LotR 2 - Zealous Zulus (Monarch variant)

I gained us a bit of territory. I lost more cav than I trained. I trained more infantry than I lost. I upgraded all that could be. I bought temples in the new towns. I extended our rails on a military basis with very little time to spend improving the core. Eight turns of no research, then following the AI's on Corp.

Roman Front: simmering. No change.
Russian Front: gained a little ground, including roads through the jungles in key areas. If anybody lets these roads be pillaged for any reason, I'll hang them by their thumbs. :)
Greek Front: Hot, hot, hot. Some ground gained.
Coastal Front: Hot all turn long as I built hospitals all along the shore, then took a while to catch up on ship count. In good shape as I hand off, though.
Chinese Front: yeah. Took care of it.

Leaders: 1, used on BatMed.

Spent most of the turn building infra. All the hospitals bringing us up to metro size put our unit count BELOW the allowed level now, ending gpt expenditures on troops, for the time being.

Isand has finally been connected to the homeland!


1700AD


- Sirian
 
Sounds good -- infantry are nice -- especially in armies. Only one leader surprises me, but our troops were thinning some in my reign and Jester probably continued the infra push (factories, hospitals), so I'm not terribly surprised.

I left tons of land unsettled -- wasn't happy about it, but not much I could do.

Did you mean the Iroquois front is under control? Are they gone now, too?

cpp1 is up now.
ToeCheese is on deck.

Arathorn
 
Sirian: Wow, a lot of cities founded on your turn, and it looks like almost all cities are connected by rail. I was surprised when you said less cavalry. But thinking about it, cavalry is 6.3.3 and costs 80 whereas infantry is 6.10.1 and costs 90. Infantry is much the better bargain and can be upgraded also. Rails help out with the slower movement.

Infantry and artillery make a good combo because they move the same speed, infantry can protect them and provide the knockout punch, and artillery in large enough numbers is devastating.

I expect to take most or all of my 3 days because tomorrow is booked and turns are taking longer.

Here's the eastern front from 1700AD after Sirian played.



lotr2-1700ad.jpg
 
Executive Summary: I only played for 5 turns because I was booked on Friday and now it looks like I won’t have any time on Sunday, and I did not want to slow the game down. I razed 5 cities and founded 4 cities, mostly fighting against the Russians and Romans. I got one GL who rushed a factory in Tientsin. We finished researching The Corporation and are now waiting for the next advance we don’t have. In the meantime the other civs have gotten Atomic Theory. We’re really rolling now, cities are falling left and right.

There is a lot of fighting along the coastline so I’ve been building a steady amount of ironclads. There really hasn’t been much opposition, what there is comes mostly from the Romans and Russians. It’s mostly a matter of logistics now, getting the right unit to the right place at the right time.

1700AD Preturn: Goals:

Build up the navy, have just 7 ironclads.
Try for a 3 prong attack against Romans, Greeks, and Russians.
Keep up with the other civs in research but save money by not going ahead.
Keep building infrastructure.
Ulundi gives a culture win in 74 turns, so don’t do anything that takes too long.

I see a 3 wave approach to attacks. First wave is cavalry, infantry, and artillery. Its job is to take cities and raze them. Second wave is workers guarded by infantry, its job is to build rails to keep up with the attacking forces. Last wave is settlers to build new cities in the vacated lands.

Current state of other civs:

Zulus (us) = Monarchy, even military, 48 cities, even tech
Russia = Communism, weak military, 18 cities, +Corporation –Atomic Theory
Iroquois = Republic, weak military, 3 cities, -Steam Power –Medicine -Communism
Rome = Monarchy, weak military, 12 cities, -Atomic Theory
Greece = Communism, weak military, 18 cities, -Atomic Theory
England = Democracy, weak military, 24 cities, +Corporation –Atomic Theory
Aztecs = Democracy, strong military, 34 cities, +Corporation –Atomic Theory
Egypt = Democracy, weak military, 13 cities, +Corporation, -Atomic Theory

All our opponents on our continent together have 51 cities, we have 48 so we’re about equal. Considering we have the Hoover Dam, we probably out produce all of them together so its time to make a push.

From the last time I played (1500AD) here’s the change in cities:

Zulus = +21
Russia = +0
Iroquois = -10
China = -9 (wiped out)
Rome = +1
Greece = +0
England = +0
Aztecs = +0
Egypt = -1

I wonder how Egypt lost a city?

Need to watch Umtata, its going to grow in 2 turns and become unhappy. Its cathedral finishes in 3 turns.

