Map Sizes

[anandus]

Some observations from the 'high end PC' side.

I tried a 190x122 game with 18 players and it loaded well. At around turn 50 things started to go a bit haywire with load times going into the minutes. My rig is running a i7-6400K 4.00Ghz with 64gb RAM running via a SSD!

Wow, nice setup and thanks for testing!

 

[Gedemon]

seems that we are not limited to 22 major civs, I've launched a giant map script with 28.

 

[Xur]

192*120 can load I haven't done a playthough though and the initial loadtime was almost 3 minutes. Anyway I'd be happy with that size... just need a good TSL world map and some mods to "fix" trade route spam.

 

[Socrates Paine]

I tried to changed the numbers to create a bigger map. Atm i'm trying 180x112. It took a while for the game to load, but so far it's working.

Hello,

first i want to say sorry for my faulty english, i'm from Germany.
Can you say, which of the two numbers you have changed to get a lager map? And where you can see, how exactly large the map is, which you got?

 

[ww2commander]

I play tested another huge map at 150x82 with 18 civs. I am more certain that the turn time delay is due to the barbs. Got to around turn 60 on marathon (basically very few units on the map as it takes ages to build anything!) and noticed the same delay each turn when barbs were processed.

If I was to take a guess, I would say that the pathing calculations for the barbs is maybe more complex with the whole scout back to base mechanism.

 

[Gedemon]

Or there are too many of them, I've noted that also on civ5 when using the Historical Spawn Date and some big empty areas where filled with them.

 

[TPangolin]

seems that we are not limited to 22 major civs, I've launched a giant map script with 28.

Nice! Would you mind sharing how you did that? I want to start creating some AI Battle Royales as soon as possible!

 

[djlethal]

Or there are too many of them, I've noted that also on civ5 when using the Historical Spawn Date and some big empty areas where filled with them.

You know, that's easy to test: just tick the "No barbarians" option and see what difference it makes in turn times.

 

[Gedemon]

Nice! Would you mind sharing how you did that? I want to start creating some AI Battle Royales as soon as possible!

Just need to change the <MaxPlayers> value in the MapSizes table in the config DB (see my post on the modinfo thread for an example on how to update that DB)

 

[Shadole]

Thanks for letting me know about resources ww2commander!

Gedemon, can you share a little bit more about resource scaling with players? The only bit of code I found for that is :

self.iResourcesInDB = 0;
self.iLuxuriesThisSizeMap = GameInfo.Maps[Map.GetMapSize()].DefaultPlayers * 2;

But at first glance to my inexperienced eyes, it seems like that is only for luxuries and not strategic resources? I'm very confused. That line,
self.iLuxuriesThisSizeMap" also appears nowhere else in the code so I am confused as to why there is an equation for it. I changed it to a high multiplier (10 vs. 2) to see if that actually did anything and as far as I can tell it did not.

 

[RemonKewl]

I play tested another huge map at 150x82 with 18 civs. I am more certain that the turn time delay is due to the barbs. Got to around turn 60 on marathon (basically very few units on the map as it takes ages to build anything!) and noticed the same delay each turn when barbs were processed.

If I was to take a guess, I would say that the pathing calculations for the barbs is maybe more complex with the whole scout back to base mechanism.

Did you try disabling the barbarians?

 

[Gedemon]

Thanks for letting me know about resources ww2commander!

Gedemon, can you share a little bit more about resource scaling with players? The only bit of code I found for that is :

self.iResourcesInDB = 0;
self.iLuxuriesThisSizeMap = GameInfo.Maps[Map.GetMapSize()].DefaultPlayers * 2;

But at first glance to my inexperienced eyes, it seems like that is only for luxuries and not strategic resources? I'm very confused. That line,
self.iLuxuriesThisSizeMap" also appears nowhere else in the code so I am confused as to why there is an equation for it. I changed it to a high multiplier (10 vs. 2) to see if that actually did anything and as far as I can tell it did not.

You're right, the other are placed on the available plots using the <Frequency> tag from the Resources table, see ResourceGenerator.lua

 

[historix69]

It seems that map size is still limited.

