Minnesota muzzles maudlin Muslims...

[IglooDame]

And then they'll be accused of Islamophobia

Arguably, the accusations would be accurate.

 

[Guangxi]

y`know whats great? disregarding inconvenient religious obligations. how many catholics refuse to use a condom?

 

[sabo]

I live in Minneapolis and this actually happened to me, (not at the airport) the cabbie refused to give me a ride home when I directed him to the liquor store, I was not drunk but he dropped me off to a second cabbie at the liquor store who gave me a ride home. The funny thing is the second cabbie was Muslim too. I guess it's not a universal ban for ALL muslim cabbies

 

[amadeus]

A bit extreme, I would have preferred drivers having to go back to the start of the line.

You obviously aren't familiar with our airport.

I think a much more religiously accommodating solution would have been to permit Muslim taxi drivers to ask potential passengers whether or not they have alcohol with them. If they do, they can simply take the next cab which is right behind the one they were considering taking (not all cab drivers are Muslims ). If they have no alcohol with them, the taxi driver would be able to drive them without feeling that they've failed to meet a requirement of their religion.

The airport's duty is to transport people from one city to another, not to appease religious fanatics; the duty of the cab drivers is to transport those people from the airport to their destination within these cities.

I'm sure that there are Mormons traveling through MSP that don't like alcohol, but I have yet to hear a single peep from any of them.

And then they'll be accused of Islamophobia

Or faced with a lawsuit.

 

[El_Machinae]

y`know whats great? disregarding inconvenient religious obligations. how many catholics refuse to use a condom?

Hmmn, that's a tougher analogy to make. How many Catholic hookers refuse service to johns who're going to be using a condom?

See, it's tougher to get the whole analogy working ...

 

[amadeus]

I can't think of all too many people using condoms while in a taxi, except maybe Beldar Conehead.

 

[Che Guava]

These cabbies aren't public servants, just mobile entrepeneurs, right? What I'm getting at is aren't store owners allowed to refuse service to whomever they like, s long as it doesn't violate thier civil rights?

 

[Rossiya]

Minnesota muzzles maudlin Muslims...

I love the alliteration.

 

[amadeus]

These cabbies aren't public servants, just mobile entrepeneurs, right? What I'm getting at is aren't store owners allowed to refuse service to whomever they like, s long as it doesn't violate thier civil rights?

You need to have permission from the Metropolitan Airports Commission to pick up fares from the airport, though.

It'd be like if a store clerk refused service to somebody, despite orders from the boss to serve that person; the boss would then be in his right to reprimand the clerk. In this case, the boss is MAC, and the clerks are the drivers.

 

[Che Guava]

You need to have permission from the Metropolitan Airports Commission to pick up fares from the airport, though.

It'd be like if a store clerk refused service to somebody, despite orders from the boss to serve that person; the boss would then be in his right to reprimand the clerk. In this case, the boss is MAC, and the clerks are the drivers.

Ah, well that is a bit of a different situation. I guess the MAC is within thier rights to do that....

 

[Little Raven]

These cabbies aren't public servants, just mobile entrepeneurs, right? What I'm getting at is aren't store owners allowed to refuse service to whomever they like, s long as it doesn't violate thier civil rights?

Yes and no. In theory, I'm allowed to operate a store that, say, only caters to white people. In practice, the Supreme Court has ruled that anything that affect interstate commerce is subject to Federal discrimination laws, and they've also ruled that EVERYTHING affects interstate commerce.

I’m not sure that’s relevant to this case, though. It seems that the airport licenses which cabbies can and cannot provide service to its establishment, which it is perfectly within its rights to do. The MAC isn’t saying that taxi drivers can’t refuse to carry people that have alcohol; it’s saying that those taxi drivers won’t be welcome to do business at the airport.

edit - amadeus, amadeus, damn amadeus....

 

[Che Guava]

Yes and no. In theory, I'm allowed to operate a store that, say, only caters to white people. In practice, the Supreme Court has ruled that anything that affect interstate commerce is subject to Federal discrimination laws, and they've also ruled that EVERYTHING affects interstate commerce.

But that's what I was saying there: excluding people on the basis of skin colour violates thier civil rights, there are no such specific rights for people consuming or transporting alcohol...