I wish there was a command to mark all the tiles that contain a certain unit that hasn’t attacked yet. For example, it could mark all tiles that have a cavalry that hasn’t attacked yet with a red square. It’s a real pain to have to click thru stacks of units trying to find where all the cavalry or artillery is.

I rush an ironclad at Umfolozi.

1700-1750AD Disease strikes Yakutsk. Resistance in Karkov has ended. Lots of infrastructure and units are built. One of our ironclads defeats an English ironclad attacking us.

1750AD Destroyed 6 Cossacks near Kharkov with lots of arty help. Also razed Krasno, a town with coal near Kharkov. Killed 2 infantry, 2 cossacks, and a rifle defending. Picked up 2 Russian workers. No losses so far. I found New Amatikulu on a hill just NE of the former Krasno. It will defend the new coal and be a forward base for attacking the Russians since its on the other side of the jungle. Also its within 2 of Astrakhan, a Russian city of size 10. As a bonus its already connected to everything by rail.

Killed 2 Roman rifles and a longbow near Intombe. There is a stack of 5 Roman infantry and a longbow just outside Antium that I’ll have to take care of next turn.

1705-1710AD 9 ships show up off our coasts. Romans “invade” with 3 infantry and a longbow. Greeks send 2 cav and 1 infantry. Russians send 2 cossacks and rifle. We finish building loads of troops.

1710AD Setting up for an attack on Hispalis next turn. Kill all the troops that appeared. Also killed 2 ironclads and a galleon at sea. Also attacked and destroyed the Greek iron colony near Isand. It’s a fortress in a mountain and I put 2 elite infantry to hold it.

1710-1715AD People expand the palace. Lose a cav to a counterattack. 3 more ships show up for a total of nine. Umtata goes into disorder because I forgot to check it. Hire an entertainer. The other civs learn Atomic Theory, I have our research on 0% because we already learned Corporation.

1715AD Sunk 2 ironclads and one galleon but lost an ironclad to a caravel! We kill a couple of miscellaneous troops and then go for the attack on Hispalis. I lose an elite cav taking on a 1hp infantry, but after 2 infantry and 2 rifles we raze it and get 2 Roman workers. It also has rail to it, so I bring in some infantry and order walls.

I have some spare artillery so I bring them over to attack Rostov east of Yakutsk. The first shot brings down the walls. The next hit brings the defending rifle to 1hp. I attack with a cav, raze the city, and capture 4 Russian workers. I found Zimbabwe 2 near the site of Rostov.

1715-1720AD Lost an ironclad but took one down with me near Viro.

1720AD At sea we sink 4 ships, losing none. On land I bombard enemy troops and the garrison of Astrakhan down to 1 hp. My elite cav loses attacking a 1hp infantry on grass, but I kill that plus another with other cav. I also lose an infantry attacking a 1hp Cossack, but another takes it out. We raze Astrakhan after killing 1 infantry, 1 rifle, and 2 cossacks. We capture another Russian worker there. I found Ulundi 2 near the spot. Also setting up for attacks on Antium, Odessa, and Sverdlovsk.

1720-1725AD At sea we defend from an ironclad attack near Umtata and our ironclad becomes elite. On land the Russians lose 2 cossacks trying to take Ulundi 2, they manage to take 2 hp off one infantry (out of 4).

1725AD I bombard Antium and Odessa. Odessa starts as size 12 and gets down to 7 but not quite at 6. Antium gets down to a 6 so I decide to go for it. After losing 2 cavs and defeating 5 infantry at 1hp each, 1 pike, and 2 longbows Antium finally falls giving me 5 Roman workers and a great leader Mpande! There are no settlers available, so I rush one in Eretria, in north central what-used-to-be China. All the attackers (8 cavs) and the 5 workers hole up on a hill near former Antium. 3 Infantry will supply the defence. I decide to rush a factory in Tientsin with the leader.

Notes:

There are some Roman infantry near Intombe that I’ve been waiting till they get to a road or rail line before getting. I wanted to found a city on the hill near where Antium used to be, there are now a bunch of troops there and I rushed a settler for that spot that will be ready next turn. There is a large stack of artillery on a hill south of Odessa that bombarded it this turn. After another bombardment next turn it will be ripe for taking. In the same area one of our new cities, I think Ulundi 2, is within 2 tiles of another large city so that could be the next target.

Here's the save file and a map:

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads/lotr2-1725ad.zip

lotr2-1725ad.jpg
 
Well done Sirian and cpp1 – we’ve really got the market on territory. I’ll try not to louse everything up. Only took five turns as well – my wife is VERY pregnant right now (and emotional) and, well…you know the story. Each turn taking a LONG time.

