Cyrus isn't worth taking out, in my opinion. He has no land left worth taking. Right now, he's being a nice barrier for you, making sure nobody else can expand there. I would just take a city or two, get peace, and liberate so you're not his worst enemy anymore. The main focus should be on the east. Qin and Catherine are the most directly threatening AIs left on the map (with Cyrus completing the trinity). Qin is at war with you, while Catherine is still friendly (though she does declare war very easily). So this is the perfect time to take him out (he hasn't even collected vassals yet).
King of the World #7: Saladin
- Thread starter Neal
- Start date
I've got no idea why people are advocating a conquest of Cyrus, his land is worthless and he provides a barrier against attacks from the North, be they Barbarian, Russian, or Mongolian. I would burn his capital though, its culture is starting to become a bit of an issue in Persepolis. Just keep him useless, so long as he's trapped in that desert wasteland his unit production isn't going to be sufficient to really harm you.
Now that hatty is gone, I'd suggest two cities in Africa for the time being, nab the south african site with gems/gold and the site near Lake Victoria for the silver, the luxuries will save you a lot of trouble and the cities will pay for themselves for the most part.
After that, you'll either be hitting India or Greece with the distant third choice of Russia. Alexander is the easier target, though he's one of your few friends. If you do go for India you'll need to move into China fairly quickly and put your Forbidden Palace up in the East. China+Japan+Indochina is a viable alternative to Europe, you've got similar tons of resources and grassland but it's further away and more consolidated, being controlled by three countries (though one is always horridly backwards) rather than the six or seven of Europe.
Now that hatty is gone, I'd suggest two cities in Africa for the time being, nab the south african site with gems/gold and the site near Lake Victoria for the silver, the luxuries will save you a lot of trouble and the cities will pay for themselves for the most part.
After that, you'll either be hitting India or Greece with the distant third choice of Russia. Alexander is the easier target, though he's one of your few friends. If you do go for India you'll need to move into China fairly quickly and put your Forbidden Palace up in the East. China+Japan+Indochina is a viable alternative to Europe, you've got similar tons of resources and grassland but it's further away and more consolidated, being controlled by three countries (though one is always horridly backwards) rather than the six or seven of Europe.
Pacifist46
King
Have to say I agree with the people saying to NOT attack Cyrus, he's a spent force in this game due to your early attack, and with a bit of luck he'll prevent Catherine from growing too big. The other AI that normally does well is Qin, so you should definitely aim towards taking him out. That makes India the best choice for your next conquest IMO. You'll probably find Hattie has a barb city over that way somewhere anyway, so you can wipe her out as you go.
vanatteveldt
Emperor
At least there is still some semblance of realism left in CIV 
Stewie0416
Who Cares?
This round was productive... But at what cost?
Things started innocently enough. I changed over our settlement names, swapped some city tile assignments around to better reflect their raisons d'etre, and declared peace with everyone except those pesky Persians. The Chinese wanted 10 gold to stop their infrequent raids, but the Egyptians (wherever they might be hiding) gave us 100 gold to call off the dogs.
The Buddhists, meanwhile, elected their Pope:
Fittingly enough, they voted in Julius Caesar. This was to become hilarious when he converted to Judaism a hundred years later. As you can see, we also earned a bit of spare change off the Hanging Gardens. I wasn't really planning on finishing that, anyway.
The remnants of my western army trudged deeper into the heart of darkness, finding whole cities that owed their allegiance to no empire:
That's a pretty bad infestation y'got there, ma'am. Them nests ain't gonna be easy to knock out. They weren't a total pain, but they tied up military resources that ended up being sorely missed on the Eastern Front.
On the other side of the empire, we hunkered down with the Persians, who honestly weren't much better than Barbarians:
Persia's new capitol burned. Cyrus was suitably chastened. I allowed him to buy his freedom. Again.
He ended up rebuilding, but by now, Persepolis' culture had become entrenched enough that it wasn't a worry.
So it was time to start gearing up for war with India. We just needed to train up a few more Catapults, and...
