MagisterCultuum
Great Sage
Is everyone else's Civlopedia working properly?
On mine, if I click on "Units", it shows only units up until Arquebus. When I click on any of those I don't get the specific unit info.
If I click on "Civilizations" and say go to Elohim and click on Monk, I don't get the Monk picture and info.
I had a similar problem myself in one game before merging in lfgr's latest update. I never discovered the cause, because the problem disappeared when I closed and reloaded the program and never happened again.
I do recall that I had before this point noticed some differences in the pedia python files in lfgr's version and mine. I think I started merging in his versions before having that bug, but then for some reason stopped. I think it was because the upgrade chart page was an even bigger mess with his code.
Edit: I guess lfgr found the answer to this one.
Ok, I need something to be explained to me. Why did a Granary spread the Empyrean into my city? As a fyi, I'm playing as the Khazad with Kandros Fir, advanced start.
EDIT 1: Even the Svartalfar have the Empyrean all over their cities, obviously by building Granaries all over.
EDIT 2: Unloading and reloading the mod fixed it. I have no idea what's going on.
I'm afraid I don't know what is going on here either. Are you sure it is Granary related? You didn't accidentally add the religion in worldbuilder? No one had an event trigger which gave the option to spread their state religion in their own and rival cities?
Hey Magister! First of all, I gotta say, I'm very impressed that this mod is still going strong for so long. After trying so many FFH2 modmods long ago, this ended up being my favorite by far, in part due to the lore authenticity, and in part due to the utterly ridiculous stuff you can do and reach in gameplay. I recently downloaded your updated versions, and I had a lot of fun despite the roughness on the edges (more on that later). This is going to be insanely long, so I apologize in advance.
First up, the 3 sessions I fired up to try out the mod; first 2 were with the version before the current, the third with the current version.
First session was with the Svartalfar, second with the Bannor, third with the Calabim (still going).
Spoiler First Session: Svartalfar :The first session was me messing around with an elf civ, see how far you can go with being able to build more than just lumbermills and camps on forested tiles. The end result? Pure madness; the fellowship religion was a natural choice, and with the crazy food production you could achieve with farms + sanitation + ancient forests, your cities' population went through the roof, doubly so due to the generous health bonuses thanks to said forests. However, what I noticed is if you did Apprenticeship (or Arete if you got all your ancient forests and want a round with Kilmorph now) + all workshop-related techs, you could simply spam workshops like a madman to achieve downright sickening amounts of production without the drawback of being pop-limited.
Also, I went with Rivanna the Wraith Lord for that run, simply because the Organized trait was too good to pass up; Military Strategy is infinitely easier to reach than Arcane Lore, and this makes Organized hit much harder than Philosophical much earlier in the game. The Sinister trait was good stuff, it really helps recon units punch just a little bit harder, especially if you need to spam fawns in a pinch. I had to do that to beat down an octopus-worshiping Doviello at bay, whch also had a Saverous that was REALLY levelled up; it was nerve wracking, but it worked. I eventually sacked the Doviello and even managed to get their holy city, giving me 3 new sources of mana thanks to their Necronomicon.
The rest of the game was kinda uneventful, really; I passed everyone else in the game, maintained top position, and eventually got bored. So I fired up the Bannor.
.Spoiler Second Session: Bannor :The second session has me using the Bannor because I wanted to play a good civ for a change. Went with Sabathiel for the same reason I went with Rivanna, plus the fact he has Charismatic, another OP trait that trivializes unit training. This time, I beelined for the Order, and managed to rescue a Vicar from the Pyre of the Seraphic later on to found the Empyrean early. Before that, though, I spammed archers and killed the Illians early because they were a close competitor and they were evil. After the Illians, I decided to sack the Ljosalfar because I wanted to expand, which got Valin Phanuel at a high enough level to free Brigit.