I’m not sure that’s relevant to this case, though. It seems that the airport licenses which cabbies can and cannot provide service to its establishment, which it is perfectly within its rights to do. The MAC isn’t saying that taxi drivers can’t refuse to carry people that have alcohol; it’s saying that those taxi drivers won’t be welcome to do business at the airport.

WHich brings up another interesting point: is the MAC then discriminating on the basis of the relgion of the cabbies, much like the example you provided above...?

 

[El_Machinae]

I don't think so; it's not like we're living in a society where we suddenly expect cabbies to start transporting booze. Transporting booze has been a subset of the cabbie job for some time.

 

[Little Raven]

But that's what I was saying there: excluding people on the basis of skin colour violates thier civil rights, there are no such specific rights for people consuming or transporting alcohol...

Right. I was merely providing context. There is no law stopping an independent contractor from refusing to carry alcoholic beverages.

WHich brings up another interesting point: is the MAC then discriminating on the basis of the relgion of the cabbies, much like the example you provided above...?

Not according to Federal standards. The MAC isn't saying they won't license Muslims, they're saying they won't license Muslims who refuse to transport alcohol. Given that the majority of taxi drivers that service the airport are Muslim, and that customers were only refused service 27 times out of an estimated 120,000 rides last year, it seems safe to say that many Muslims have no problem transporting alcohol, and regardless, under Federal standards, the MAC is well within its rights to determine that the transport of alcohol is a necessary component of service when it comes to the taxi drivers it employs.

Now it is possible that the taxi drivers have better recourse under Minnesota law. I don’t know enough to say, but even the MAC lawyers admit the Cabbies may ultimately prevail in state court, which to me suggests they may have a pretty good shot if they choose to take that route.

 

[Che Guava]

true, but of course one might make the distinction that those muslims who did transport alcohol were not observant, or at very least not as strict.

Lots of jews eat bacon, but we still have kosher meals on airplanes, no?

 

[Little Raven]

true, but of course one might make the distinction that those muslims who did transport alcohol were not observant, or at very least not as strict.

You might, but no court in this country will.

Lots of jews eat bacon, but we still have kosher meals on airplanes, no?

If the airline chooses to supply them. No airline is required to have kosher meals.

I can't refuse to hire you because you're Jewish, but I'm not required to add a kosher menu option to the factory cafeteria just because I have a Jew on staff.

 

[Che Guava]

You might, but no court in this country will.

They might just surpirse you

If the airline chooses to supply them. No airline is required to have kosher meals.

I can't refuse to hire you because you're Jewish, but I'm not required to add a kosher menu option to the factory cafeteria just because I have a Jew on staff

Poor example, I admit, it was just the first one that came to mind...

 

[Stacmon]

The airport's duty is to transport people from one city to another, not to appease religious fanatics; the duty of the cab drivers is to transport those people from the airport to their destination within these cities.

It's comments like these that really make me wonder about some people . I love it how people associate the religiously observant with religious fanatics. Just because they don't want to compromise on their values (they believe that consumption of alcohol is wrong) they shouldn't be labeled fanatics.

It's surprisingly common for people to think Muslims that pray 5 times daily, abstain from alcohol, etc. (in other words practice) are fundamentalists. They're comfortable with Muslims that are completely unobservant and that's about as far as their tolerance goes...

 

[skadistic]

It's comments like these that really make me wonder about some people . I love it how people associate the religiously observant with religious fanatics. Just because they don't want to compromise on their values (they believe that consumption of alcohol is wrong) they shouldn't be labeled fanatics.

It's surprisingly common for people to think Muslims that pray 5 times daily, abstain from alcohol, etc. (in other words practice) are fundamentalists. They're comfortable with Muslims that are completely unobservant and that's about as far as their tolerance goes...

Forcing your religous beliefs on some one in your secular job makes you a fanatic.

 

[Little Raven]

It's comments like these that really make me wonder about some people . I love it how people associate the religiously observant with religious fanatics. Just because they don't want to compromise on their values (they believe that consumption of alcohol is wrong) they shouldn't be labeled fanatics.

I agree with you. It is unfair to label someone a fanatic just because they believe in observing the tenants of their faith. A Muslim who refuses to transport alcohol need not be a fanatic...he just shouldn't be a taxi driver.