*Huff* Fine. Asoka's kind of a softy, anyway. He's got the tech, but he doesn't tend to build units. Little was I to know, this wasn't going to be a walk in the park. I also got involved in another phony war with China. Another petty bribe ended it, which is a good thing- I didn't want to have to dodge Chinese forces in the middle of India! A Holy War edict against Alexander was barely knocked down, too. That would have been awkward.
In 415, I completed my first Wonder (my first built Wonder, anyway):
It was a cheap build, and, honestly, my concern was more to keep it out of the hands of a future target.
Our stack finally retook that strip of land between Persia and India proper:
You'll notice that there are no Spearmen in my stack. That was to cost me later, when Asoka started bringing Elephants to bear.
With Machinery finished, it was time to go out to the market and get ripped off:
It was worth it to get Vassalage Macemen in the field.
In 520, we spawned our first Great Person:
We popped him for an Academy in Pasagar... Um, Basra. Maybe bulbing Philosophy was the right move. I dunno.
75 years later, everything went to hell:
My forces were camped outside Delhi, stripping away its culture. I couldn't afford to let Asoka slip away! I had to defy the resolution (which would have passed had I simply voted no). So it's official. I'm a heel.
Back west, I founded Nairobi to claim African silver and gems:
Why found two crappy cities when you only need one? And with those lake tiles being pumped up by a Lighthouse, both resources can be worked.
In 700 A.D., after decades of bloody battle outside Delhi (which I thought I had more pictures of), the city finally fell:
After using Catapults to tear down the walls, and suiciding them against its garrisons, my forces were sacked by Indian War Elephants. Without Pikes or even Spears in the stack, and with the siege expended, those were hell and a half to dislodge, and meanwhile, my home cities are burning because of my defiance of the Hindu Pope. Who happens to be Jewish
Delhi is a heck of a prize, though. The Pyramids are always nice, and the Hagia Sophia, while not worth building, is certainly worth taking. The question is whether I should press on with my patchwork army. I'm sure that Asoka's garrisons are in equally bad shape, but both my troops and my citizenry could use a breather. Obviously, I need to vote for the next AP Resolution, whether I like it or not, to get that ridiculous "villain" label off my record.
Here's a look at the map. First, India and Persia:
The core:
And a look at Africa:
A peek at the Power Graph:
And the military screen:
Finally, the (cluttered) Dimplomacy screen:
The army is licking its wounds, but it's done its job. For now, the biggest problem is all of those red frowny faces everywhere. Part of me wants to disperse the army into police forces to maintain order via HR, though, now that we own the Pyramids, a dip into Representation for the happiness boost might also be reasonable.
We're not screwed, by any stretch of the imagination, though we have hit a few snags, and we're bogged down. We might not have time for our Domination win, but I'm not too worried.
The save:
Things started innocently enough. I changed over our settlement names, swapped some city tile assignments around to better reflect their raisons d'etre, and declared peace with everyone except those pesky Persians. The Chinese wanted 10 gold to stop their infrequent raids, but the Egyptians (wherever they might be hiding) gave us 100 gold to call off the dogs.
The Buddhists, meanwhile, elected their Pope:
Fittingly enough, they voted in Julius Caesar. This was to become hilarious when he converted to Judaism a hundred years later. As you can see, we also earned a bit of spare change off the Hanging Gardens. I wasn't really planning on finishing that, anyway.
The remnants of my western army trudged deeper into the heart of darkness, finding whole cities that owed their allegiance to no empire:
That's a pretty bad infestation y'got there, ma'am. Them nests ain't gonna be easy to knock out. They weren't a total pain, but they tied up military resources that ended up being sorely missed on the Eastern Front.
On the other side of the empire, we hunkered down with the Persians, who honestly weren't much better than Barbarians:
Persia's new capitol burned. Cyrus was suitably chastened. I allowed him to buy his freedom. Again.
He ended up rebuilding, but by now, Persepolis' culture had become entrenched enough that it wasn't a worry.
So it was time to start gearing up for war with India. We just needed to train up a few more Catapults, and...