Freeing Brigit was funny as hell. After I freed her, I had a super powerful unit that was perfect for... raiding unique features. Brigit could be a one-archangel army to put everyone else to heel, but what did I relegate her for? Looting her fallen god's little pyramid for free stuff. The audacity of her still unfallen archangel committing such casual disrespect towards her is not lost to me; I think I managed to get a jade torc, a timor mask, that Vicar I mentioned, and a Great Engineer. Good stuff. Valin, on the other hand, got a bunch of shades and great engineers by looting the Broken Sepulcher. At the very end, I just decided the Malakim should stop being baddies and attacking the Hippus, so I used a portal discovered by Brigit looting Bhall's little bonfire as a shortcut to attack the Malakim's unguarded behind. Sacked their Fellowship holy city, reduced them to a rump state, ended the game there.
By the way, Brigit turned from angel to demon at some point for some reason. What could cause such a thing?
The first way that comes to mind for an angel to turn into a demon is for it to somehow get the Demon Possessed promotion. Its python effect removes that promotion from non-living units, but first transforms Angels into Demons. (It also changes Life and Arawn's Death promotions to Undeath.)
At one point I had Unholy Taint turn all summons into Demons, but decided that was not right for a necromancer to summon a bunch of demonic Spectres and Wraiths that were invulnerable to Destroy Undead. I thought about having Unholy Taint pass on Unholy Taint, but with it allowing access to evil spell spheres in older versions or granting affinities with Demonic Pacts that seemed too much. I still did not want Profanes summoning a bunch of holy Einherjar angels instead of corrupted fallen angels (i.e., Demons).
Brigit is created in Python though, not a summon who would get any summon perks from its summoner's promotions. As Angels are non-living, she should also be immune from the lair exploration result that adds Possession
The only way I can think of for Brigit to become Demon Possessed is through reading the Infernal Grimoire. If you had your archangel seek such evil knowledge, I think it is appropriate that she would fall.
It is also possible for an Angel to become a Demon if you had a Pact with Statius at the time the unit was first created.
MagisterCultuum does not turn barbarian because you are Calabim, but because his Children of the One religion makes his disloyal to anyone with any State Religion. You could have held on to this great sage and potentially even had him pass on Govanon's Ethics to your units if you had no state religion.(If you wait until after learning Theology to convert, you could make MagisterCultuum into a Profane, or a Luminary if you were not Calabim. That would change his religion and make him no longer rebel. If you then got an Infernal pact with Hyborem, your MagisterCultuum profane would have all of the abilities of an Archmage and could spread magical knowledge to anyone.)For more weird stuff that happened, Rivanna the Wraith Lord is both a leader of the Svartalfar, and a Commander under my employ, and you spawned as a great sage, who promptly became barbarian because I'm Calabim. Don't worry though, I captured you and you became Mikel Dylantyr for some reason. I need my Academy, you know.
It is kind of annoying that great persons change to different great persons when they are captured, but that is a vanilla BtS thing I don't know how to change.
When I introduced Affinity I decided that it made much more sense for Creation to be a sphere with only affinity, without the ability to learn any spell sphere promotions with experience, rather than placing any limits on building Creation mana nodes. It still depends on chance, but in a less annoying way that does not push people so hard into trying to get the Dies Diei or Museum of Maponos every game.With my sessions all showcased, I'll move on to my observations/suggestions/pipe dreams.
Spoiler :Observations:
- Workshops are OP once set up right; their +5 and +1 stomp literally every other improvement out there even with the -1 food malus (ancient forests + elves/kurios = gg wp), and if you also have the Financial trait with Arete? Well, where we're going, we won't need cottages. Or Farms. Maybe some Enclaves if you're Kurio, but if you're elven? Just turbocharge your production, what is Cernunnos gonna do, complain you're polluting his forests with industry? Without Ancient Forests, you'll need a few farms to make sure you're not in the negative food-wise, but a few Creation Affinity mages fix that problem VERY trivially, doubly so if they're Earth/Mind affinity for Greater Diligence/Inspiration.