1730AD – Sweet Jesus, if I listed everything that was built on the previous turn I’d have carpal tunnel already. No matter – suffice it to say there were a lot of buildings and even more troops recruited. Jacked the science rate to 100% for the time being. Says we can get refining in 5 – I’d like to make a play for tanks and we could use the heavy hitters; maybe we can win before the culture in Ulundi takes over? Bombarded the snot out of Sverdlovsk and Odessa. Odessa captured and razed after defeating two Cossacks and an infantry. Took out a Greek cav. Sank Egyptian ironclad and galleon. Sank English ironclad. Workers clearing jungles near New Zimbabwe (what would Greenpeace think?) Took out another Cossack. Rushed temple in Ulundi 2. Sverdlovsk captured and razed after minimal defensive posturing by the Russians. Switched several cities over to settlers since the war is progressing faster than we’re producing settlers.

1735AD – Again, tons of things built. Lost a couple of ironclads off the coast but sunk a couple on the way down. Bapedi 2 founded close to the Russian front. Three Cossacks in the area of Bapedi 2 won’t be bothering us any longer. Hlobane 2 founded on the old Antium site (should have had it last turn, long story). Anyhow it’s there now. Rushed a temple in Kharkov. Pointed the ole’ cannons toward Novgorod. Ironclads are not fairing too well off the coast. Took some time to clean up the pollution gathering amongst our core cities. Took out some Roman troops that strayed into our territory. Moved artillery in range of Ravenna as well.

1740AD – Greek rifle – out. Captured Ravenna and razed it! Founded Isandishwaterwalla (Isand 2 dammit) on top of the old Ravenna city site. Rushed a temple in Bapedi 2. Not too much else going on this turn. Attempted to consolidate our gains and let the troops heal this turn.

1745AD – Sunk English ironclad and used some artillery to soften up some others. Gave Novgorod the business with the artillery. Captured and razed Novgorod! Captured one arty and a cannon as well. Founded Intombe 2 on the old Novgorod site. Nice when a plan comes together! Gave some Cossacks the business as well. Captured and razed Lutetia!

1750AD – Destroyed several groups of Roman and Russian troops. Moved the artillery into position to strike two Russian cities next turn. Sent settlers to accompany the artillery and invasion forces. Also moved a settler into position around Veil – thought maybe we could found a city close to there and use it as a stepping off point for an attack on Veil.

Notes: Tried to develop the area around Khambula a bit since the FP is in Ngome and we could use the extra production in that area. Troops and artillery (and settlers) are in position near Moscow and Minsk. There is a stack of troops (and a settler) near Veil for settling at their present location. I drained down the treasury a bit while researching Refining. We REALLY could use a better boat (destroyers) to combat the waves of Egyptian and English ships pestering us, so I took the liberty of researching refining. Culture victory in 64 turns (assuming no culture improvements in Ulundi)

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads/lotr2-1750AD.zip
 
Good work ToeCheese! We should be able to conquer the continent before Ulundi's culture win. It's going to be hard to get a conquest or domination victory before that happens though.

I also have found that the turns take a long time and that's part of the reason I was able to do only 5 turns. I'm kind of glad you did too, so I have some company.

After thinking about it, I think your move of turning research on is a good one. We are ahead in research now, and we need to get some tanks if we hope for a conquest or domination victory. We need to start thinking about the endgame in 64 turns, and delaying research now hurts our chances for a military victory, IMHO.
 
I had more need for the gold on my turn. By the end of my turn, we had a small surplus again and the research went back on. Getting better troops would be good, but at the same time, we also have this thing won at this point, and racing the culture clock is fun (did that in RBD5, too) but at the same time, I'm also content just to take the win and move on to the next game. We are now at a point where victory has been secured and the rest is just paperwork. I'm not all that keen on milking for score, or for changing carts in the middle of the stream. I had spread out the initial wonders (GL is in Z-town) but others later wanted to aim us for one-city 20k. Having gone there, I'm not sure I see the sense of swapping goals now. If we wanted to go for conquest, we should have planned it out to do so.

- Sirian
 
I got it now. I might follow the 5 turn approach and might take 10. We'll see.

As far as how we win, I'm gonna keep the combat progressing. If we happen to hit domination/conquest before the culture win, that's fine by me. If not, that's fine, too. But I'm not gonna just hole up and wait...this is a an all-out war game after all.

Goals:
- Clear the continent (probably unrealistic)
- Land on the other continent (ditto)
- Build a tank (ditto ditto)

Arathorn
 
In the year 1770, King Arathorn summoned his advisors for their report on the kingdom. It was to be his last action and to hopefully serve his successors well.

Domestic advisor:

"Sire, our kingdom is in a asonably good situation."