*Huff* Fine. Asoka's kind of a softy, anyway. He's got the tech, but he doesn't tend to build units. Little was I to know, this wasn't going to be a walk in the park. I also got involved in another phony war with China. Another petty bribe ended it, which is a good thing- I didn't want to have to dodge Chinese forces in the middle of India! A Holy War edict against Alexander was barely knocked down, too. That would have been awkward.
In 415, I completed my first Wonder (my first built Wonder, anyway):
It was a cheap build, and, honestly, my concern was more to keep it out of the hands of a future target.
Our stack finally retook that strip of land between Persia and India proper:
You'll notice that there are no Spearmen in my stack. That was to cost me later, when Asoka started bringing Elephants to bear.
With Machinery finished, it was time to go out to the market and get ripped off:
It was worth it to get Vassalage Macemen in the field.
In 520, we spawned our first Great Person:
We popped him for an Academy in Pasagar... Um, Basra. Maybe bulbing Philosophy was the right move. I dunno.
75 years later, everything went to hell:
My forces were camped outside Delhi, stripping away its culture. I couldn't afford to let Asoka slip away! I had to defy the resolution (which would have passed had I simply voted no). So it's official. I'm a heel.
Back west, I founded Nairobi to claim African silver and gems:
Why found two crappy cities when you only need one? And with those lake tiles being pumped up by a Lighthouse, both resources can be worked.
In 700 A.D., after decades of bloody battle outside Delhi (which I thought I had more pictures of), the city finally fell:
After using Catapults to tear down the walls, and suiciding them against its garrisons, my forces were sacked by Indian War Elephants. Without Pikes or even Spears in the stack, and with the siege expended, those were hell and a half to dislodge, and meanwhile, my home cities are burning because of my defiance of the Hindu Pope. Who happens to be Jewish
Delhi is a heck of a prize, though. The Pyramids are always nice, and the Hagia Sophia, while not worth building, is certainly worth taking. The question is whether I should press on with my patchwork army. I'm sure that Asoka's garrisons are in equally bad shape, but both my troops and my citizenry could use a breather. Obviously, I need to vote for the next AP Resolution, whether I like it or not, to get that ridiculous "villain" label off my record.
Here's a look at the map. First, India and Persia:
The core:
And a look at Africa:
A peek at the Power Graph:
And the military screen:
Finally, the (cluttered) Dimplomacy screen:
The army is licking its wounds, but it's done its job. For now, the biggest problem is all of those red frowny faces everywhere. Part of me wants to disperse the army into police forces to maintain order via HR, though, now that we own the Pyramids, a dip into Representation for the happiness boost might also be reasonable.
We're not screwed, by any stretch of the imagination, though we have hit a few snags, and we're bogged down. We might not have time for our Domination win, but I'm not too worried.
The save:
Shoot the Moon
Playing World in Conflict
- Joined
- Dec 24, 2005
- Messages
- 708
520 is your first GP?
You really need to choose a GP farm sooner (as I remember you neglected it last game too).
You really need to choose a GP farm sooner (as I remember you neglected it last game too).Phinaeus
Chieftain
Are you planning on eventually backfilling the horn of africa? Or will you just let Mansa fill those spaces and you take them later in the final push to domination?
Jet
No, no, please. Please.
- Joined
- Mar 16, 2006
- Messages
- 2,419
Definitely don't disperse your army as MP with gems and silver coming up. Settle the city for gold, too. Whip the Forges, then a Settler in Aswan and two Jewish missionaries in Cairo.
Research Literature instead of Guilds and build the HE and NE.
Cancel the Pikeman in Tehran and go for Notre Dame. Doesn't that work for the whole old world on this map?
Research Literature instead of Guilds and build the HE and NE.
Cancel the Pikeman in Tehran and go for Notre Dame. Doesn't that work for the whole old world on this map?
Ugh, AP resolutions are so annoying, you shouldn't be penalized for disobeying them if your state religion is not that of the AP. But you're doing fine anyways, Nairobi's silver and gems will be handy in helping with that 
when they come online but until then your cities aren't exactly going to be powerhouses.