- On the topic of Improvements, Mana Nodes don't give anything at all in terms of yield bonuses. I understand the bonus is the Mana you're collecting, but something to make them more than just one step above peaks in terms of yield usefulness would be nice. Also, why did you make Creation nodes buildable on raw mana? I thought you shouldn't be able to do such a thing, unless you changed something.
If you play the scenario The Splintered Court, you will find that defeating either Thessa or Rivanna will lead to Alexis asking the favor of turning them over to her. If you agree, then they will appear as Calabim leaders in the Mulcarn Reborn scenario. (Volanna and Amelanchier can similarly be given to Baron Duin Halfmorn to return as Doviello werewolves.) Canonically, Thessa is an archmage who in her youth acquired forbidden knowledge from a grimoire of necromancy which had been stolen from the Calabim. On her wedding night she killed her husband in a ritual where she absorbed his spirit in order to make herself strong enough to purge the forest of the corruption that was destroying it. Her actions sound a lot like what a vampire does when it feeds. She was practically a vampire already, even if she learned from Calabim books rather than being turned by a vampire Sire the traditional way. Alexis would not want this knowledge spreading, but would surely recognize Thessa as the sort of talent that could rise high in her empire and should be given the dark gift in such a way that would bind her to her service. I often like to play Thessa as a reluctant vampire, who resists her desire to feast because she does not want to be evil yet at times must feed to serve a higher purpose. She is True Neutral and embodies the ethos of an Archmage as described by Malchavic. She is not needlessly cruel or malicious, but has the strength of will to pursue her goals and make herself commit any act, no matter how heinous, that she believes is necessary to achieve a worthy end. All we know about Rivanna canonically is that she often plots to depose Faeryl and is the one subordinate that the Winter Queen fears yet finds to useful to have assassinated. (If the Svartalfar were The North and Faeryl was Ned or Robb Stark, then Rivanna would be Roose Bolton.) I usually assume she is an archmage with affinity for Shadow and Death, or maybe even a Lich that maintains a convincing illusion of life. Given that her title is "Wraith Lord," not "Wraith Lady," I am not at all sure that she is female but may choose to present her gender differently at different times to different people.Why are Thessa and Rivanna eligible to lead the Calabim? I'm asking for curiosity, really. I'd like to know of the lore behind this decision, if there's any.
- Svartalfar Archmages look bad. It's just a still model t-posing (probably to assert dominance over its more animated brethren), whereas illusionists are normal. Can you fix that, please? It makes the mod look unpolished. Even a haphazard model swap is fine, really. Same goes with Gosea, and pretty sure with some other units I'm not aware of.
- Speaking of unpolished, the mod in general feels unpolished all around. The Force mana writing tidbits have Kael's and your explanations thrown there haphazardly, the Affinity promotions are cluttered with all those explanation wall of text dumps in their effect list, many links don't go where they should (the abundance spell in the civilopedia doesn't get you to the building, it keeps you stuck there until you go manually), you have Longbowmen with 2-3 first strikes on their own with 3 Drill promotions on top, the unit icons looking enormous on the unit upgrades section, etc. etc. You gotta polish that stuff, man. Adding tons of stuff is fine and all, but polish is the other half of the building process, and equally essential. Would you mind if I tried my hand in doing some polish work? It's still up to you to decide on what to keep and what to discard, but I'd like to help around and make it less rough around the edges.
- IIRC unlike other religions, the White Hand didn't have an "Era" assigned to it, and always felt a little bit unpolished compared to the other religions. Ashes of Erebus did it some justice on that, did you fix that? Never had much of a chance to play the Illians recently.
- I'm not really familiar with Ashes of Erebus, or what is involved in making a new Era. I guess I can look into it.
