Mehmed
- Thread starter futurehermit
- Start date
futurehermit
Deity
- Joined
- Apr 3, 2006
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No, but I recommend guilds for grocers for the extra health to help grow your cities large.
My reasoning is based on going for space race and finishing your conquering before jans are available to you. Check out my Rome/Egypt/Persia thread to see what I mean. Of course if you are going conquest/domination then Jans should be used offensively, but don't knock them as city defenders for more peaceful victories as well.
Louis Surrendered in 1320 AD in that game. Even while fighting offensively, its very doable to get gunpowder 600-1000 AD, allowing you a very cheap and easy "last push" even for such a strategy. I repeat: they are too good to waste, tailor your game-play after them!
Heck, you probably do well holding back on early expansion just to beeline gunpowder and get the janissaries earlier. STR 9 + 25% versus all possible opponent types AND ignore walls makes an offensive unit extraordinnaire.
Kev
Hired Goon
Wanted to chime in with praise for playing as Mehmed. Just finished a Monarch/Fractal game and won domination in the early 1600's!
Had Brennus very close to me and was able to take his food-rich capital and the Jewish holy city (shame it was placed so poorly, but kept it) before moving on. Normally, I would have held up a bit and plotted the total removal of Brennus, but two things made me change strategies -
1. Brennus had some cities on hills and had built Duns - a pain to take those early without siege.
2. Julius Ceaser had expanded toward me and was getting close to iron.
Didn't know if I could handle taking too many more cities, by gathered what I could (had construction at least) and threw it had the Roman capital first. In short, the war was pretty successful, and I kept more cities than I had originally planned (including the Roman Hindu Holy City). Thankfully, I had built the Oracle and took COL, and with courthouses and larger cities (thanks to Hammans and the expansive trait) I was able to maintain very well.
I took some time to retool, and was very pleasantly surprised as to how quickly my economy recovered. My continent had 5 civs (me Brennus, JC, Bismark, Alex), and the remaining two were still out there, so with domination in mind I went through Engineering and Gunpowder before trying to finish Liberalism (I was far enough ahead down that path that I figured I could detour). With Jannies, Maces, and Trebs/Cats I was able to make some inroads into Germany (after bribing Alex to take him on first) which was a World Wonder feast (should have built more troops, Bizzy). Soon, he was done and it was just Alex left to challenge - sort of.
After all of this, I retooled again for the final push. The best here is that with Gunpowder and Engineering on board, I was able to take CHEMISTRY with the discovery of Liberalism. That also allowed me to then start in on Steel for my next tech.
Here's a great stack for you: upgraded/promoted grens supported by jannies and a knight or two with trebs and then soon cannons to follow. My trouble in the past with getting grens and then cannons so quickly is that I was a fair distance from rifles at that point, and muskets had issues with enemy mounted units (usually knights, but cavs are very bad). My jannies did GREAT against Alex's knights and my stack cut through things quite well. He did get rifling toward the end of things, but I had a ton of grens so no problems there.
The other two civs (Toku and Teddy Roos) were non-factors really. One tried to make a landing and attack while the other proved to be a fairly reliable tech trading partner (can you guess which was which - you'd be right).
In all, the power of having larger cities with expansive/great UB/ combined with larger territory with Organized/cheaper courthouses was key. Match that with a handy UU that protected my grens and siege from just about anything, and there you have it.
Of course, if JC had iron early in this game, yikes!
Had Brennus very close to me and was able to take his food-rich capital and the Jewish holy city (shame it was placed so poorly, but kept it) before moving on. Normally, I would have held up a bit and plotted the total removal of Brennus, but two things made me change strategies -
1. Brennus had some cities on hills and had built Duns - a pain to take those early without siege.
2. Julius Ceaser had expanded toward me and was getting close to iron.
Didn't know if I could handle taking too many more cities, by gathered what I could (had construction at least) and threw it had the Roman capital first. In short, the war was pretty successful, and I kept more cities than I had originally planned (including the Roman Hindu Holy City). Thankfully, I had built the Oracle and took COL, and with courthouses and larger cities (thanks to Hammans and the expansive trait) I was able to maintain very well.
I took some time to retool, and was very pleasantly surprised as to how quickly my economy recovered. My continent had 5 civs (me Brennus, JC, Bismark, Alex), and the remaining two were still out there, so with domination in mind I went through Engineering and Gunpowder before trying to finish Liberalism (I was far enough ahead down that path that I figured I could detour). With Jannies, Maces, and Trebs/Cats I was able to make some inroads into Germany (after bribing Alex to take him on first) which was a World Wonder feast (should have built more troops, Bizzy). Soon, he was done and it was just Alex left to challenge - sort of.
After all of this, I retooled again for the final push. The best here is that with Gunpowder and Engineering on board, I was able to take CHEMISTRY with the discovery of Liberalism. That also allowed me to then start in on Steel for my next tech.