Not really much to say at this point. Eventually you should nab the South African gold site but it's not really an urgent need. Kill Asoka (or at least knock him off the mainland, as he usually colonizes Indonesia/Australia to some extent) and move onto China and Japan, put your FP up somewhere in the far east then prepare to move into Europe. Mongolia is also a viable target while your army is in the far east, but they usually only have a few decent cities and they're almost always underdeveloped.
Once you kill Asoka start sending ships east, you'll need transports to assault Japan and building them in China just takes too long, you'll also be using those ships to eventually destroy whoever colonized Indonesia, though that isn't a pressing need.
I say attack China at this point because having enemies on all sides of your empire can be a real pain, at least Mansa/Alex like you, but if you attack Alex then you'd have everyone on your borders hating you.
And yes, Notre Dame works for every tile of land in the old world excluding the islands like Brittan.
when they come online but until then your cities aren't exactly going to be powerhouses.Not really much to say at this point. Eventually you should nab the South African gold site but it's not really an urgent need. Kill Asoka (or at least knock him off the mainland, as he usually colonizes Indonesia/Australia to some extent) and move onto China and Japan, put your FP up somewhere in the far east then prepare to move into Europe. Mongolia is also a viable target while your army is in the far east, but they usually only have a few decent cities and they're almost always underdeveloped.
Once you kill Asoka start sending ships east, you'll need transports to assault Japan and building them in China just takes too long, you'll also be using those ships to eventually destroy whoever colonized Indonesia, though that isn't a pressing need.
I say attack China at this point because having enemies on all sides of your empire can be a real pain, at least Mansa/Alex like you, but if you attack Alex then you'd have everyone on your borders hating you.
And yes, Notre Dame works for every tile of land in the old world excluding the islands like Brittan.
Gooblah
Heh...
- Joined
- Jun 5, 2007
- Messages
- 4,282
Why domination?
You could easily take Conquest due to your central location. Try to buff up your army and make as many friends as quickly as possible. Start converting some cities into GP Farms and increase population. You'll carry more weight in the AP. Your warpath should be simple: enemies first, friends second. Who is your greatest threat currently? Julius Caesar. I'd be willing to bet that his army is holed up in one city. Tech Engineering for Pikemen and Trebuchets, then launch an all-out assault on Rome. Take it out, and you have a launching site for European wars. Madrid, Paris, and Berlin are the jewels, just raze/replace the rest. With Central Europe in your command, you'll have the resource base necessary to tech faster and build harder...
You could easily take Conquest due to your central location. Try to buff up your army and make as many friends as quickly as possible. Start converting some cities into GP Farms and increase population. You'll carry more weight in the AP. Your warpath should be simple: enemies first, friends second. Who is your greatest threat currently? Julius Caesar. I'd be willing to bet that his army is holed up in one city. Tech Engineering for Pikemen and Trebuchets, then launch an all-out assault on Rome. Take it out, and you have a launching site for European wars. Madrid, Paris, and Berlin are the jewels, just raze/replace the rest. With Central Europe in your command, you'll have the resource base necessary to tech faster and build harder...
JammerUno
King
I suggest deviation from the normal play and say:
Rebuild the army, find the AP and torch damn the thing, then head back home. Then I would concentrate on Africa for the time being, it's easily taken and not too shabby for producing units. While the far east promises better lands, you'll need to support shabby cities to the north of India and Iran to connect your empire. The final result might well be thesame.
Rebuild the army, find the AP and torch damn the thing, then head back home. Then I would concentrate on Africa for the time being, it's easily taken and not too shabby for producing units. While the far east promises better lands, you'll need to support shabby cities to the north of India and Iran to connect your empire. The final result might well be thesame.
Joshua368
Warmongering builder
- Joined
- Jun 12, 2008
- Messages
- 3,072
Just want to point out that the "-5 The world considers you a villain!" penalty is not going to go away when you agree to an AP resolution. All that does it if you had the AP as your state religion, it'd bring you back as a full member, a status which you would have lost defying. Since it isn't your state religion anyway, it won't help you at all (unless you lost your hammer bonus, I dunno). Razing the AP won't get rid of it either, though of course it'd stop any future issues from coming up.