Suggestions (small scale):
- While I understand most Archmages are insanely old due to dedicating their life in studying the arcane, some Archmage models don't/shouldn't look like it (Calabim, Amurite, Elven, Body/Life affinity mages, and probably some others). Instead of being a measly 1 strength denoting their old age, they could be 4 to represent they're not that decrepit (Calabim Archmages being Vampiric, Amurite Archmages being naturals and allowing them to reach that stage more easily than the rest, Elven Archmages just having higher lifespans, Body/Life Affinity Archmages being young and spry due to their sphere connection, etc). Of course, this depends on the civ, race, and model used, and shouldn't be that common.
- Reducing the strength all the way to 1 may have been too much, but I don't like the idea of them being any stronger physically than Mages/Wizards in their prime when deprived of enough mana for which they have affinity. Strength 2 or 3 may be better. Body 3 already can be used to increase their strength, and Body affinity randomly grants Strong, but canonically those who use Body magic actually end to die young as it puts too much strain on their bodies. It is like using high doses of anabolis steroids for years.
[*]For some reason, I can stack Inspiration and Greater Inspiration together, getting the benefits of both, and I'm pretty sure this shouldn't be a thing. I also have the sneaking suspicion I can do the same with Diligence and Hope. Instead of effect buildings like Inspiration, Diligence, and Hope having only one building, why not split the effects? Like, have the normal effect buildings, and any additional effects are only added to the Greater version of the building. Then, you have the say, Greater Inspiration spell, and this puts down 2 "buildings": the normal inspiration, and its Greater cousin.
[*]While we're on the "Greater xyz" topic, why not try to differentiate the effects between each Greater xyz "building"? For example, Diligence gives +10% bonus to , while Inspiration gives +10% bonus to . This would make each effect stand out more compared to its peers. Also, this is more for UI sorting, but instead of having the "(Greater)" text as a prefix, it would be better as a suffix. It'd make sorting much more intuitive, and the lookup of things much less painful.
I suppose I could make it a readable Grimoire, but don't think I will. It seems rather unbalanced for only one religion's holy city to have such an extra ability.
- Can you make the Necronomicon readable like the Infernal Grimoire? That'd be pretty cool. Gaining power at the expense of madness, with Cultists/Speakers of the Tide having less of a risk would be pretty thematical for the Octopus Overlords.
- While we're on the topic of Cultists, it'd be a pretty neat touch to have them yell quotes from Blood's cultists if possible (example). Again, it's a thematic touch that'd add to the experience.
There are already a lot of promotions in the game, way more than in the base game, which have to be cycled through many times per turn for every unit or spell prereq check. I don't feel like adding 21+ more just now without a very good reason. The once in a generation casters would all seem to be heroes anyway, which can have affinity in their unit defines without needing special promotions for that. I have considered making the 3rd level spell sphere promotions grant affinity (in the extra strength sense, not granting extra spells) which could boost Archmages in spheres for which they are not innately gifted.Suggestions (large scale):
- To make things spicier, why not add a second version of affinity that's even more powerful? This could be used to represent Kael's idea of having freakishly powerful mages every once in a lifetime, with the tradeoff that mages spawned with this sort of "super" affinity can only have that, and no other affinity unless they want to try their hand becoming Archmages. Of course, I understand this might be unbalancing and could take a LOT of work, so feel free to discard it if you think it's not fitting, or mutate it to something more palatable.
- Instead of just having one spell for each mana sphere promotion, why not have two? Some mana spheres already have 2 spells tied to them, and this would allow for unconventional and creative spells. For example, Air spells could "lighten" a unit, progressively removing the heavy promotion and adding the light promotion to them, with Earth spells doing the inverse. Death and Undeath could be made into one promotion, with the use of Undeath spells automatically damning the unit to an afterlife in hell. Dimensional could set up "voodoo doll" effects (think the Destiny Bond move in Pokemon), Enchantment could boost a city's best attribute, Law being able to purge or neuter mutations, Mind could tap into its untainted foresight power for research or first strikes, etc. Combining two spheres for compound spells could also be a thing, an example being Body+Chaos allowing for "controlled" mutations (however much they can be controlled because of the Chaos sphere lol).
