K-Mod: Far Beyond the Sword

[/QUOTE]About the unit selection bug; I don't properly understand what you mean. So that I can understand better, please tell me what button(s) you are pressing; what you expect to happen; and what actually happens.

I currently can't think of any way to select all units of a particular type other than with ctrl+left click. So if there was another way, I may well have broken it without ever knowing it existed!
Apr 23, 2012 01:04 PM
I have a similar bug. The "move all units of any/every type"-button (not just all units of one type) does not work. It just activates the first unit on the field.

Thanks for all your efforts for tius great mod!:goodjob:
Click to expand...
 
Bernd-das-Brot said:
I have a similar bug. The "move all units of any/every type"-button (not just all units of one type) does not work. It just activates the first unit on the field.
Click to expand...
I see which button you're talking about. The button on the control panel which is labelled "Go To Mode (All Units)". You're right. That button was broken as a side effect of the new double-click-to-wake functionality. I'll see if I can fix it without undoing the new double-click thing. (I reckon the new double-click functionality is much better than the old.)

The button labelled "Go To Mode (Same Unit Type)" seems to work correctly. (And I can't think of any reason why it shouldn't.)
 
WOW, that was fast! Thank you for fixing that button bug;)

Annoyingly I forgot to report another bug yesterday. This is more complicated, because I saw it several times in the last games, but I don't really know how to reproduce it, perhaps because it is only a problem in team multiplayer.
Anyway the bug is that sometimes, when I whip an emergency warrior in the barb era, I get two (!) warriors as a result in the same turn. Besides being very helpful, this feels a bit like cheating ;)

Can you look at the code without a save? I try to remember next time to set autosave interval to 1, so I can provide a save of the turn before, but this won't be in the next days.
 
I dont know if Karadoc implemented "multiple build" or "multiple research". If so thats a feature not a bug ;)
 
TheOnlyDJCat said:
WOW, that was fast! Thank you for fixing that button bug;)

Annoyingly I forgot to report another bug yesterday. This is more complicated, because I saw it several times in the last games, but I don't really know how to reproduce it, perhaps because it is only a problem in team multiplayer.
Anyway the bug is that sometimes, when I whip an emergency warrior in the barb era, I get two (!) warriors as a result in the same turn. Besides being very helpful, this feels a bit like cheating ;)

Can you look at the code without a save? I try to remember next time to set autosave interval to 1, so I can provide a save of the turn before, but this won't be in the next days.
Click to expand...

I had this happen to me too, but I just assumed that it was a feature. I guess whether it is or not depends on if the AI get the same bonus or if only the human does.
 
The multi-build thing is a feature.

The way it works is that when you have more overflow than the maximum carry-over overflow (which is equal to the cost of the thing you are building), the leftover hammers get applied directly to another unit of the same type.

For example, suppose you have a city which generates 40:hammers: per turn, and you start building a warrior from scratch.
  • 15:hammers: are used to create the warrior.
  • 15:hammers: will be carried over to the next turn (so that you'll have 55:hammers: from the city rather than 40.)
  • The remaining 10:hammers: will applied as progress on a second warrior. (In the original BtS rules, these 10:hammers: would instead be converted into gold.)
In that turn you would just get 1 warrior, but have 10 hammers of progress towards a second warrior. If you choose to build a warrior again on the next turn...
  • 5:hammers: will be used to finish the warrior.
  • 15:hammers: will be carried over to the next turn as overflow
  • 15:hammers: will be used to finish a second warrior
  • 15:hammers: will be used to finish a third warrior!
  • The final 5:hammers: will be applied as progress on yet another warrior.
and so in that turn, you'll actually completely 3 warriors in just one city. (It makes me wonder if warriors should cost 20:hammers: instead of just 15... but that's another matter.)

The reason I made this multi-build change was that I didn't like how easy it was to max-out production in a city. ie. It was pretty normal to have a city which could build any unit at all in just a single turn, and so the additional productivity just wasn't very useful. Also, cheap units were essentially neglected (particularly cruise missiles), because they would result in even more wasted productivity.
 
