Islands give Finns Lisabon treaty problem

[crabapple]

Yeah, I know. But there is the currently very remote possibility that should this sort of thing persist or happen again you will get sovereignty whether you want it or not. You can't have your cake and eat it, too.

The real problem is that EU and Åland's traditional autonomy are not compatible. What used to be domestic issues (where Åland has the right to make its own decisions) have now become international issues (where Åland has not had autonomy). The demarcation between foreign and domestic is not all that clear within the EU. Precisely what will happen if Åland does not ratify the treaty is just not clear from what I've read.

From the official Åland Islands homepage (emphasis added):
Foreign affairs is not transferred to Åland under the Autonomy Act, but remains under the control of the Finnish Government. Even so, Åland has a degree of influence on international treaties that contain provisions relating to areas where Åland is the competent authority. The Autonomy Act states that an international treaty of this kind entered into by Finland requires the consent of the Parliament of Åland to become valid also in Åland.

One solution would be to present a choice: ratify or do not ratify and secede from EU (like Greenland). A situation where Finnish government has to ask for Åland's go ahead to sign into EU treaties is simply unpalatable. Either way I do hope that the situation is solved in a way that prevents this sort of hassle in the future.

For the record: I don't think calling Ålanders terrorists is appropriate. What they are doing is nothing new in politics. It might not be all good and noble but terrorism, as understood in normal discourse, it is not.

Well yeah i guess that would be a solution, leaving the EU, this would also mean that the Snus thing would be solved, and you are allowed to buy snus again. the negative side is the positive side of EU like extra money for project and stuff.

 

[AL_DA_GREAT]

Åland should be a fairly independant state with ties mainly to Finland. Finland is for the time being better than Sweden.

 

[crabapple]

Åland should be a fairly independant state with ties mainly to Finland. Finland is for the time being better than Sweden.

i agree, but not for the same reason as you

 

[GinandTonic]

Oh dear, shut up and read what I wrote again and try to use your gray neurons when doing it.

"Terrorist logic" means, that you use threats against innocent bystanders to force someone to do what you want.



This must be the greatest single strawman ever encountered on this forum

This has nothing to do with democracy. Aalanders, as I understand, have a problem with the Finnish national government. So instead of dealing with this government, they take an issue which is totally un-related to their problem, but which is very important to the remaining 25 member countries of the European Union, and use threats (of not approving the treaty) in order to make them force Finland to do what they want.

That is what I call terrorist logic - they're taking hostages, of course in the political, non-violent sense.

So chill out and first try to understand what I am saying before you start exhaling fumes and spitting fire.

Setting aside all the childish and hypocritical abuse -

How on earth is voting on maintaining independent authority over certain areas "totally un-related to" wanting to maintain independent authority over the same areas? Hell they dont even want to maintain independent authority they just want a voice at the table. Seems to me they are voting exactly on the issue of the treaty and how it affects them.

Winner by your logic is there anyone who votes against the treaty or the old constitution who was not following "terrorist logic"?

 

[bhsup]

I've read this entire thing and nobody has touched on the very heart of the matter...

You guys have banned chewing tobacco?!?!

 

[GinandTonic]

I've read this entire thing and nobody has touched on the very heart of the matter...

You guys have banned chewing tobacco?!?!

That would be the competience at the hart of the whole issue.

 

[Pannonius]

I've read this entire thing and nobody has touched on the very heart of the matter...

You guys have banned chewing tobacco?!?!

Welcome to the wonderful world of EU legislation.

 

[luiz]

27,000 people? I think more people live in my street.

 

[innonimatu]

I've read this entire thing and nobody has touched on the very heart of the matter...

You guys have banned chewing tobacco?!?!

I did. And while I was also surprised to hear it, I shouldn't. It's the EU at its best, legislating and "regulating" on everything under the sun, to "protect the citizens", of course. And the wonderful thing with it is that national governments then can present unpopular EU directives as something they're not to blame and can't help enforcing. "We're very sorry but it's an EU directive..."

 

[raketooy]

When Finland - including the Aland Islands - joined the EU in 1995, "Aland did not get enough influence," Susanne Eriksson, Deputy Secretary General of the Aland Parliament, told the BBC.

I think the thing is that Åland used to have too much influence. Probably still has.

 

[REDY]

If they will stop lisbon I will to them and I will never forget their name

 

[Pannonius]

If they will stop lisbon I will to them and I will never forget their name

Count me in!

 

[EnglishEdward]

The demarcation between foreign and domestic is not all that clear within the EU.

Quite so. And one of the reasons why there were no votes to the EU Constitution.

 

[Julian Delphiki]

Nuke Åland!

 

[RedRalph]

If they will stop lisbon I will to them and I will never forget their name

So you and Winner dont agree on everything!!!

 

[crabapple]

Nuke Åland!

Yes otherwise we will invade Finland with our mighty military!