Shoot the Moon
Playing World in Conflict
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- Dec 24, 2005
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Not sure if you've seen the map, but compared to the other civs' starting locations on this map, it is quite crummy.
King of the World #8: Shaka
- Thread starter Neal
- Start date
Not sure if you've seen the map, but compared to the other civs' starting locations on this map, it is quite crummy.
Point13
Like a ton of bricks!
Well of course, odds are he'll want to relocate it to center his Empire a little more anyways. Unless he has a really good spot for the Forbidden Palace.
huerfanista
Emperor
- Joined
- Dec 25, 2006
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- 1,276
and 2
from the city square. D'oh 
slobberinbear
Ursine Skald
The point here is that with the happy resources and low food, things like religion and hereditary rule are pretty much irrelevant. On this map, Shaka's early game is all about expansion, peaceful and otherwise.
huerfanista
Emperor
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- 1,276
capnvonbaron
Democratia gladii
These KotW threads are starting to become a forum in their own. 3 pages and the story hasn't even started yet 
Look at this monster you've created, Neal!!
Totally awesome.
Look at this monster you've created, Neal!!
Totally awesome.
Pieman
Prince
These KotW threads are starting to become a forum in their own. 3 pages and the story hasn't even started yet
Look at this monster you've created, Neal!!
Perhaps we've found the successor to the ALC series...
Let's get this ball rolling.
The game began with the founding of Ulundi in the harsh but resource-rich plains of South Africa:
As you can see, I started out building a Worker and researching Fishing. Production switched to a Work Boat as soon as it became available.
The Scout headed north and snagged 39 Gold from a hut. I allowed border pops to open the hut just outside the capital and...
Not that I need to do a lot of exploring, but he'll definitely come in handy keeping an eye on the hinterlands. Thar be Barbarians in them thar hills.
In 3100 B.C., the Random Number Generator proved to be a harsh and unforgiving god:
If this were an offline game, I'd throw up my hands and restart. They're minor setbacks, to be sure, but when they come this early, I shudder to think what the snowball effect might be. But these games have been cakewalks lately, so I'm gonna roll with it. If we die, we die.
And, y'know what? It could have been worse. We could have been Gandhi:
That tells me two things. One, it's time to start worrying about city defense. Two, whoever moves into the Indian subcontinent first is going to be an absolute superpower. My money's on Persia, but the Khmer could make a play.
In 2575, Bronze Working finally finished. I declined the Slavery option (as everyone has said, we don't really have the food surplus for it), but the ability to chop and find the Copper we have in our BFC (Woo!) certainly came in handy.
A few turns later, my Settler finished, and I decided to call an end to the round:
I'm not seeing a lot of great places to found the second city. My initial impulse is to put it on that little bay to the west, though there's also something to be said for going north. Maybe around where I founded Nairobi in the Saladin game. It'll run into Ethiopian cultural pressure, but I don't think Zara is for long in this world.
So we have two Warriors, two Scouts, a Worker, and a Settler. Ulundi has an Ikhanda built, and a Gold Mine, Crab Nets, a Cow Pasture, and a Farm set up. No Roads yet, though. Here's a look at our Science situation:
Certainly not what I'd call smooth sailing, but I think we can make this work. So I guess my short-term question is, where do we send the Settler? Medium-term, should we adjust our strategy based upon our setbacks? And, long-term, how does the fall of India affect the global picture? As I'd said, I'll be out of town until Saturday, but I should be able to at least check in on the conversation every now and again.
Here's the save (Remember to load the mod first):
The game began with the founding of Ulundi in the harsh but resource-rich plains of South Africa:
As you can see, I started out building a Worker and researching Fishing. Production switched to a Work Boat as soon as it became available.
The Scout headed north and snagged 39 Gold from a hut. I allowed border pops to open the hut just outside the capital and...
Not that I need to do a lot of exploring, but he'll definitely come in handy keeping an eye on the hinterlands. Thar be Barbarians in them thar hills.
In 3100 B.C., the Random Number Generator proved to be a harsh and unforgiving god:
If this were an offline game, I'd throw up my hands and restart. They're minor setbacks, to be sure, but when they come this early, I shudder to think what the snowball effect might be. But these games have been cakewalks lately, so I'm gonna roll with it. If we die, we die.
And, y'know what? It could have been worse. We could have been Gandhi:
That tells me two things. One, it's time to start worrying about city defense. Two, whoever moves into the Indian subcontinent first is going to be an absolute superpower. My money's on Persia, but the Khmer could make a play.In 2575, Bronze Working finally finished. I declined the Slavery option (as everyone has said, we don't really have the food surplus for it), but the ability to chop and find the Copper we have in our BFC (Woo!) certainly came in handy.
A few turns later, my Settler finished, and I decided to call an end to the round:
I'm not seeing a lot of great places to found the second city. My initial impulse is to put it on that little bay to the west, though there's also something to be said for going north. Maybe around where I founded Nairobi in the Saladin game. It'll run into Ethiopian cultural pressure, but I don't think Zara is for long in this world.
