Improving flow - should generals/promotions require a cooldown?

[user330977]

Hello folks,

I think most people will realise that each turn is precious in Old World, especially with the regular turn-per-year setting. I am therefore wondering if game experience would be altered drastically if we removed the cooldown necessary for appointing generals or promotions, allowing you to do one such action and attack on the same turn. I hate to think of the lost XP whilst my general just sits there! I feel this could improve game flow somewhat, and incentivise adding generals to units without wasting a turn in the process.

If that is too drastic, I have an alternative - for promotions, I could understand a cooldown if the player is spending training to gain a promotion. I see this as drilling your troops so they are therefore out of action. However, it makes less sense when the experience is gained naturally in the field and the unit is getting a "free" promotion. Why are we having a cooldown for this?

Happy to have a discussion.

Kind regards,
Ita Bear

 

[jguy100]

@Ita Bear agreed, I always felt the cool down was strange.

I can move a unit 20 times and then promote it. But I can't promote a unit and then move it once?

I wouldn't mind having an increased orders cost to promotion/general assignment. But I agree, the cooldown always feels awkward to me.

 

[PiR]

I agree too, and that is a counter-incentive for me to use generals, but that game is so great that I trust the designers with any decision.

 

[Dale]

If Generaling had no cooldown, you could bounce a General from unit to unit in a turn and create some sort of super General from all the XP. It was very abusable when we tried it.

 

[jguy100]

@Dale would it have a negative impact if the fix was to put the cooldown on the general instead of the unit? A unit can do something after having a general assigned, but a general can't be re-assigned for x turns? Similar to the diplomacy cooldown.

 

[nolegskitten]

no cooldown on promotions, healing or general assignment would remove a lot of the decision making in combat. As Dale noted, general bouncing could potentially be game breaking (it's bad enough that hero can already do some of that).

 

[Stringer1313]

I like the way it is -- being forced to decide whether to take a promotion or assign a general instead of taking an action is the kind of interesting decision-making that makes Old World so much more superior than other 4x games. I also don't want to further encourage ROFLstomp snowballs.

I would be OK with a compromise where a "naturally earned" promotion like OP described would not take a turn, but beyond that I like the status quo.

 

[user330977]

I like the way it is -- being forced to decide whether to take a promotion or assign a general instead of taking an action is the kind of interesting decision-making that makes Old World so much more superior than other 4x games. I also don't want to further encourage ROFLstomp snowballs.

I would be OK with a compromise where a "naturally earned" promotion like OP described would not take a turn, but beyond that I like the status quo.

I can understand this. What I don't understand though is, as jguy100 pointed out, why we can move a unit from one of the empire to other and then add a promotion/general, but we can't add a promotion/general and then move the unit. The mechanic doesn't seem to have been 100% thought out. It's this anomoly that made me question cooldowns in the first place.

If Generaling had no cooldown, you could bounce a General from unit to unit in a turn and create some sort of super General from all the XP. It was very abusable when we tried it.

Could this not be solved by "locking in" the general after it has made an attacking move for the turn?

Kind regards,
Ita Bear

 

[Stringer1313]

I can understand this. What I don't understand though is, as jguy100 pointed out, why we can move a unit from one of the empire to other and then add a promotion/general, but we can't add a promotion/general and then move the unit. The mechanic doesn't seem to have been 100% thought out. It's this anomoly that made me question cooldowns in the first place.

Kind regards,
Ita Bear

That's definitely a fair point. Conceptually it does seem like it should be all or nothing, at least with respect to being able to move + gen/promotion. Either allow you to move + gen/promote in any order, or doing gen/promote requires using all your move points in addition to ending the action. I'd be fine with the latter, but I have a feeling many others wouldn't be, lol.

 

[Dale]

When a unit receives a promotion or a general, the unit is then allowed to go celebrate. So they all go and get drunk at the inn and pick up bar wenches.

Do you know how hard it is to re-organise after a drunken orgy to keep marching/attacking?

 

[PiR]

Is that the case even with a Strict general with a high discipline?

 

[Dale]

Is that the case even with a Strict general with a high discipline?

Doesn't mean the troops are strict.

 

[Chris41336]

I agree with the earned promotions having no cooldown. I think if you force a promotion, then it should have a cooldown, as it does now.