MM1: Defiant Sid.
- Thread starter Mark1031
- Start date
If the Americans are not attacking our armies then I think it's over.akots
Poet
Nice turns! We are making great progress! Not sure about the Defiant variant rules since we had to boot that American cavalry on the very first turn when it was in our borders but this is a minor issue indeed and should not influence the outcome substantially IMO. We could have apparently afforded to steal this tech. 
I've got the save and will try to play over the weekend after finishing GOTM.
So, just hammer Lincoln to death? Pillage first and then start attacks on cities or do it all at once?
Can we try to go for Domination by settling American island/continent, de-mobilizing and building temples there? I'll check with MapStat but looks like we would need a chunk of Egypt/Persia/Arabia.
Regarding war happiness, apparently, war with America was a huge temporary boost. IIRC, it would have been even if we just declared on our own. Our Viking people hate America and would be greatly pleased to crush their skulls!
I've got the save and will try to play over the weekend after finishing GOTM.
So, just hammer Lincoln to death? Pillage first and then start attacks on cities or do it all at once?
Can we try to go for Domination by settling American island/continent, de-mobilizing and building temples there? I'll check with MapStat but looks like we would need a chunk of Egypt/Persia/Arabia.
Regarding war happiness, apparently, war with America was a huge temporary boost. IIRC, it would have been even if we just declared on our own. Our Viking people hate America and would be greatly pleased to crush their skulls!
anarres
anarchist revolutionary
Akots - I *did* boot on the first turn! 
I managaed to take the American unit in our borders by settling a city next to it on the Zulu island, and I ordered it leave that turn. In fact I had 2 American units I could have settled next to, so our Defiant variant is safe. (Well, apart from earlier when I was keeping cities
)
I managaed to take the American unit in our borders by settling a city next to it on the Zulu island, and I ordered it leave that turn. In fact I had 2 American units I could have settled next to, so our Defiant variant is safe. (Well, apart from earlier when I was keeping cities
)
anarres
anarchist revolutionary
I would definitely go for pillaging first, then the cities. I guess we will find out in the next interturn as our Cav army is out in the open for the first time within range of the American artillery...
akots
Poet
Preturn check. Wow! We have really many units! Changed a few citizens to tax collectors, all the builds intact. Press Enter. America allied with Egypt against us. Americans tried to take our conscript infantries fortified on a mountain near New Bergen with guerillas. Both units promoted to regular. Armies were bombarded with artillery. Infantry army is OK but cavalry army lost 1hp. Privateer killed one of the galleons.
[1] 1555AD. Pillaging is on the way. I was just curious to see how many defenders Miami has. It were 11 vet riflemen, 6 vet guerillas and 2 regular riflemen. May be more spearmen and other stuff down there. That is a lot of units we have to kill.
[2] 1560AD. Miami bombarded heavily and attack can be started even next turn. Armies suffer some damage but are still green.
[3] 1565AD. Not the best bombard round, assault on Miami postponed. Pillaging is under way but few tiles are blocked with units.
[4] 1570AD. We positively don't have enough arty to take Miami. A few extra arties partly cash-rushed. IBT. Bad news, we lost cavalry army there, alas. It was green but has been bombarded by ships as well as arty and killed by 4 rifles. Good news is that another army is ready in Bergen.
[5] 1575AD. The new cavalry army killed 3 rifles in Miami before redlining.
[6] 1580AD. Most of defenders are redlined and our 6 heroic zerks charge taking out 4 redlined guerillas. We then attack with cavalry and infantry, losing 2 of each but killing many defenders. I really did not count, it was about 20 or so. Next turn the city should fall. IBT. A swarm of American units rush to Miami, at least 50 rifles and as many guerillas.
[7] 1585AD. Miami is finally razed. Some war happiness wears out and luxuries increased to 10%. There are still some weird things about this mobilization when switching builds from artillery to cavalry and back but I dont really understand what is going on. IMO we might want few more cavalries for the final push after bombardment and armies. Chicago is apparently the next target. Boston has been starving because of a number of desert tiles around it and does not look like a great city. Also, Im afraid Ive been using drafting a bit too exploitatively and there is a great unhappiness about it among the population. But cities are not starving yet. All conscripts went to Bergen to speed up the army build.
[8] 1590AD. Moving arty to Chicago.
[9] 1595AD. We all set for Chicago.
[10] 1600AD. Battle at the suburbs yields Hubba which is sent to New Farsund to build an army. Make sure to build an army with him first next turn and then attack with our elites. We dont have enough cavalry for loading into armies this turn so the new army near Chicago has been loaded with 2 cavalries only. I have switched a few builds to cavalries instead of infantries when they can be efficiently partially rushed. So far it goes well against America but very slowly. We had almost decent enough arty force but not enough ground troops to finish the job earlier. Basically, 3 turns were wasted. On the other hand, no need to hurry much, still there is time and looks like Lincoln cannot get cultural victory. Washington has 14.5K and total America has 67.9K. Also, I noticed some American units disappearing occasional into nowhere which means probably they are disbanded dues to bankruptcy.