"Nearly all of the lands around our core cities are now covered in delicious railroad, which increases the efficiency of the citizens working there. A few spots near our capitals are still undeveloped, but even those are now mostly in process. Your infusion of a large number of extra workers into the force has helped, but more are still needed."

"We have also begun to have problems with pollution. Many long man-hours have to be spent removing ugly orange goo from our landscape. Again, I beseech your majesty for more workers to aid in this effort."

"The outlying areas are not doing so well -- especially in the large jungle near Yakutsk. A few square miles have been cleared, but there is still more work to be done than can be accomplished in any one lifetime."

"The military's demand for a comprehensive railnet was fundamentally completed by your predecessors. We have continued to extend this net, but portions of it have been destroyed by enemy bombardment."

Diplomatic advisor's report:

"Diplomacy? HA! The nations still refuse to acknowledge our utter and complete superiority through total surrender. Only China has shown any intelligence in this matter."

Science advisor's report:

"During your reign, sire, we completed our efforts into understanding how to forge an ultra-hard metal. Despite your majesty's insistence on the name Ilhwandastamantior, the scientists name 'Steel' has proved inexorable. The secrets of combustion and an internal combustion engine are to be discovered soon. This 'tank' of which your majesty spoke so eloquently on his ascension to the throne is still long years away."

Treasurer's report:

"We are wealthy. Your majesty spent very little throughout his reign. Science spending could be increased, but it might not be prudent."

Military advisor's report:

"Sir, we have had successful campaigning during your years. Let us review the highlights, using the classic 'fronts' method of the late, great Sirian."

"Roman front: No longer exists. Oh, the Romans still exist. Yeah, they have three small cities on an island east of our continent. We don't have the manpower to get to them right now, but their entire base of power around Rome has been eradicated."

"Russian front: Hardly a front. They're down to about three cities, which can be taken in the near future. I know my liege had designs on completely subjugating these people, but it is simply not realistic. The next lord can do so easily."

"Iroquois front: *snicker* They still survive ... with one puny town on the same island as the three Roman villages. Never a real power and now even less of one."

"Greek front: Ah, the thorn in our sides. We only captured ONE Greek city the entire reign. We lost a fair few troops to Greek incursions, including a few hard-to-replace laborers. The action there continues to be pretty warm, but we never really concentrated on them. Now that the R&R action is basically over, Greece should fall quickly to our full, focused might."

"Ocean front: The triumvarate of Egypt, England, and Aztecia have proven to be might mariners, producing dozens of ships to be sunk. No landings were successful, but a number of land improvements were lost to bombardment. Nearly all our coastal cities produced nothing but ironclads and our navy is still far too small. Two galleys await loading for the long-anticipated invasion across the water, but they will probably need to be upgraded to transports before being useful."

"Tactics don't seem as easy on the water. Stacking ironclads for defense and bombarding before attacking help, but it's still hard to do better than about a 2-to-1 kill rate. Many ships from both sides simply retreat for repairs and return again at full strength."

"We have also started producing more cavalry again. When attacking cities, the SOP was to send infantry in to get close, then artillery while the infantry got to the city walls, bombard, and attack. Cavalry can finish where not enough infantry were sent initially. They're also great for sacking no-culture towns where the artillery can move into range and fire the first turn. Until these 'tanks' you keep promising arrive, cavalry are still an excellent option."

"The worst result, of which I feel compelled to remind you, was the 16 hp infantry army which lost to a single hp defending infantry. What horrible luck. The rest of the battles were more reasonable."

Leaders' reports:

"There were six of us. We came in bunches -- only two turns. We mostly helped encourage the building of factories, although one of us remains to lead a newly-formed infantry army as a spearhead effort."

Arathorn's words to his successor:

"Finish off Russia, please. They are beaten and I simply could not finish them off."

"If Rome or Russia is any indication, once you get past the first city or two of Greece, they will crumble rapidly. I leave you tons of artillery and nearly 100 infantry units. Use them wisely."

"I apologize as some workers and some infantry are probably on 'j' commands. I used the group-move order a lot and I'm relatively certain I didn't stop all of them. They should still be able to move nearly anywhere you would like, however."

"Our new northern lands look like this:

lotr2-zulu-1770ad.jpg


"The key to the kingdom lies hidden at:

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads/lotr2-zulu-1770ad.zip

Jester, you are up. Sirian is on deck.

Arathorn
 
Wow Arathorn, great job! Only 54 more turns to go. Can't wait for destroyers, transports, and tanks.

I'm going on a trip until Monday (5/27) evening so I won't be able to do anything until then. Good luck Jester and Sirian!
 