You have to wait for the unhappiness to disappear by itself. This takes 20 turns on normal speed, so I believe 30 turns on epic. However this time is halved (or more) by different religions in effected cities, so if you want you can spread other religions into Buddhist cities to help lessen the effect.
You have to wait for the unhappiness to disappear by itself. This takes 20 turns on normal speed, so I believe 30 turns on epic. However this time is halved (or more) by different religions in effected cities, so if you want you can spread other religions into Buddhist cities to help lessen the effect.
pigswill
fly (one day)
Worth picking up literature for HE to build the army faster (combined with a mil instructor for lvl3 units regardless of civics).
You seem to have run out of seige weapons. Better build some more if you're planning on capturing any cities.
Watch out for Jules. He's more powerful than you, annoyed and you can't talk to him.
You seem to have run out of seige weapons. Better build some more if you're planning on capturing any cities.
Watch out for Jules. He's more powerful than you, annoyed and you can't talk to him.
Never been a "villian" in one of my games, looking forward to seeing the impact of that! Is it better to agree to peace (for 10 turns) and resume the war after the AP resolution, or to have many civs angry with you. I guess there are already a lot of civs "furious" so why worry, right?
Also, do I see correctly that there are some light blue vassal lines on the FA screen? Looks like Frederick has lines with Cyrus and Elizabeth?
Also, do I see correctly that there are some light blue vassal lines on the FA screen? Looks like Frederick has lines with Cyrus and Elizabeth?
Joshua368
Warmongering builder
- Joined
- Jun 12, 2008
- Messages
- 3,072
Being an AP villain doesn't actually effect your relations with any civs at all, they don't care. All it does is degrade you from a full member and, more importantly, stick 5
is any city with the AP religion.re: Domination vs. Conquest- I did Conquest in the Isabella game, so I'd like to try my hand at Domination here, even if it isn't ideal.
re: The AP- Okay, so you just have to ride it out. I think I can do that. Even with riots empirewide, it's not like we've totally stopped functioning. If you defy two resolutions, does it go to +10 or do you simply extend the unhappiness? The only thing that worries me is that Caesar isn't too fond of me, and he loves Asoka. If the war is still on, he might just try again to stop the war, which I'd be fine with at this point. If I call things off on my own, though, he might try something like making me give back Delhi.
re: Africa- I'm all for letting Mansa do my dirty work for me. Then I can take it from him in the endgame, if necessary.
re: GP Farms- Yeah, I know. I'd just rather devote my high-food sites to Cottage cities. I'm kind of wasting the Madrassa by waiting this long for a GP Farm.
re: The AP- Okay, so you just have to ride it out. I think I can do that. Even with riots empirewide, it's not like we've totally stopped functioning. If you defy two resolutions, does it go to +10 or do you simply extend the unhappiness? The only thing that worries me is that Caesar isn't too fond of me, and he loves Asoka. If the war is still on, he might just try again to stop the war, which I'd be fine with at this point. If I call things off on my own, though, he might try something like making me give back Delhi.
re: Africa- I'm all for letting Mansa do my dirty work for me. Then I can take it from him in the endgame, if necessary.
re: GP Farms- Yeah, I know. I'd just rather devote my high-food sites to Cottage cities. I'm kind of wasting the Madrassa by waiting this long for a GP Farm.
Joshua368
Warmongering builder
- Joined
- Jun 12, 2008
- Messages
- 3,072
It does indeed stack to -10, each -5 wearing off individually. So if you have to defy the next resolution your cities will jump to -10 for a bit, and once the first resolution's 30-turn period is up they'll drop back to -5 until the second one wears off. Go for the -15!
Yes, I have a lot of experience with defying resolutions.
Who owns the AP? I'm gonna go back and check. Usually if I'm fighting against it I'll locate the dang thing and make burning it to the ground a high priority, regardless of what else is in its city. And then call up my friends and throw a party on the ashes. Screw those +2 hammers.
Edit: Ah, it's deep in Rome. Bummer.
