[GS] Matthias Corvinus strategie

[ossi]

Hi Civ fans,
just made my first GS game. Matthias Corvinus is incredidle strong. With the help of Amani you can become suzerain of a city state very early. Levy units as soon as you have money for it. Afterward you get 2 more Envoys - so you can stay suzerain even after moving Amani to the next city state, and so on ... new money you can also get via pillaging ... with this strategie I rolled over the whole world extremly quickly!
Ciao, Ossi

 

[Victoria]

Yes, we have seen this with a streamer, I have been levying troops for a while, it is underrated normally too.
However... try deity and you will find not many CS to levy, the ones left everyone has stored up envoys for.
50% districts is good though, placement is everything.

 

[CornPlanter]

try deity and you will find not many CS to levy

Speaking of, I dont even find many CS on immortal either. I dont think I've ever had a "Meet 3 CS" inspiration in any of my GS games ever. Did they reduce the number of CS per map or what

 

[ossi]

thanks for your feedback, I have to admit I set the number of CS to max (24), huge fractal map, immortal difficulty, marathon speed. It was extremely easy, even playing very lazy without any deeper strategic thinking. hungary characteristic with 50% districts is indeed also very good, but for this game it was not really required. Therefore I thought deity will also work fine, I will try ... but at the moment I play Inca

 

[Dexter25]

Yes, we have seen this with a streamer, I have been levying troops for a while, it is underrated normally too.
However... try deity and you will find not many CS to levy, the ones left everyone has stored up envoys for.
50% districts is good though, placement is everything.

Could you precise whether Matthias Corvinus gets 50% discount for building districts and buildings inside them on the opposite side of the river from city center or these districts should also placed next to city center?

 

[balkottth213]

Could you precise whether Matthias Corvinus gets 50% discount for building districts and buildings inside them on the opposite side of the river from city center or these districts should also placed next to city center?

Opposite side of river AND near city center.
Tested it, since I'm Hungarian, I had to do my first game with them.

Also, I played on deity, went for CS levied warrior->swordsman rush, and I feel like deity will be the only difficulty, where it might be a bit slow, but i might just got an unlucky map, idk. You could still go for muskets, levy troops when they are still warriors, and upgrade then to make a later but bigger cheese, but then it's too slow again compared to a horsemen into UU-s rush, which on the other hand seems insanely strong on Hungary, even on deity.

 

[Forster]

Speaking of, I dont even find many CS on immortal either. I dont think I've ever had a "Meet 3 CS" inspiration in any of my GS games ever. Did they reduce the number of CS per map or what

I don't know if they reduced the number but you can adjust the number in play under advanced settings when creating a new game.

 

[Hans Tork]

Yes, we have seen this with a streamer, I have been levying troops for a while, it is underrated normally too.
However... try deity and you will find not many CS to levy, the ones left everyone has stored up envoys for.
50% districts is good though, placement is everything.

I agree that in Deity nearly 90/100% of CS die by T80. However the early game advantage of having free 6-8 warriors that can be upgraded to swords is quite OP. Even
with one CS giving you 3-4 warriors you can use them as bait/meat shield for your first war target. It frees up the production of units for other things. I feel inital momentum is everything in Deity and in my game it gave me the desired cities even though both of my CS got killed by a tech crazy Korea. In the end that initial advantage helped me win the game easily. To make effective use of Hungaries UA I went with 2 scouts first instead of slinger warrior build I go for usually. I was lucky to scout out 2 CS and with their help there was no going back. I did not even spam units or go for a Dom win. I was trying for a Diplo win but got bored and got the regular Dom Win instead. I ended up playing and testing with late game things like the Giant Death Robot and Modern Armor armies.

Spoiler :

 

[Victoria]

I agree that in Deity nearly 90/100% of CS die by T80

what % die by the time you have suze of them and enough gold... and when you do other AI's with more envoys than you and nowhere to put them, plants them in your CS and so remove all your troops.
I am not saying it does not work, I am saying be mighty careful you did not just declare war, spend all your money and have no army left... happened to me lots, I have been playing the levy game for a while

 

[Hans Tork]

what % die by the time you have suze of them and enough gold... and when you do other AI's with more envoys than you and nowhere to put them, plants them in your CS and so remove all your troops.
I am not saying it does not work, I am saying be mighty careful you did not just declare war, spend all your money and have no army left... happened to me lots, I have been playing the levy game for a while

The ones I levied both got killed by Korea but I ended up using nearly 5-6 swordsman up to kill Alex. Infact levying troops weakens the CS more and hastens their death. However with Hungary the ability to get freely upgraded 10 swords is decent. As for the % I managed to sell all my luxes and chose Amani as my first gov pick(I choose Magnus generally) means you can snag two CS long enough to make their armies useful. It would be T60-62 when I got the warriors up.