- At one point I intended to add a lot more spells, expecially cross sphere spells, but there are only so many unique flavorful and easily coded ideas. If you have have suggestions that work with existing game mechanics, not requiring DLL changes or insanely ineffiecient python, then I am willing to consider them but am making no promises.
[*]I wish Brigit could go to Bhall's vault and nab the sphere of Fire to return it to its pure, untainted form via an expensive ritual. On top of being crazy epic, it could also go a lot of in-game effects related to Agares's manipulations amounting to nothing because a plucky little mortal civ undid all his hard work just like that. Plus, the idea of him sinking to new lows of despair, screaming in never seen before anguish on his pillow because his whispers amounted to nothing is just hilarious to me.[*]It'd be nice to have adventurers decoupled from the Great Person mechanic, and the Ardor World Spell being changed to reset the Adventurer counter. I liked how Rise from Erebus decoupled adventurers from other Great People, though it could imbalance the Grigori. Then again, the mod is already Camulos's playing field with how insane it is mechanically, what's a mechanic more?
Any DLL stuff is up to lfgr, unless Tholal comes back.Pipe Dreams:
- I really wish Espionage, Cults, and Corporation-style Guilds were a thing. This requires a ton of DLL work to implement, sadly, but what I liked about the Orbis modmod is it splitting religions into proper religions and cults (putting the council of Esus into cult status), using Beyond the Sword's Espionage and Corporation Mechanics, and its more comprehensive civic system. The civic style can be ported easily (I can probably do it pretty fast), but the other stuff? I'd kill for all that.
- Another DLL-intensive mechanic I'd like would be the gradual terrain/feature change mechanic from Ashes of Erebus. Seeing Grassland gradually change to Tundra and then to Snow as the Illians makes the effort look more organic than that sudden change that occurs currently. This would also benefit Fellowship civs, with their forests turning Ancient not by chance but gradually and deliberately, and the Hell Terrain mechanic showing a corruption that seeps into Erebus slowly and menacingly instead of just "happening". Better load up those Life mages...
I am not compleetly opposed to adding Cults that canonically exist, like the Emrys, Foxmen, Occis, and Stewards of Inequity, but I'd have to have good effects for them all worked out first. I don't plan to demote the Council of Esus to a cult/corporation.
As I said, I always have the audio off and consider it a very low priority. I would not mind reassigning the voices for different units or civs if someone else does most of the work of deciding what fits best together and all I have to do is some minor xml tweaks, but I don't intend to go finding new audiofiles to include in every download.
- Observation: Too many civilizations have the same nationality voice lines, with Arabic being used a lot. It'd be nice if each civ had its own nationality voice-wise to ensure they're more distinct from each other.
- Suggestion: Hemah being able to dream and cause random effects (like Wonder, in a way) would be a pretty cool thing to implement, and make him more distinct than how he currently is. Right now, he's just an archmage with water/mind affinities, a strength of 7, and a damage randomization effect. Pretty sure it'd take a lot of time to implement, though.
If it was not for the existence of Gaelan, I think I would have long ago tried changing Hemah to be a Mage (rather than archmage) level caster with the ability to cast Wonder or something similar. The pedia never says "Some say Hemah isn't a mage (not Archmage), he only dreamt he was once and he hasn't forgotten the dream.
I'm a bit reluctant to add a new promotion just for one unit's PyPerTurn effect. (I would much prefer it is units could have <PyPerTurn> effects and promotions could grant <PythonPostCombatWon> and <PythonPostCombatLost> effects.) I guess I could make a random event that requires the unit and recurs frequently, but it would be a lot of work and I imagine it could easily get to be more annoying than fun.
p.s. Using lists, especially numbered lists, makes posts very hard to quote when trying to address things point by point as the forum keep trying to reformat and renumber everything.