K-Mod: Far Beyond the Sword

think the realism invictus crew are working on integrating kmod into theirs, which should address a lot of your suggestions i would imagine.

in the base game/kmod using 18 civs at game start would mean that some civs would have to die in order to allow space for colonies. 18 is the max civs allowed on a map.

do you not find that the game suffers as a result of so many civs though? maf crashes and all that. would be nice and all but argh it's not worth the pain.
 
karadoc, any plans on the AI possibly moving to settle its first city like players sometimes do, ie on to resources/plains hill for better city tile or to gain extra resources? 90% sure that the AI still just SiP, this of course assumes its in dll/python not .exe, been abit since i last modded so can't remember what gets called by AI Turn 0 :)
 
think the realism invictus crew are working on integrating kmod into theirs, which should address a lot of your suggestions i would imagine.

in the base game/kmod using 18 civs at game start would mean that some civs would have to die in order to allow space for colonies. 18 is the max civs allowed on a map.

do you not find that the game suffers as a result of so many civs though? maf crashes and all that. would be nice and all but argh it's not worth the pain.


I play on huge maps and 18 civs seem even few.
 
yeah i kno what you mean alright. having more civs is pretty cool especially on huge maps. i mean it's painful when it crashes with all the extra civs' units/turns/stuff loaded into memory. certainly in the later game. and the extra slowness in between turns "waiting for other players". although i always play on marathon and my pc aint kick-ass so maybe you never have my issues :)

edit: i mean i have trouble in late game with 30 civs or something. never any probs with 18
 
Yes i don't have any memory issues (at least so far). Anyway, since i want colonies in my games, i reduced civs to 14 and raised seas. This should make the games more interesting.
 
yeah i kno what you mean alright. having more civs is pretty cool especially on huge maps. i mean it's painful when it crashes with all the extra civs' units/turns/stuff loaded into memory. certainly in the later game. and the extra slowness in between turns "waiting for other players". although i always play on marathon and my pc aint kick-ass so maybe you never have my issues :)

edit: i mean i have trouble in late game with 30 civs or something. never any probs with 18

How do you play 30 civs with k-mod? is there a dll working with it?
 
sorry, no there's not that i'm aware of. i clearly suck at conveying my meaning. i meant in general terms any .dll with that many civs caused me hassle. sorry for getting your hopes up:)

it's a pretty small change in some file in the source though and then recompile....yeah found it....

CvDefines.h, line 27

karadoc put his source code up on https://github.com/karadoc/Civ4-K-Mod/downloads

if you were interested in doing so yourself.
 
Hello all,
I am looking into getting back into Civ4 and K-Mod seems like a great start. Great job on the project!
I know this was discussed earlier in the thread, however I didn't find a final answer: would K-Mod be compatible with Revolutions (or a variation of that)? Is it possible to somehow activate both mods simultaneously?
 
While playing the mod I have founded some strange things that seems to be bugs:

- Sometimes when city is conquered culture of that city will be strangely reformed and half of the world civilizations will get divided culture to that city even when the other civilization is so far away that it shoudn't be possible to have access to the city's culture. I have seen this happened two cities for now and those cities has only had one change of owner.

- One of my city had big production overfly and I was building units like archers and axeman from it and when I got the units ready instead of one archer I got two and after that I got axeman tripled instead of one.

- When I'm making scenario using K-Mod it is hard to use worldbuilder because of unknown civilizations are shown as barbarian colors, however it doesn't matter but sometimes the mod changes the base color of civilizations when I used the worldbuilder.

- When playing earth map the AI civilizations still doesn't make use of the all resources when settling. I have seen AI to settle over many valuable resources like food and gold when not ideal.

However I like especially like how AI now goes for the victory type that suits them best and do it very well. :)
 
Bug report: when enabling the BUG message feature of peace treaty, i get that peace threaty message (Mario will trade peace) also when i declare war (or someone declares war to me). This is not intended indeed, since he's not going to make peace in the first turn of war.

Another note: When using Bug from Better BUG AI mod, i get a nice feature in the scoreboard: when an Ai doesn't want to talk it displays a "!" near it's name, is it possible to have it also in k-Mod? i'0ve tried many options in the Bug button with no success.
I not entirely sure what you mean with that BUG report. Who's Mario? -- Are you saying that you get the peace treaty message immediately when you enable the feature, and immediately when someone declares war on you, and immediately when you declare war on someone else? -- These damn BUG features are nothing but trouble... I'll look into it. (As for the "!", I'll look into that as well. I don't think I would have disabled that deliberately or accidentally, so maybe it was a BULL feature or something.)

karadoc, any plans on the AI possibly moving to settle its first city like players sometimes do, ie on to resources/plains hill for better city tile or to gain extra resources? 90% sure that the AI still just SiP, this of course assumes its in dll/python not .exe, been abit since i last modded so can't remember what gets called by AI Turn 0 :)
Nar, they are always going to settle in place. The AI doesn't currently understand the special conditions that starting positions have (ie. minimum number of resources in the phat-cross, minimum amount of food, strong chance of having fresh water, etc.), and so it would be too risky to allow them to look for a better spot - they'd usually mess it up.