 

[Stamson]

Yes, we have seen this with a streamer, I have been levying troops for a while, it is underrated normally too.
However you try boosts for apex legends, deity and you will find not many CS to levy, the ones left everyone has stored up envoys for.
50% districts is good though, placement is everything.

I've been testing it and I am 99% sure you need to be adjacent to city center AND across the river. Is this what you have found aswell? This usually limits the spots quite a bit.

 

[Victoria]

This usually limits the spots quite a bit.

Indeed x 2

 

[Cakeathon]

I've had a different experience playing diety. A good portion of city-states tend to stay alive in my games for some reason.

Despite playing 2 games with Hungary I have done very little levying. My issues are:
#1 they can't be at war at anytime in the last several tens of turns since the AI tends to wipe out all their units. Same problem if you just liberated them, no units.
#2 they need to be well-positioned which is surprisingly rare for them to be in my games. Usually, if a city-state is next to an AI it's either dead or they dump all their envoys into them.
#3 they make mostly melee units but your UUs are all light cavalry. Gunpowder is on a completely different path to cavalry so it's anti-synergetic in terms of efficient beelining. And swordsmen very quickly become effectively useless on diety. So you have a very tight window around ironworking where it's actually going to have an impact but you need the perfectly placed city-state at the perfect time for it to work out and in my games it's just never there.

I mean look at this crap, perfectly positioned on the map though, right in the middle of everybody:

Spoiler :

Really like the double UUs upgrading into each other and faster districts though. Things tend to go very smoothly with them since they just do things you'd do anyway but they do it a little better.

 

[Monthar]

Keep in mind if the cs has only 1 or 2 units left the levy cost is much lower and everytime you levy you gain an additional 2 envoys with that CS. If you run your trade routes to the CSs you should be able to afford to levy just about every chance you get.

 

[kb27787]

IMO the levy part is more useful as an emergency defense mechanism and for early exploring where the levy cost is not so high.

The UA on the other hand can be insane with the WC double building production proposal... Ever seen broadcast centers finish in 3-5 turns? The bonus is not half price though, but rather a third (+50 pct production results in 67 pct effective price) so it is weaker than Japan's but the difference is that this works on buildings and not just the base districts.

In normal games not all your cities can be placed perfectly so it is not as strong as it seems at first glance.

 

[Infernal]

I haven't played endless games with Hungary, but I think most people use the suzerainity bonus incorrectly for the early game. Early to mid game suzerainity shouldn't be about war. It should be about money...more specifically making the city state pay for themselves and not getting them killed in the process. Early game the goal of any city state manager should be to pillage (with the appropriate bonus policy card of course) a chosen AI as much as you can without losing units. From tile yields, to goody huts, trade routes, or barb camp clearing...if it's not nailed down you take it. Which should not be too hard since all of your units have 4 movement. Think of yourself as a barb camp and burn the place down. Never fight unless trapped or an easy win. Stay away from city centers or encampments. Never upgrade your units since this does nothing for their movement for the most part and it is the job of the city state to do when they get their units back. Pillaging yields early game far outweigh anything you could hope to do by taking one measly city. And whilst pillaging their entire countryside you're fairly likely to capture a few rogue builders/settlers which is critical in continuing your own development. Remember, you've got 30 turns to play cat and mouse games... Once your units have no other viable targets, surround a city and make them pay through the nose for peace. Or, use the last turn before peace to pillage tiles directly next go city centers. Make peace and watch your boys make the long walk home. They'll spend generations trying to fix the damage you'll do.This strategy can even work while not at war. Last game I played I levied a city state, marched about 6 swordsmen up to Dido's borders and entered the diplomacy screen. Dido paid me 95 gold a turn, 31 gold on the spot, 23 diplomatic favor, and amber in order to instead start a joint war with her and I against Peter (who was not even close to either of us and was no threat.) I later used the nearly 3000 gold she paid me (with Amani's help) to take suzerainity of her city states and crush her like a grape from both sides of her empire's flanks. Plus the leftover 1500 gold that didn't fund her own demise went to good use as well. Priorititize suzerainity over city states that are unlikely to be frequently attacked by the AI and yet have proximity enough to act as murder for hire. Trade city states will pay you the money needed to repeat the process more frequently. That should turn things around for you. Hope it helps.