Here is battleground Chicago:
[1] 1555AD. Pillaging is on the way. I was just curious to see how many defenders Miami has. It were 11 vet riflemen, 6 vet guerillas and 2 regular riflemen. May be more spearmen and other stuff down there. That is a lot of units we have to kill.
[2] 1560AD. Miami bombarded heavily and attack can be started even next turn. Armies suffer some damage but are still green.
[3] 1565AD. Not the best bombard round, assault on Miami postponed. Pillaging is under way but few tiles are blocked with units.
[4] 1570AD. We positively don't have enough arty to take Miami. A few extra arties partly cash-rushed. IBT. Bad news, we lost cavalry army there, alas. It was green but has been bombarded by ships as well as arty and killed by 4 rifles. Good news is that another army is ready in Bergen.
[5] 1575AD. The new cavalry army killed 3 rifles in Miami before redlining.
[6] 1580AD. Most of defenders are redlined and our 6 heroic zerks charge taking out 4 redlined guerillas. We then attack with cavalry and infantry, losing 2 of each but killing many defenders. I really did not count, it was about 20 or so. Next turn the city should fall. IBT. A swarm of American units rush to Miami, at least 50 rifles and as many guerillas.
[7] 1585AD. Miami is finally razed. Some war happiness wears out and luxuries increased to 10%. There are still some weird things about this mobilization when switching builds from artillery to cavalry and back but I dont really understand what is going on. IMO we might want few more cavalries for the final push after bombardment and armies. Chicago is apparently the next target. Boston has been starving because of a number of desert tiles around it and does not look like a great city. Also, Im afraid Ive been using drafting a bit too exploitatively and there is a great unhappiness about it among the population. But cities are not starving yet. All conscripts went to Bergen to speed up the army build.
[8] 1590AD. Moving arty to Chicago.
[9] 1595AD. We all set for Chicago.
[10] 1600AD. Battle at the suburbs yields Hubba which is sent to New Farsund to build an army. Make sure to build an army with him first next turn and then attack with our elites. We dont have enough cavalry for loading into armies this turn so the new army near Chicago has been loaded with 2 cavalries only. I have switched a few builds to cavalries instead of infantries when they can be efficiently partially rushed. So far it goes well against America but very slowly. We had almost decent enough arty force but not enough ground troops to finish the job earlier. Basically, 3 turns were wasted. On the other hand, no need to hurry much, still there is time and looks like Lincoln cannot get cultural victory. Washington has 14.5K and total America has 67.9K. Also, I noticed some American units disappearing occasional into nowhere which means probably they are disbanded dues to bankruptcy.
Here is battleground Chicago:
Attachments
akots
Poet
And the save
akots
Poet
Just wanted to add that when the army gets yellow, it can be fortified. Since there are 4 units within it, bombardment by American arty takes off only 2-3 hitpoints maximum and the army heals at 4hp/turn, so actually this helps to keep them alive.
anarres
anarchist revolutionary
A great set of turns! This is looking more and more certain now. 
Did you consider making an Inf army? If they are immune from shelling it guarentees a win because we can sit there as long as we want without getting attacked while we finish them off.
Maybe we're doing just fine with Cav armies - they certainly are amazingly effective at pillaging.
Did you consider making an Inf army? If they are immune from shelling it guarentees a win because we can sit there as long as we want without getting attacked while we finish them off.
Maybe we're doing just fine with Cav armies - they certainly are amazingly effective at pillaging.
Aggie
Deity
I'm so happy to see this game alive again. Good progress by the way!! I'll be cheering for you
akots
Poet
Actually, the combo army we have (3 swords plus infantry) is doing OK when fortified. Zerk amy should also be OK, it heals faster than the hitpoints are bombarded away if rested for a turn on a tile (pillaging this tile does not count as movement and does not hamper healing). We need an offensive touch to take off these 1hp defenders (rifles and guerillas). For this, cavalry armies are indispensable. Cavalries themselves are also more or less OK and I used even infantires but still cavalry armies rule. There are just too many redlined units to kill. IMO, infantry armies are OK but too slow on pillaging and still vulnerable to arty fire. Besides, America has very few unpillaged tiles left which are mostly covered by troops. We can though launch an infantry army to Egypt. However, this would essentially forfeit a possibility of making peace with them.
It is Ok with coastal cities in America since wounded units can be taken home to heal and reinforcements can be delivered. But when we would go to Washington, this would be rather difficult to accomplish. Apparently, only with army escort. Also, America has two other cities on a remote island. It might be worth thinking of goign after that remote island. If not completely eliminated, they would have all these troops wondering over their home island and we would be unable to normally settle the area.
IMO, there are still many obstacles to overcome.
Edited: just checked with Flip calculator, New Karistad has a fair chances to flip. We have an option either to abandon the city or to keep about 20-30 units there or just pray that it does not happen before Chicago is razed.
It is Ok with coastal cities in America since wounded units can be taken home to heal and reinforcements can be delivered. But when we would go to Washington, this would be rather difficult to accomplish. Apparently, only with army escort. Also, America has two other cities on a remote island. It might be worth thinking of goign after that remote island. If not completely eliminated, they would have all these troops wondering over their home island and we would be unable to normally settle the area.