So I play 8 more turns of that save I left for Karadoc, turns out the ai starts moving its main army to protect its cities after the 8 turns...
 
I don't have a specific save detailing it, but I also noticed it in TMIT's let's play with the K-mod... the governor has a strange obsession with running artist specialists and unless you want border pops these things usually aren't too hot.

And omg you have a new version... will try it out after I finish my games in progress. How compatible is 1.28 with the others?
 
The most common reason for Civs switching to despotism is losing the pyramids... but in this case, I think Cyrus probably did the switch-civics espionage mission on him. Washington certainly does not want to be a despot.

As for the artists being a bit too common. I agree. That's something that I'm aware of, but I haven't thought of how best to deal with it yet. I could just tell the governor to value culture a bit lower (and that might be a good idea), but I think that would have some unwanted side effects...

Version 1.28 should be completely compatible with saves from the previous version.
 
Thanks for the new version karadoc :)

I think there is a movement bug in this version( 1.28 ). After changing a movement course to a unit, in the next turn that unit will not move. Here is the step to reproduce it, it's all happen in one turn:
1. Select scout and order him to move, make a far one so he didn't reach the destination in one turn.
2. After the move completed ( do not let him reach his destination ), do not click end turn. Instead select the scout and change his course.
3. Still in the same turn, click the already changing course scout so the game will highlight him. In screen you will see the scout route and how much turn he needed to reach destination.
4. Click end turn

When the next turn start the scout will not move like i described. In the unmodded bts, the unit will move to destination even if i used the step i mentioned earlier.
 
The behaviour that you describe actually is not a bug. It's a side effect of one of the changes in the changelog: "The automoves phase for human players now will not automatically activate when one of the automoves units is selected."

My reason for the change is that I don't like when I select a unit to cancel an order, only to have the unit immediately execute the order that I was trying to cancel.

In your example, I would expect your scout to execute the order either when you press ctrl+a (to manually activate automoves), or when you've dealt with all your other units (either by issuing orders to each of them, or by just pressing "w" to cycle through them without issuing orders). If the scout is the only unit you have, then it will move as soon as you deselect it.

So, do you dislike the change?
 
I, for one, prefer the change. It's so annoying when I click on a unit to avoid a barb but it continues onward. The odd thing is that the auto behavior didn't make the workers complete their improvements, which is the only advantage of the original system :crazyeye:

On the culture thing, is it possible to set limits based on how much culture the city has? As far as I know, that's how the vanilla governor evaluated them. Of course, I personally try not to need border pops whenever I can, so even without the first border pop, I'd rather use all resource tiles available first.

I'm still rather new to the mod, but I still think that adding an extra commerce to farms while in serfdom might not be the best way to make it worth giving up slavery for. I don't know about anyone else, but when I build farms on non-resources, it's so that I can whip more (a grassland farm gives you more production than almost any other non-resource--the exception is a grassland mine). Without slavery, there's little reason to build farms.

Maybe you could try switching Serfdom and Vassalage's bonuses? I.e. serfdom gets the lowered maintenance and vassalage gets the commerce bonus.
 
In my current multiplayer team game, we had passed the global threshold for warming by a large margin, we then declared on the backwards, non-teching continent and unleashed an enormous number of nukes over a long period, like 30 turns. Mostly to see what effect it would have on global warming, but partially cause it's fun to nuke the hell out of someone. What we found however is that the global warming index went from near 1000 to nearly 0 after turning most of that continent into a glowing yellow wasteland. Shouldn't that much fallout be causing some sort of global..... something? A nuclear winter maybe? or massive warming? Perhaps thats beyond the scope of your mod. Seemed odd thats all.
 
I don't really want to think about civics at the moment... but in general, I actually think the serfdom change works really well. -- If you want to know how many farms you have, open the stats page of the info screen (F9). I think you'll find that around the time of serfdom, you'll typically have far more farms and plantations than towns; and so that means serfdom will be giving you a significant commerce boost; and it has lower upkeep and faster workers compared to slavery. It's actually quite a powerful civic in the mid-game. (But it kind of obsoletes itself in the late-game with the penalty to towns.)