So we have two Warriors, two Scouts, a Worker, and a Settler. Ulundi has an Ikhanda built, and a Gold Mine, Crab Nets, a Cow Pasture, and a Farm set up. No Roads yet, though. Here's a look at our Science situation:
Certainly not what I'd call smooth sailing, but I think we can make this work. So I guess my short-term question is, where do we send the Settler? Medium-term, should we adjust our strategy based upon our setbacks? And, long-term, how does the fall of India affect the global picture? As I'd said, I'll be out of town until Saturday, but I should be able to at least check in on the conversation every now and again.
Here's the save (Remember to load the mod first):
slobberinbear
Ursine Skald
Where to settle: There is a riverside coastal spot to Zara's south that grabs seafood and silver, IIRC. Take it before he does. That will really box him in, as he has no easy land route to central Africa.
For your third city, consider the area to the north / northwest of Ulundi. You have some riverside plains with elephants and another copper tile. Might as well deny it to the civs.
The southwestern tip of Africa isn't horrible (it has some of the only green un-jungled tiles around) and will be great for cottages, but I don't think it's the top priority now.
What to research: You need granaries, Neal. With such pitiful food surpluses, growth will be very hard to come by and you need to reach your production potential. So I'd go Wheel / Pottery / Iron Working next ... especially since you need to locate iron and you'll need to chop jungle at some point.
When to attack Zara: Sooner is better. He may have iron, after all. I'd hit him with a mixed stack of axes and impis (say a 70/30 ratio). His cultural defense will be scary and his capital may be on a hill, but you can do it. I'd say about 12-15 attacking units to be safe.
Nitpicks: you need to chop and farm that riverside grassland forest SW of Ulundi. I know that 3 food is no great shakes, but you'll need every last loaf to grow and work your commerce tiles.
For your third city, consider the area to the north / northwest of Ulundi. You have some riverside plains with elephants and another copper tile. Might as well deny it to the civs.
The southwestern tip of Africa isn't horrible (it has some of the only green un-jungled tiles around) and will be great for cottages, but I don't think it's the top priority now.
What to research: You need granaries, Neal. With such pitiful food surpluses, growth will be very hard to come by and you need to reach your production potential. So I'd go Wheel / Pottery / Iron Working next ... especially since you need to locate iron and you'll need to chop jungle at some point.
When to attack Zara: Sooner is better. He may have iron, after all. I'd hit him with a mixed stack of axes and impis (say a 70/30 ratio). His cultural defense will be scary and his capital may be on a hill, but you can do it. I'd say about 12-15 attacking units to be safe.
Nitpicks: you need to chop and farm that riverside grassland forest SW of Ulundi. I know that 3 food is no great shakes, but you'll need every last loaf to grow and work your commerce tiles.
Kwibuss
Warlord
And were off! A full week of thinking about strategies and plans.
I'm betting for atleast 5 pages before another post.
Phew tough start so far. Quite a bunch of bad luck, but we'll have to figure a way of overcoming it and I doubt it will really be a problem.
It's hard to judge about a 2nd city as I don't have a good picture of the map up north and don't have the map myself. The city spot to the west doesn't look all that fantastic as a 2nd city, but it does have gems.....
Oh and I agree about your feeling about Zara... he can't be around for that long. Maybe put down a 2nd city and start pumping those axes? Well that's what I would do
I'm betting for atleast 5 pages before another post.
Phew tough start so far. Quite a bunch of bad luck, but we'll have to figure a way of overcoming it and I doubt it will really be a problem.
It's hard to judge about a 2nd city as I don't have a good picture of the map up north and don't have the map myself. The city spot to the west doesn't look all that fantastic as a 2nd city, but it does have gems.....
Oh and I agree about your feeling about Zara... he can't be around for that long. Maybe put down a 2nd city and start pumping those axes? Well that's what I would do
I'm not sure I like what happened to gandhi but it'll definitely make the game more interesting (but probabely shorter)... 
If we plan on axerushing zara we don't need a second city (we already have copper) so we can keep on warring longer or keep more cities. If we want a city pre-rushing, it should be the city getting whale, gems and those FPs. It's easily defended and will add quite something to your eco with trade routes, FPs, river and gems.
Another option would be to REX and shoot for the GLH...
If we plan on axerushing zara we don't need a second city (we already have copper) so we can keep on warring longer or keep more cities. If we want a city pre-rushing, it should be the city getting whale, gems and those FPs. It's easily defended and will add quite something to your eco with trade routes, FPs, river and gems.
Another option would be to REX and shoot for the GLH...
CreeDakota
King
I would consider no more settlers for awhile, troops to steal land and using the food to grow would be a better investiment. After all Africa is destined to be all Zulu right?
Take Zara Out ASAP, so what if his capital sucks it can still make swordsmen.
Eypty as soon after as you can manage.
Let Mali develop things for you and build a shrine, take him out with cats
Take Zara Out ASAP, so what if his capital sucks it can still make swordsmen.