The thing is, the starting spots are actually chosen using essentially the same method the AI uses for choosing it city locations anyway; and so if the AI had full vision and knowledge of the resources in the starting area, it would almost always choose to settle in place anyway. (This wouldn't always be the case, because after the starting locations are chosen, the map undergoes some changes to improve the quality of starting areas – these changes may well create a better city site somewhere near the starting spot without giving the AI a chance to re-evaluate where the starting spots should be. But aside from that, I'm sure the AI is very happy to settle in place!)


I know this was discussed earlier in the thread, however I didn't find a final answer: would K-Mod be compatible with Revolutions (or a variation of that)? Is it possible to somehow activate both mods simultaneously?
I think there would need to be quite a bit of work done to merge the mods.


While playing the mod I have founded some strange things that seems to be bugs:

- Sometimes when city is conquered culture of that city will be strangely reformed and half of the world civilizations will get divided culture to that city even when the other civilization is so far away that it shoudn't be possible to have access to the city's culture. I have seen this happened two cities for now and those cities has only had one change of owner.

- One of my city had big production overfly and I was building units like archers and axeman from it and when I got the units ready instead of one archer I got two and after that I got axeman tripled instead of one.

- When I'm making scenario using K-Mod it is hard to use worldbuilder because of unknown civilizations are shown as barbarian colors, however it doesn't matter but sometimes the mod changes the base color of civilizations when I used the worldbuilder.

- When playing earth map the AI civilizations still doesn't make use of the all resources when settling. I have seen AI to settle over many valuable resources like food and gold when not ideal.

However I like especially like how AI now goes for the victory type that suits them best and do it very well. :)

I don't think those first two things are bugs. The first one is probably just a result of 'trade culture'. (Trade culture would only usually have a relatively minor impact on the culture of the area; but if the original civilization gets completely eliminated, then the trade culture may turn out to be the only culture remaining.) The second thing, about the multiple units being built, is not a bug. That's just what happens if you have far more productivity than is required to build the unit - the excess overflow goes towards the training of another unit.

Both trade culture and the multi-building of units were discussed recently in this thread, a couple of pages back I think.

The barbarian colours in the worldbuilder is a bug that I didn't know about. Thanks for pointing it out. I'll try to fix it soon. (The bug is due to some changes I made to hide the identity of unmet players in multiplayer games. As I mentioned in the changelog, I was kind of expected some bugs like this to pop up.) However, I don't know what you mean by "sometimes the mod changes the base color of civilizations". I can't think of anything I've done which would cause that. ... Maybe I'll find the answer when I'm fixing the other bug.

As for settling on resources... well, without seeing particular examples I couldn't say if it's a mistake or not; but in general I can say that the AI will sometimes choose to settle on a resources if they think they wouldn't get much benefit from the usual plot improvement anyway. If they can get some extra food or hammers in the city plot by settling on the resource, they won't mind quite as much about missing out on the usual improvement. (I'm not saying that they'll actually aim to settle on the resources, but rather that they won't mind doing it if they think it's going to get them a better city location.)


--

The next version is coming along well. It will have some minor improvements to the new combat orchestration, and to the group cycling system. -- and other stuff. The current version actually has a rare crash bug in the combat animation thing. If combat animations are on, and a low-health unit withdraws from combat without any damage being done to it or to the defender, then the game will crash. :( That's pretty rare, because people usually don't attack with such low health anyway, but nonetheless it will be fixed in the next version. (As a temporary workaround, if you want to get past a crash like that, just turn off combat animations until that battle is over.)
 
@karadoc
with regard to the brief conversation danwood and i were having above re a 50civ .dll:

i compiled a new kmod .dll with a 50 civ limit just for the heck of it and ran the game with 25 civs or something starting, up to middle ages or so and was pleasingly suprised at how much faster the turns end with kmod compared to base bts modded to some ludicrous number. i'd never tried this with your mod before.

then i searched back thru this thread and see in post #305 you mention loads of loops thru all the civs, even dead ones. just to clarify: (using my test game for example) does this mean in these cases the code cycles through 50 civs -if i had that many present in civinfos or whatever - or does it just go through however many you start a game with? in my above game, 25 civs?
 
It cycles through the full 50.

Mostly this is very fast anyway, because the loops will check "if (player.isAlive())" or something like that before doing any expensive calculations, but nevertheless it will slow the game down slightly, and will make the game use more memory, and it will make the save files bigger.
– That's basically the reason why I haven't increased the max number of civs in the standard version of K-Mod.