IMO, there are still many obstacles to overcome.
Edited: just checked with Flip calculator, New Karistad has a fair chances to flip. We have an option either to abandon the city or to keep about 20-30 units there or just pray that it does not happen before Chicago is razed.
anarres
anarchist revolutionary
How big is the required garrison to eliminate the chance of flip?
akots
Poet
anarres said:
From MapStat:
New Karistad: chances 3.79%, req. garrison 89 units
New Sarpsborg: 2.22% - 45 units
New Farsund: 2.02% - 45
This is to America. There are two other cities which might flip to Egypt:
New Bodo 2.03% - 41 units
New Haugesund 1.01% - 21 units.
New Bergen can flip to Persia and New Stavanger to Egypt but chances are about 0.5% each.
anarres
anarchist revolutionary
With those numbers I wouldn't worry too much. Maybe just keep 0 or 20+ units in a city, but not inbetween.
Sorry I just did the executive summary.
Pre: Switch around a lot of worker builds to settlers or arty and merge most of the native workers to cities to save $$$. Switch all towns with rax to cavs. We need more, I dont see much use for infantry.
Bombard Chicago and realize we need more arty. Cash/draft rush about 10 more and ship them over. This is going to be a tough slog. They have over 20 troops in the city. Isolate the city and heal armies while waiting for arty/cav reinforcement. Leader fishing nets 1 for another cav army. Take city in 1625 getting another leader. I decide to just move on DC as taking it out will remove the culture threat and give us time to take out the remaining ton of troops. Cut off the city, bombard in 1650. They have at least 25 troops in there. Take them down to the underlying cavs but can't finish them. They move up about 30 reinforcements and I decide to take one more turn to take them out before the troops can move into the city. We are successful but have 4 redlined cav armies and lost about 8 troops total in the assault. We have a lot of war weariness and Egypt will take straight up peace so I do. We are still at 30% lux but have plenty of cash built up to continue the war. I would take out NY and Seattle, this will open up a huge culture space. We can then put a city down and gas the Americans as they go for that city. They still have about 100 troops walking around plus what are in cities. I think it would be easier to take down unfortified stacks as they move on a city.
Anarres is up.
Pre: Switch around a lot of worker builds to settlers or arty and merge most of the native workers to cities to save $$$. Switch all towns with rax to cavs. We need more, I dont see much use for infantry.
Bombard Chicago and realize we need more arty. Cash/draft rush about 10 more and ship them over. This is going to be a tough slog. They have over 20 troops in the city. Isolate the city and heal armies while waiting for arty/cav reinforcement. Leader fishing nets 1 for another cav army. Take city in 1625 getting another leader. I decide to just move on DC as taking it out will remove the culture threat and give us time to take out the remaining ton of troops. Cut off the city, bombard in 1650. They have at least 25 troops in there. Take them down to the underlying cavs but can't finish them. They move up about 30 reinforcements and I decide to take one more turn to take them out before the troops can move into the city. We are successful but have 4 redlined cav armies and lost about 8 troops total in the assault. We have a lot of war weariness and Egypt will take straight up peace so I do. We are still at 30% lux but have plenty of cash built up to continue the war. I would take out NY and Seattle, this will open up a huge culture space. We can then put a city down and gas the Americans as they go for that city. They still have about 100 troops walking around plus what are in cities. I think it would be easier to take down unfortified stacks as they move on a city.
Anarres is up.
akots
Poet
Washington is no more!!! [dance]
anarres
anarchist revolutionary
Wow, I'm up already! 
It may be the weekend before I can play.
It may be the weekend before I can play.
akots
Poet
I'm just thinking that killing wondering units would be very tough since Lincoln has a swarm of them. If they are not going to reinforce the defenders in the city, may be just leave them alone. When we raze cities, may be this would prevent America from building more units and would decrease the rate of their appearance on the battleground. It would be interesting out of pure curiosity to build Intelligence Agency and see how many spearmen Arabs have in their military. Bet less than a thousand.
Aggie
Deity
I just read through the thread and I'm very excited about how you progress in this game. I'm very happy to see that the three of you managed to keep this going and make such excellent progress (as said before).
Now comes a humble question... Could I please join this SG again?
I got back from my holiday refreshed and I must say that my enthousiasm for this SG has returned.
Now comes a humble question... Could I please join this SG again?
I got back from my holiday refreshed and I must say that my enthousiasm for this SG has returned.akots
Poet
It would be really nice to have you back in the game.
The game is getting somewhat tedious and gory (IMO) with endless American troops impaling themselves on our glorious artillery and cavalry armies. A certain temporary relief from butchering Lincoln's troops should be apparently wellcome.
On the other hand, any idea of how to accelerate the process would be highly appreciated. For example, if we can invent some poisonous gas or other means of mass-slaughter.
The game is getting somewhat tedious and gory (IMO) with endless American troops impaling themselves on our glorious artillery and cavalry armies. A certain temporary relief from butchering Lincoln's troops should be apparently wellcome.
On the other hand, any idea of how to accelerate the process would be highly appreciated. For example, if we can invent some poisonous gas or other means of mass-slaughter.
