Is fractal undesirable?

[champ82]

Sorry, no pic, would be a lot better with one. No save either. BTW, is photo bucket legit these days? I’ve seen so many non-pics lately.

On to the point : Is fractal undesirable?

It used to be my favorite. I never even questioned it. I liked the unpredictability. Seemed like the only “fair” map to pick. Could have uninhabited Australia sized continents (which would favor Portugal.) Or it could be a Pangaea (which would favor Mongolia, Rome etc.) And you don’t know this going in, so it’s not “cheap” to pick either a water civ or a land civ and reap the rewards if you got lucky. BUT…

Sometimes it seems really imbalanced. (This is when a screen shot would be good.) I started a game as the Aztecs. Imagine the continent as a capital E. I was at the end of the middle east-west protruding peninsula. Catherine (the best REXer IMO) was at where that east-west peninsula joins the north-south axis. This is on immortal. She settles a 2nd city east. I have room for 1, maybe 2 other cities besides my cap before war. I get discouraged and enter world builder. Shaka was at the very bottom of the E all by himself and someone else was on the very top.

So, it occurs to me, have I won so many times on fractal with an unfair advantage?

So what do you guys think, is continents more consistently fair? What is the fairest map?

Somewhat on point, somewhat off point, I lose (actually I give up) almost all of my games on Immortal and maybe only half the time do I actually come away with any “should have done _______ differently”s or “next time I’ll _________ better”s.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

Fairest maps are probably crap like donut. Continents is a pretty consistent script, and pangaea is usually pretty fair also.

Fractal does have some variance, since it is the typical choice for the LHC series and sometimes people do wind up with some extra land, although it's a LOT better than shuffle IMO only because shuffle can add archipelago.

Big and small is probably worse than fractal in this regard by the way.

 

[DaveMcW]

All the single-player maps are unfair. Play multiplayer maps if you want fair.

But the unfairness does prevent single-player games from becoming boring.

 

[champ82]

Muilti-player maps? Where do I get these (to play single player)?

 

[z0wb13]

i go with shuffle/random sea level and climate. although i would like to be able to shuffle terra into the mix.

 

[avdale]

I find that fractal is the most fair and interesting to play. Its a challenge to ocasionally find that the mapgen has given an ai a disproportionate ammount of land or a godly capital and try to work around it. Never hurts to get an amazing start yourself as well

That being said we all have limits and there are times when the mapgen simply gives you a lemon

Spoiler :

Yes that is Sitting Bull at the end of my little stretch ready to block me off. Foods nice though.

 

[Shurdus]

Fractal can be 'unfair' but it is also this surprise that keeps the game interesting. I find it is nice to go to war sometimes, being able to turtle up sometimes and that I need to really consider my best options. On a 'fair' map you know you should be on par in size without ever having to go to war. This is maybe fair but it is not what I want from my games.

 

[Silu]

Fractal is the fairest IMO. Continents/Hemispheres you know what to expect (if you didn't choose a random number of landmasses) and if you conquer your own continent that usually means you win. Big&Small with big continents is probably the second fairest in my book.

Since there seems to be some ambiguity: by "fair" I mean "difficult for the human player to exploit".

 

[Meatbuster]

Muilti-player maps? Where do I get these (to play single player)?

I think they mean the Mirror or Team Battleground map scripts. Ones that intentionally make your land exactly the same as your opponent's. (If you pick an even number of civs)

 

[StuntedAzrael]

I started to dislike fractal since it's almost always pangaea.

Normally, I use RandomScriptMap set everything on random and I exclude archipelago and terra maps. That way you have no idea what you're going to get and this shows early game.

 

[NihilZero]

I have the same problem with fractal as the OP.

The fact that it is 100% unpredictable makes for much more interesting map layouts and game styles, but I find it to be very unbalanced in terms of starting positions. It's not unusual to find yourself surrounded by massive amounts of desert tiles, or in some other similarly hopeless predicament. Fractal would be perfect if it were not for its unbalanced nature.

Normally, I use RandomScriptMap set everything on random and I exclude archipelago and terra maps. That way you have no idea what you're going to get and this shows early game.

I do that a lot too, gives a very nice mix. Lately I've ben forcing myself to play fractal though, to try to learn to be more adaptable.

 

[mica8911]

I though fractal didn't follow any real map script. I play it all the time but your saying archipelago will never happen in fractal?

 

[NihilZero]

I though fractal didn't follow any real map script. I play it all the time but your saying archipelago will never happen in fractal?

Hope I'm understanding you correctly, but what StuntedAzrael was saying is that if you use RandomScriptMap and set it to exclude archipelago from its possible map generator types, you get a nice unpredictable map type. Archipelago is usually a little easy as the AI is pretty weak at it.

I've never seen Fractal produce an archipelago type map, usually the landmasses are bigger.

 

[CHEESE!]

Constantly I'm getting crappy, no-metals, 2 civ islands that are far too small for one, let alone 2 civs, on Fractal. I like that though- gives a challenge.