is different from the other programs, in some way--he showed up as yellow even when he was inside the Matrix, whereas your normal Agent was green on the inside.

I think Neo's Real-world Sight of Yellow was either an ability to 'see' electrical signals (Would make sense, in relation to the wireless connection he makes earilier in the movie) Or some mystical thing involving souls and the like.

 

[EdwardTking]

..plugged into some meglomaniac super machine sucking energy right out of us...

I always found the concept that humans were used to generate
the electricity to power the machines as a weak point in the plot

Now if human brain waves had been used to generate
random numbers for logic machines - maybe.

 

[Sidhe]

I always found the concept that humans were used to generate
the electricity to power the machines as a weak point in the plot

Now if human brain waves had been used to generate
random numbers for logic machines - maybe.

it's far easier to use radioactive decay to produce random numbers. Or photon emission. Let's face it humans are a liability. Might as well get your energy from Geothermal heat or something.

You guys read far too much into the Matrix, but it's interesting anyway

 

[Yuri2356]

Some believe that the power generation thing was just a side dish, and the Machines have some other reason for keeping us arround. Like guilt, or compassion. We did some terrible things to them in the past, they put us in our place, but they wouldn't quite go all the way with it. As Smith says right back in the original, the first Matrix was built as a paradise, but people didn't fit into it. Not the sort of move you'd start with on a people you unquestionably hate.

 

[Elrohir]

I still don't understand "The Matrix"

In communist Russia, Matrix understands you!

Heh, it's a movie man. Just sit back and enjoy it; don't overanalyze it. If you're looking for philosophy instead, just pick up some Plato.