It's not Communism!

[amadeus]

There's no "true Communism."

The Soviet Union, Poland, East Germany, Czechoslovokia, those were Communist states.

How many backwards countries have to fail at Communism before it comes "true?"

 

[Hamlet]

Originally posted by Lucky
It would be really interesting to see who of all who disagree with the thread starter has really read any works on Communism from Marx, Engels or Lenin.

I have read a lot on Communist theory, and some much of Marx's works, etc, that's precisely why I DON'T need this thread. This board is for discussion, not direct education.

Originally posted by rmsharpe
The Soviet Union, Poland, East Germany, Czechoslovokia, those were Communist states.

A 'Communist state' is practically a contradiction in terms.

I suggest you read up on the actual objectives of marxism.

All the states we have witnessed in the 20th century have been dictatorial socialist regimes.

Originally posted by Octavian X
The beginning of the USSR was promising, with Lenin at its head.

In what sense? Lenin was, in many ways, no different from Stalin, at least in methods.

 

[MajorGeneral2]

My purpose for this thread was simply to make a point. Several political parties have called themselves the "Communist" party, but have failed to achieve true Communism. Also, Socialist states have not gone torward Communism in nearly abolishing government, rather, it has grown. Rather than going from Socialism to Communism, they have gone from Socialism to dictatorships.

 

[klazlo]

Just to make some points if someone has still some interest (I just found this topic).

No states in the eastern block were considered themselves as "communists". They were socialists as sgrig noted. Furthermore socialism means different in the east and in the west (in east I mean basically the eastern european former socialist states, since the asian and african version of socialism was quite different because of the cultural differences).

So we (as I grew up in Hungary) were socialists because everybody could see in these countries that we're not in the communist paradise yet, we have to work hard, we have to deal with some differences in welfare etc. That was the main reason why socialism was invented, just to point out continously that "yeah, we're almost there in the communism, we just have to work for it a little bit". And nobody knew what will happen if we reach communism so it was pretty safer for the party to say we're just on the way.

From the west - mainly because of the media usage - this two sometimes means the same, maybe communism was more popular because socialism similar to "society" or "social" and these words could not be argue as evil that easy.

 

[Mîtiu Ioan]

Originally posted by Lucky
The original ideas of Communism, as "invented" by Karl Marx, have NEVER been totally or even partly put into practice in any socialist state.

Marx never said in detail how will lok a "communist" society !! He just criticise the capitalism ( using a debatable economical theroy ... ).

Lenin is the "creator" of communism !!

Regards

 

[Hamlet]

Originally posted by Mîtiu Ioan
Lenin is the "creator" of communism !!

The first part of your post I generally agree with.

However, Lenin is not the 'creator' of Communism. Lenin merely took Marx's original ideas and tried to both make them politically acceptable for early 20th century Russia, and put his own personal 'spin' on them, so to speak.

For both these reasons, it is fundamentally flawed.

Leninism is not the ultimate word in Communist theory, although it is (rather foolishly, I might add) taken as almost biblical by many Communists.

It is, just like Trotskyism, Maoism, etc one person's basic ideas on how best to apply Communist theory to achieve the utopia Marx described.

 

[Magnus]

In theory true communism is anarchy.

Communism as it has been seen in the real world so far is simply beaurocratic absolutism.

 

[Mîtiu Ioan]

Originally posted by Hamlet
Leninism is not the ultimate word in Communist theory, although it is (rather foolishly, I might add) taken as almost biblical by many Communists.

I never said that Lenin is the "ultimate word" in Communist ideas !!

But he is the first who describe a "applicable" package of measure for implement communism !

Of course, Mao, Trotzki and other had have different views, but Lenin was the first ...

Probbably my bad english was the cause of this misunderstanding ...

Regards

 

[Hamlet]

Originally posted by Mîtiu Ioan
I never said that Lenin is the "ultimate word" in Communist ideas !!

Gotcha. I probably jumped on you before thinking.

 

[History_Buff]

As far as Marxist theory goes, I do believe that a society enters Communism first where a leader works to provide equaliity for all, then steos down to allow a true socialist state, one wit no leader, no gvernment, and people treat each other well becuase we are so nice. I can defineatly see that coming soon. . .