I modified Maps.xml for a test and started new games (continents) with different values for huge map size :
120 x 60 : ca. 1 min to create map
180 x 90 : ca. 2 min
240 x 120 : game crashes after 6 min map creation

When I tried 360 x 180, I had to reboot my PC since I was not able to kill Civ 6 which was playing the intro music in an endless loop during map creation. Taskmanager was no longer working.

My system is Win 10, Core i-7-6700K with 12 GB RAM (up to 32 GB available) and 4 GB VRAM (GTX 970) ...

It would be helpfull to know the average memory consumption per tile for map generation, at start of the game and for the end game (with lots of units and improvements on tiles.) If they try to load everything into Video Memory, most of us are still limited to 4 GB / 8 GB VRAM.

 

[Gedemon]

Each added tile will consume more and more (think about the pathfinder), you can't get an "average"

I've just tried 220x120, loaded (take some time !) civ6 process use 2.3GB of RAM

But GPU memory usage is at 5.6GB, I'll try to lower the texture size for my next try.

 

[Shadole]

You're right, the other are placed on the available plots using the <Frequency> tag from the Resources table, see ResourceGenerator.lua

Thanks Gedemon! It just occurred to me that the "self.iLuxuriesThisSizeMap = GameInfo.Maps[Map.GetMapSize()].DefaultPlayers * 2" thing may refer to how many different TYPES of luxury resources appear on the map..but that also may not make much sense because I don't think there are 24 different kinds of luxuries (which is what the equation would equal for a Huge map). I don't know how to test this yet because I don't have a way to reveal the whole map, but changing that number appears to do nothing for the actual amount of luxury resource tiles that generate on the map.

The frequency tag you referenced keeps referring to plot#, so it appears that generation of other resources is actually tied to how many tiles the map has, which is a good thing.

 

[Ryika]

Thanks Gedemon! It just occurred to me that the "self.iLuxuriesThisSizeMap = GameInfo.Maps[Map.GetMapSize()].DefaultPlayers * 2" thing may refer to how many different TYPES of luxury resources appear on the map..but that also may not make much sense because I don't think there are 24 different kinds of luxuries (which is what the equation would equal for a Huge map). I don't know how to test this yet because I don't have a way to reveal the whole map, but changing that number appears to do nothing for the actual amount of luxury resource tiles that generate on the map.

The frequency tag you referenced keeps referring to plot#, so it appears that generation of other resources is actually tied to how many tiles the map has, which is a good thing.

There's a function in the firetuner-panels that should allow you to do that:

if (Game.GetLocalPlayer() ~= -1) then
    local pVis = PlayersVisibility[Game.GetLocalPlayer()];
    for iPlotIndex = 0, Map.GetPlotCount()-1, 1 do
            pVis:ChangeVisibilityCount(iPlotIndex, 1);
    end
end

 

[Gedemon]

or "reveal all" in the console (firetuner and the console can be activated in AppOptions.txt)

 

[historix69]

Each added tile will consume more and more (think about the pathfinder), you can't get an "average"

I've just tried 220x120, loaded (take some time !) civ6 process use 2.3GB of RAM

But GPU memory usage is at 5.6GB, I'll try to lower the texture size for my next try.

I did some more testing.

260 x 100 = 26.000 tiles took ca. 5 min to generate and I could start the game. VRAM consumption was at the limit of 4 GB.

280 x 100 = 28.000 tiles took ca. 6-7 min to generate the map and when the game started to transfer data to VRAM, the game exited when reaching the 4 GB VRAM usage ... (crash to desktop)

180 x 90 = 16.200 tiles uses already 3,85 GB of VRAM ... (high settings)

As a reference : the unchanged huge map size has 106 x 66 = 6.996 tiles and uses 3,33 GB VRAM.

Civ 4 and Civ 5 on Giant Maps became unstable around industrialisation, so starting Civ 6 already near the VRAM limit of 4 GB is not a good idea.

 

[Shadole]

Thanks Ryika and Gedemon. Gedemon, I went into AppOptions.txt and I decided to try the console because it seems easier for me than the FireTuner. I set EnableDebugMenu to 1 and started a game but nothing happens. I'm sure I'm missing something, so can anyone help me figure out how to activate the console?

 

[Gedemon]

press the ~ key ingame (US keyboard)