Regarding the overuse of artists, the problem is that the value of commerce currently includes a factor called "average commerce exchange", which is meant to represent how much each commerce type is worth in terms of raw commerce. It's a number that gets smaller when you build more commerce multipliers buildings. For example, if you have libraries in every city, and you're running 100% science, then the science "average commerce exchange" will be 80%... but for culture it will be 100%.

Anyway, the point is that with the current system, culture becomes more valued when you build multiplier buildings for other commerce types. (libraries, markets, etc); and so cities start employing artists because they think artists are valuable.

This kind of behaviour makes some sense for espionage and gold; because it's good to employ spies and merchants in cities where the science multiplier is sub-par, rather than having scientists everywhere; but for artists, it doesn't really help. Gold, espionage, and science, are things that are always useful and which accumulate across your entire civilization, whereas culture is city local rather than civ wide, and it isn't always useful. So just because a city might be better suited to culture than other commerce types doesn't mean it should be running artists...

Anyway, that's the problem in a nutshell. I'm just about to start a test game where I remove the average commerce exchange factor for all commerce types, and compensate the loss of that factor with some other changes. It might be nice to remove the factor just for culture alone, but that would have some scaling problems...


Regarding nukes and global warming... in the unmodded game, nukes were the primary cause of global warming. But in K-Mod they have no direct effect at all. The reasons the nukes in your game actually decreased the global warming index is that they would have significantly reduced the pollution output of your enemies - because all their cities would have been trashed.

It's true that mass-nukes would realistically have a significant effect on the earth's climate - but I don't it would be global warming. Maybe nuclear winter or something like that... but that's just not implemented. I'm not sure if I'll ever implement it, because it's not clear to me exactly how it should work (for gameplay or for realism). For now I'm content to just say that the fallout created by nukes is their sole contribution. I've already changed fallout to last slightly longer before disappearing naturally. I'm considering also changing it so that if the game tries to place fallout on a plot which already has fallout, then the new fallout should be placed on a neighbouring plot rather than not placed at all. That would have essentially no effect in games which only have a few nukes, but it could potentially create a significant amount of additional fallout in nuke-heavy games.
 
The behaviour that you describe actually is not a bug. It's a side effect of one of the changes in the changelog: "The automoves phase for human players now will not automatically activate when one of the automoves units is selected."

My reason for the change is that I don't like when I select a unit to cancel an order, only to have the unit immediately execute the order that I was trying to cancel.
Click to expand...

Sorry but i don't too understand what you mean. Isn't in the vanilla bts the automoves unit will not automatically activated/continue the order immediately when that unit is selected?

Please correct me if i'm mistaken, in unmodded bts the unit i select when it still have movement point and destination WILL NOT move by itself ( the only way to select automove unit with it's full movement point reserved in k-mod and vanilla i think is we must have at least two unit, the first unit finish it's movement and second unit which is the unit in automove still on it's way ). selected unit will waiting until we give the new order. So i think the automove unit will not automatically activate when we select it even in vanilla ( and k-mod ).

The only differences/effect i feel for the change you make about automoves is what i mention in my previous post, which is the unit will not move in the beginning of next turn if course changed and selected.

I hope you understand what i mean:blush:
 
I just did some tests using the steps you describe in this post; if the scout is not the only unit awake at the start of the new turn, the scout will not immediately move in either the unmodded game nor in K-Mod.

On the other hand, if the scout is the only awake unit at the start of the new turn, it will immediately move in the unmodded game, but not in K-Mod - because of the change I mentioned.

The "automoves" phase is usually triggered automatically when all units have been cycled through; but in the newest version of K-Mod this automatic trigger is blocked if you happen to have one of the automoves units selected. -- In the unmodded game, if the scout is your only unit, and it has a command already issued, then there will not be any units to cycle through and so automoves will be triggered immediate. In K-Mod this will be blocked if you happen to have the scout selected.

But really, I don't care much what the behaviour is in the unmodded game. I'm not trying to make this the same as the unmodded game. I only care about what is best. So -- do you think the new behaviour is bad? Or is it ok?



In other news, I'm thinking of buffing the Panzar. I'm considering giving it the Flanking I promotion for free.
 
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