Here's a great stack for you: upgraded/promoted grens supported by jannies and a knight or two with trebs and then soon cannons to follow. My trouble in the past with getting grens and then cannons so quickly is that I was a fair distance from rifles at that point, and muskets had issues with enemy mounted units (usually knights, but cavs are very bad). My jannies did GREAT against Alex's knights and my stack cut through things quite well. He did get rifling toward the end of things, but I had a ton of grens so no problems there.
The other two civs (Toku and Teddy Roos) were non-factors really. One tried to make a landing and attack while the other proved to be a fairly reliable tech trading partner (can you guess which was which - you'd be right).
In all, the power of having larger cities with expansive/great UB/ combined with larger territory with Organized/cheaper courthouses was key. Match that with a handy UU that protected my grens and siege from just about anything, and there you have it.
Of course, if JC had iron early in this game, yikes!
Florian
Prince
- Joined
- Jun 23, 2003
- Messages
- 337
This reminds me of a non-Mehmed-related question. How do you know how much of a city's defensive percentage comes from walls, and how much from culture? I never use that "ignore walls" ability that gunpowder troops have, because I always bombard the defenses down near zero before attacking. But if I knew the cultural defense was gone, and the walls were all that was left, I would attack sooner with my gunpowder troops.
Kev
Hired Goon
Few reasons -
Yes, because they had seen some action they were promoted - with city defense and terrain defense modifiers. I also had a very good HE city producing highly promoted units (instructors, vassalage, theocracy, etc), and it cranked out a great deal of defensive Jannies. My grens were promoted with city raider from their sword/axe/macemen days, and those that were new were given extra attack/bonus vs. gunpowder promos (can never remember the actual names of the promotions properly).
When slogging through enemy territory, I kept to forest/hills where the jans could be more useful to defend. When I got to the cities, therefore, my siege and grens were at full strength. Then, while healing within the cities (with a medic III chariot), jannies were better at defending counterattacks - whatever form they took.
Basically, the defensive modifiers +terrain/city defense made them key.
futurehermit
Deity
- Joined
- Apr 3, 2006
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I told you I was rusty that game. My goal is to have warring completely done by 600-1000AD to settle down to grow cottages.
Ok, yeah if you really intend to stop warring that early, then the janissaries probably will come too late.
Still, your original choices civ choices (Rome etc.) are in that case preferable to Mehmed, shame to waste such a good UU
On a related note: I think it's a terrible shame for Civs such as e.g. America that skilled players will not be able reap the benefits of Malls/Navy SEALs since they would be finished with the game (or at least have victory in the bag) well before the appearance of the uniques.
Perhaps one ancient, one modern unique per civ would be more balanced.. But thats another discussion
futurehermit
Deity
- Joined
- Apr 3, 2006
- Messages
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I agree that Mehmed is not the best choice for this strat We're talking about two different things I think 
I think Augustus is best suited to my strat, which is why I didn't include Ottomans in the title of my other thread I was just enjoying Mehmed and wanted to try out the other strat so that's what happened
I think with civs like the USA you just have to plan things differently. For example, I plan to do domination with USA and beeline industrialism. If you pull it off you have two solid units with which to clean house and transports for intercontinental warfare.
And since I'm Canadian, I have to say that how can you play the USA without going for world domination?
We're talking about two different things I think I think Augustus is best suited to my strat, which is why I didn't include Ottomans in the title of my other thread I was just enjoying Mehmed and wanted to try out the other strat so that's what happened I think with civs like the USA you just have to plan things differently. For example, I plan to do domination with USA and beeline industrialism. If you pull it off you have two solid units with which to clean house and transports for intercontinental warfare.
And since I'm Canadian, I have to say that how can you play the USA without going for world domination? tboner23
Chieftain
Independance Hall - courthouse
+1 (from signing of declaration of independance)
+1 free unit (from local militia for fighting off the English)
plus the usual courthouse maintenance bonus. might even be more useful than the mall.
+1
(from signing of declaration of independance)+1 free unit (from local militia for fighting off the English)
plus the usual courthouse maintenance bonus. might even be more useful than the mall.
I don't know.. M1A1 War Chariot?
Seriously though, I suppose Americas older UU would have to be at earliest a 16th or 17th century unit.
Melon Head
Warlord
- Joined
- Sep 6, 2006
- Messages
- 134
I suppose if you really wanted to, America could have the Minuteman for a UU. A rifleman unit with free woodsman I and maybe a bonus to attacking out of woods.
obsolete
Deity
It seems that even Ramnesses is a dominant choice over Stalin. I just don't understand why anyone would pick Stalin compared to the much better leaders out there.
tboner23
Chieftain
I believe that frob2900 was only referring to one unique, whether building or unit, that comes earlier in the game, and one that come later. The American civilization is not an ancient civilization, so it cannot have an ancient unique. I believe the merits of civilizations being chosen by Firaxis, and their leaders, have been discussed many times on this forum many times before.
The Roman unique building is a forum, but I believe there was only one forum, in Rome itself, and not one in every city of the roman empire.
Perhaps in Civ V, they can add an option that after a certain period, the player chooses a new civilization to have their empire become that is more fitting to the time period in history. Sort of like Rhy's and Fall in BtS. Maybe when a certain era is reached rather than years A.D. or B.C.