Eypty as soon after as you can manage.
Let Mali develop things for you and build a shrine, take him out with cats
Shoot the Moon
Playing World in Conflict
- Joined
- Dec 24, 2005
- Messages
- 708
I'd say found you second city somewhere good, then start building the army. doesn't seem like good enough land to warrant a third settler before you take out some civs.
Abegweit
Anarchist trader
slobberin is right about where to settle your next city. I believe it's a Gems and Fish spot actually and a pretty fair Moai site as well. It is simply the only decent city site in southern Africa aside from Ulundi itself. Of course, you will eventually want to settle the three fish sites to the west as well as the cottage country further to the north and get a phant at some point. That's six cities plus whatever gets dropped into the Congo. You will probably have to fight for that.
You could decide to go for quiet expansion and would likely achieve a dominant position quite quickly with your three gems and a gold. Ulundi would make a good settler/worker pump although, given the lack of food, it will take some time to get it up to speed.
The alternative, of course, is war. If you choose that, I would bypass Ethiopia and head for Egypt. Ethiopian lands are terrible and Aksum needs to be razed. Doing it now would give Saladin an opening. There is simply no reason to mass a huge army to take such a pitiful place. While it could be done, the opportunity cost is staggering. In contrast, Egypt has good land and taking a couple of Egyptian cities will give you a solid claim to the entire continent. Your Impis will do slaughter his War Chariots.
As for teching, given that you have a settler, the number one priority has to be Mysticism. You should have had it already actually. Every city site around requires a border pop. Alternatively, which would have been my choice, you could have built things other things than a settler (worker, Ikantha...) until you were ready to settle a city. Too late for that now...
Sailing is also very important for obvious reasons. So I would suggest Myst-Pots-Sailing-Wheel-Iron. While this is going on, you need to make a decision on which path to take. Either should work... but you are Shaka.
If the road is war, you will need one more worker and an Inkatha (throw in a granary and lighthouse somewhere. Then start building a road to Egypt and about ten troops. Your second city will be halfway there anyway.
You could decide to go for quiet expansion and would likely achieve a dominant position quite quickly with your three gems and a gold. Ulundi would make a good settler/worker pump although, given the lack of food, it will take some time to get it up to speed.
The alternative, of course, is war. If you choose that, I would bypass Ethiopia and head for Egypt. Ethiopian lands are terrible and Aksum needs to be razed. Doing it now would give Saladin an opening. There is simply no reason to mass a huge army to take such a pitiful place. While it could be done, the opportunity cost is staggering. In contrast, Egypt has good land and taking a couple of Egyptian cities will give you a solid claim to the entire continent. Your Impis will do slaughter his War Chariots.
As for teching, given that you have a settler, the number one priority has to be Mysticism. You should have had it already actually. Every city site around requires a border pop. Alternatively, which would have been my choice, you could have built things other things than a settler (worker, Ikantha...) until you were ready to settle a city. Too late for that now...
Sailing is also very important for obvious reasons. So I would suggest Myst-Pots-Sailing-Wheel-Iron. While this is going on, you need to make a decision on which path to take. Either should work... but you are Shaka.
If the road is war, you will need one more worker and an Inkatha (throw in a granary and lighthouse somewhere. Then start building a road to Egypt and about ten troops. Your second city will be halfway there anyway.
Impis are all you need to take out Egypt, and you have quite a while there to build.
Get some experienced troups by taking Ethiopia's cities. Aksum can be tough, its on a hill, and he'll spam lots and lots of archers. When I played this, I threw 5 straight C2 elephants at 65% odds after removing cultural defences, and they all lost!
Don't worry about economy; Ulundi is enough until you take Egypt's and/or Mali's. Just build cities and roads to hurry your army along. Cities 1-4 for Zulu should be production cities in this scenario, I think.
Get some experienced troups by taking Ethiopia's cities. Aksum can be tough, its on a hill, and he'll spam lots and lots of archers. When I played this, I threw 5 straight C2 elephants at 65% odds after removing cultural defences, and they all lost!
Don't worry about economy; Ulundi is enough until you take Egypt's and/or Mali's. Just build cities and roads to hurry your army along. Cities 1-4 for Zulu should be production cities in this scenario, I think.
JammerUno
King
There's always Madagaskar to keep in the back of our collective heads. Is it arid, or a lush piece of prime realestate just waiting to be claimed by the Zulu? A galley seems like a decent choice after sailing. If not for transporting some settlers to the island, then for making contact with all the other civs.
If Madagaskar warrants some settlers, I see a good chance for some peaceful expansion. Two cities to the north, one coastal, one near the river in central africa. Another city to the SW of Ulundi, and two, possibly, three cities on Madagaskar. With six cities you'll be ahead on the average on land.
If Madagaskar warrants some settlers, I see a good chance for some peaceful expansion. Two cities to the north, one coastal, one near the river in central africa. Another city to the SW of Ulundi, and two, possibly, three cities on Madagaskar. With six cities you'll be ahead on the average on land.
