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Mod Idea - Colonies

Discussion in 'Civ5 - Creation & Customization' started by Thorburne, Sep 25, 2010.

  1. Thorburne

    Thorburne Centurion

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    I got to thinking about how the system is pretty restricive about expanding to wide (you can do it, but at some pretty serious hits that slow down your policies and happiness). One thing that bothers me with this is the fact that some areas are ripe for a settlement, but would stretch you beyond your limits. This can be troublesome when you take into account resources that your citizens are clamoring for or you could use (especially at later game), but you are already taxed.

    My solution... colonies. Not exactly like in Civ IV, but more like cities you can found as puppet states. They would fall under your empire, but they don't count against your city count when it comes to culture. They could also be the gateway toward a revolution mod.

    Any thoughts?
     
  2. Louis XXIV

    Louis XXIV Le Roi Soleil

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    Aside from not counting towards social policy penalty, what would be the point? New cities and Puppet Cities both have the same unhappiness.

    Not a bad idea overall, though. I could see some use (give you more flexibility), even if it wouldn't be used all the time.
     
  3. Thorburne

    Thorburne Centurion

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    Well, it will have to be ironed out... but I see it as a way of expanding without taxing you too much. The SP penalty can be pretty challenging to overcome and hinder expansion. This is especially true on huge maps (the way I like to play).

    I picture being able to send a settler (colonist) to a relatively remote location (cut-off from "homeland" by other Civs or water) and have them settle these colonies that act as puppet-states and provide you the resources and benefits of the land they settle. Just as puppet states, you have no control over what they build or how they work the land. I am thinking make them a cross between puppet-states and city-states. They aren't seperate, but they can make their own units and occasionally ask you for things (troops, assistance, etc).

    Again, they could lead to a "revolution" or "Civil war" feature that allows them to become independent Civs. Well, it's a possibility, anyway!
     
  4. T_F

    T_F Reynardine the Great

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    Perhaps rather than turn them into puppets, release them as multi-city city states with a large relationship value? It would decay over time just like what happened historically.
     
  5. Louis XXIV

    Louis XXIV Le Roi Soleil

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    I presume they wouldn't be able to vote in the diplomatic victory, however?
     
  6. Thorburne

    Thorburne Centurion

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    That is correct! I was figuring along those lines! (mabye once they became full fledged civ's in a revolution scenario as mentioned earlier... but that is getting ahead)
     
  7. Doskias51

    Doskias51 Chieftain

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    Yeah probably the easiest way for this to happen would to make a unit called colonist (could become available during a Medieval era tech?)and it would settle a city state that basically just decayed influence a little slower, but would somehow be able to be multi city.
     
  8. Abremms

    Abremms Chieftain

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    i like the idea of being able to designate a new city as a colony (perhaps only if it is founded on a different continent or island from your capital) I wonder if you could set it up so that you could make requests of it, but it would not always follow your orders... some middle ground between puppets and normal cities. like you could tell it "focus on culture" and, for the most part" it would. i think in this system, colonies would still increase your culture cap, but not nearly so much as a normal city.

    another option would be to tell them to be "self sufficient" which would cede any real control you might have, but GREATLY reduce any maintenance costs of the colony. i dunno, just spitballing.

    i also really like the idea of puppets or colonies rising up if left un-annexed for too long (or some other mechanic) and declaring independence.
     
  9. Abremms

    Abremms Chieftain

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    i like this idea very much as well. i think it would need to provide slightly larger bonuses than city states though, so you have an even better reason to keep your colonies in line.

    this would also be amazing on Terra maps where you could have colonial wars without much upsetting things in the old world.
     
  10. gunnergoz

    gunnergoz Cat Herder

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    A VERY COOL idea! I hope someone mods it soon! I like the "colonist" settler idea - cheaper and better at overseas growth but whose subsequent population gets disaffected with the mother country over time and wants to go Independent State. You could even set it up so that such colony cities' home grown settlers would be only "colonists" and so any subsequent cites they found would have greater loyalty to their founding city in the new world, than to the mother country.
    I would prefer these colonies be self sufficient, like puppet states and not directly manipulated by the player - its more realistic for one thing. After all, many if not most of the interior cities in the new world were established by colonists coming existing colonies, not by the mother country which usually only settled along the coasts.
     