Great work, Arathorn. Nice report, too. My reports lately have been on the sparse side. :)

If we do launch across the sea, I would target Egypt first because the trip from our ports to their shores would be the shortest.

- Sirian
 
That turn was a ton of fun. Didn't have a lot of time for the report, but I couldn't just skimp....I just *couldn't*.

Jester's 24 hours are passed. Sirian, your 24 hours start now, but if you wait 6-8 hours or so and Jester jumps in with a "got it" first, I'll not complain. (Or if you do another clever got it right now, that's cool, too.)

Agreed on Egypt for a first target. If they crumble quickly, we should have airport(s) for the main Aztec/England continent. For oversea invasions, though, I usually look for coastal hillls/mountains first, though, as a beachhead location (especially since they're fully railed). That first attack is usually pretty intense....

cpp1, thanks for the update. Depending on how long Sirian takes (and/or whether Jester jumps in first), and Toecheese's situation, we might do a one-turn order rearrangement. More on this later/tomorrow.

Arathorn
 
Sorry, I've been away from my computer for about 36 hours, and ate my time limit away.

I'm still up for grabbing it, though, if nobody insists otherwise.

So, got it!

Jester
 
OK, here's the situation. Jester has ~48.5 hours left to post his report (72 hours begin when he should've posted "I got it"), but I doubt that'll be a problem this weekend.

Then, Sirian. If, after Sirian's turn, Toecheese has time/energy to play before Monday night, he should do so, trading places with cpp1 for ONE turn through the rotation. If not (since it is possible, even likely, that Jester and Sirian won't even be done by then), then cpp1 will take his normal place when he gets back.

Make sense?

Arathorn
 
I played about 4 turns of the game. My computer apparently doesn't like Civ 3 anymore; it refuses to acknowledge the CD in the drive. I'll see if I can get it back working, but I'm not able to finish these here turns. So, I'm posting the game, if anyone wants to pick it up. I'll come back to it if nobody has before monday, but I doubt that.

As for the turns, I took 2 russian cities, and managed a lot of workers and artillery. That is all, I kid you not.

Jester
 
I planted my vegetable garden today -- finally some gorgeous weather here in ski country, in western Pa. I'm also working on my report for RBCiv Epic One.

Epic Two is going to be opening tomorrow, and it's going to have an innovative scoring twist. Epic One still has two weeks before it closes, as well, so any of you who haven't already checked it out are invited to do so. Anybody's welcome to play. We hope to keep a fairly low profile and avoid rampant glory seekers, as the main tenets of the tournament are no spoilers, no exploits, but we also recognize the need to boost participation as we go by finding quality folks with an interest in trying new things.

RBCiv Epics - Tournament Homepage

Since I am working on my report for the first game there, I'm content to give Jester some more time. I'll pick up LOTR2 later tonight or some time tomorrow and play my turn.


- Sirian
 
Jester looks like he's in a bit of a bind with this game. His post read to me like he was punting.

Given your post as an "I got it", you've got about 24 hours to post, Sirian. Just letting you know where we are.

Oh, and cpp1 is on deck, with Toecheese3 after him, normal order and all.

Arathorn
 
No, my post was not "got it". Why Jester ignored his turn here, or at least to give word that he was truly done, missing the deadline and putting me "on hold" pending some further word, while he went and crammed in the entire Epic Two game, which doesn't have a deadline for five weeks... Well, I can understand getting caught up in a civ game, but it would have been nice if he had taken five minutes to come post word that he wasn't going to finish his lotr2 turn. Yes, I could have figured that out, and yes I said I would likely grab the game if there was no word, but I guess I lied. I've been waiting on further word.

I have someone close to me in real life who jerks me around ALL the time with broken promises and deadlines, and I don't deal especially well with that, or rather, I have X amount of energy to cope with it, then I start blowing steam out my ears. :crazyeye: It is not being late that is the worst part, it's the endless stream of nonsense about "it will be different this time". It's comical in its inevitability. I'm immune to that, but only by literally never trusting a word this person says in THIS area. Jester's perhaps close to reaching that point of broken trust with me, but that's not a good thing, since we also play other games. He goes up and down, but each time he gets close to too many screwups he pulls back and comes through enough to de-escalate the distrust. It's a precarious position, and you have my apologies for allowing that to spill over to this game.

If my "clock" started two days ago, then I didn't post got it in time. Skip me this round. The game's almost over anyway, and I got the sense that some of the others are more juiced than I am about racing the clock to try for something other than cultural victory. We're in the mop-up phase, and I just spent half a day dealing with that in RBD18, so I'm content to pass. :)


- Sirian
 
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