--

An update on the barbarian colours in the world builder. Apparently the bug only happens when not using the "chipotle" code; which is why I hadn't noticed it. (The chipotle stuff is vital for testing purposes.) Anyway, I've found a solution to the problem, and it'll be fixed in the next version.

Incidentally, I'm intending to change the AI autoplay feature so that it is only available with chipotle, because autoplay is not really meant for normal gameplay. I don't expect this change will bother anyone, but I figure I might as well mention it. (It probably won't be mentioned in the changelog.) My guess is that most people didn't even know K-Mod had an autoplay feature in the first place... and those who are interested in autoplay probably already use the 'secret' chipotle code anyway.
 
thanks for the clarification, karadoc.

on the aiautoplay feature, not that its super important but could you also disable it for mp games? it probably shouldn't be available there either.
 
The changes I just made to autoplay will disable it in multiplayer as well, because 'cheat mode' is always disabled in multiplayer games. You're right that it shouldn't be available in multiplayer. I don't expect that it would even work correctly in multiplayer anyway. ie. I'd expect it to just immediately go out of sync. I probably would have changed it ages ago if I'd noticed it was still available in multiplayer. :nuke:
 
I got another noob question: is the AI totally capable of forsee and plan in Epic or even Marathon gamespeeds, or their skill gets reduced?
 
I have an idea for improving control of gameplay: a "suppress unit cycling" hotkey.

Basically, make it possible somehow to map a key that, if held down while issuing an order to a unit, will stop Unit Cycling from occurring after that order is given. I would use this to stop my units from cycling on occasions when I don't want it to happen (e.g., if I just moved a unit near a city that I want to check quickly before my camera cycles away).

Alternatively, just making a hotkey that flat out toggled unit cycling directly, would also work.

Or possibly both options. :D

My thinking is, I love the unit cycling in K-Mod (rapid unit cycling is SO GOOD) but even with the improvements to the intuitiveness of the system, I do still find occasions when I consciously think, "Man, I wish there was a key I could hold down to make it so my units wouldn't cycle right now, and then I could let it go and things would go back to normal."

It's an idea. What do you think? How attainable is it?
 
thats a good idea. i second it!

@dan
as far as i know anyway, karadoc didnt mess with any game speed stuff, gamespeedinfo.xml is the main file for adjusting that and he didn't include a new one in any release so far. i dont see how the ai would be at any disadvantage at slower game speeds. but maybe someone who knows more will chime in. have you noticed some deficencies on marathon or something?
 
I got another noob question: is the AI totally capable of forsee and plan in Epic or even Marathon gamespeeds, or their skill gets reduced?
Well, there is no special code to intentionally reduced the AI's ability on the slower speeds; and many of their decisions do take the game speed into account... so if they don't play as well on those speeds I suppose it's just because their strategies just aren't that flexible... One point I think is worth mentioning is that choosing the wrong techs to research is more costly on slower game speeds - so the AI's sloppy choice of tech is probably hurting it a fair bit.

I have an idea for improving control of gameplay: a "suppress unit cycling" hotkey. [...]

I think that would be possible; and probably useful. Unfortunately, all the good keys seem to be used already... Do you have any suggestions for which key(s) to use?

Currently, when I don't want to cycle units, I use '\' to return to the unit after I've moved it.
 
I don't think those first two things are bugs. The first one is probably just a result of 'trade culture'. (Trade culture would only usually have a relatively minor impact on the culture of the area; but if the original civilization gets completely eliminated, then the trade culture may turn out to be the only culture remaining.) The second thing, about the multiple units being built, is not a bug. That's just what happens if you have far more productivity than is required to build the unit - the excess overflow goes towards the training of another unit.

Both trade culture and the multi-building of units were discussed recently in this thread, a couple of pages back I think.

The barbarian colours in the worldbuilder is a bug that I didn't know about. Thanks for pointing it out. I'll try to fix it soon. (The bug is due to some changes I made to hide the identity of unmet players in multiplayer games. As I mentioned in the changelog, I was kind of expected some bugs like this to pop up.) However, I don't know what you mean by "sometimes the mod changes the base color of civilizations". I can't think of anything I've done which would cause that. ... Maybe I'll find the answer when I'm fixing the other bug.

As for settling on resources... well, without seeing particular examples I couldn't say if it's a mistake or not; but in general I can say that the AI will sometimes choose to settle on a resources if they think they wouldn't get much benefit from the usual plot improvement anyway. If they can get some extra food or hammers in the city plot by settling on the resource, they won't mind quite as much about missing out on the usual improvement. (I'm not saying that they'll actually aim to settle on the resources, but rather that they won't mind doing it if they think it's going to get them a better city location.)

Ok, thanks for the fast respond; this thread goes so fast that I can't keep up. I still think that the AI could see the overall layout for settling places better as sometimes I think that it could be better to settle two decent cities than one really good but it depends much situation however.
 
I like the idea of a suppressor button too. I suggest using C, since in the base game C does the same thing as Enter.
 
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