  11. Thorburne

    Thorburne Centurion

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    Personally, I think that they would be better as puppets as opposed to city-states. City-States are too independant and puppets, while they rule themselves, are still part of your civ. I think that the big difference would be that they can build their own units as well. They would kind of be a cross between the colonies of CIV IV and the puppet states of CIV V. This way the unit count goes against them alone, and not you. Perhaps a communication element could be implemented (with no real leaders) that allow you to issue orders, request or demands and to interact (to a lesser extent) with colonies of other Civs.

    I would say a classical tech (maybe optics) since many ancient civs started out as colonies of other civs. Greece was a bunch of city-states that founded colonies throughout the Med. Carthage started as a colony of Phoenicia.

    Of course, you could (after a certain point) annex them fully into your civ, just as you can do with a puppet.

    I kind of like that idea... where the colonies could expand themselves. Definitely some potential. Unfortunately, I am sure that a mod like this would be completely out of my ability, but hopefully, somebody will pick it up.
     
  12. Baleur

    Baleur Chieftain

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    Frankly i'd love the exact civ4 colonies system in civ5. Loved the feeling of seeding a "new" little empire, subjugated to your will >_<
     
  13. MatThePhat

    MatThePhat Fanatic

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    I felt I'd throw in my two cents for any random person browsing these threads. The new expansion really gave me thoughts about how to implement colonies with the new espionage system.

    Special settler unit (colonist) that is cheaper to make and probably has one more movement or something (while embarked and on land)

    When its founded, it makes a city-state with random attributes. Also, give it a worker and a soldier? You get X amount of favor from it (something big, maybe 90 or something?). The favor degrades normally.

    The city-state does not give benefits until it reaches population 3 (like the maritime benefit does not trigger, this just seems more realistic, since a colony doesn't pay back from day one)

    After Y amount of time (30 or 60 turns maybe? Civ V is big on multiples of 30), if you are still the highest in favor and still their ally, the colony becomes a part of your empire and you gain control of it like any normal settlement (or maybe it comes back as a puppet state, so you have the option to annex it or not)

    If you are not the highest favor, and/or are not the ally of your colony, it becomes its own civilization.

    If you have favor with another civilization's colony and it becomes its own civilization, you are in a certain diplomatic standing with it (If you are a 'friend' of the colony, you have a friendship pact when it becomes a civilization automatically. If you are an 'ally', you have a defensive pact when it becomes a civilization automatically). If the colony annexes normally into the parent civilization, your favor is wasted.

    Comments: I feel with the espionage system, and giving the opportunity for other civilizations to butt in on your colony, we can really capture the feeling of the age of Exploration, where Britain, France, and all of Europe were fighting for distant spots on the globe. Of course, you also have to make colonies worth it, and I think giving it that autonomy for the early stages of the city works well. It saves on finances and happiness until the city has developed the surrounding area, etc.
     
  14. specialk2121

    specialk2121 Chieftain

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    I know it has been like 2 years since someone talked here, but I thought I'd throw in some ideas.

    You would build a new "Colonist" unit. It can only settle on other continents than your capital. The new colony would work as a city-state but with some extra benefits, ie. extra gold, or more culture. The color scheme for the colony would be the same as the city states, the dashed line for borders, but the colors would be the ruling civ's colors. Your influence would fall a little slower than with city states. If it gets below a certain point they will declare war and try to become an independent nation.
     
  15. Taa

    Taa Chieftain

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    this 2 mods have some similar functionality as mentioned, maybe a smart person could do some tweaking to make it close to what you want ;)
    Revolutions
    Pioneers
     
  16. Skibbi

    Skibbi Chieftain

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    I like the idea of a vassal state (like Civ IV diplomacy mod) where it appoints a random leader that gives you a share of resources.
    Then again, a minor civ such as a city state would be good, as long as when it declares independence, it becomes a computer-controlled major civ.
     

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