[MODCOM]Improvements Outside Borders

[Dom Pedro II]

Thank you for fixing this so fast.

On getting access to a resource isn't a road required to it. Same for a fort from a strategic point of view. The idea of a fort gaining some culture sounds very interesting too. Maybe at a later date these places could be developed by specialist settlers eg Miner/Settler, Engineer/Settler etc whereby after a certain amount of time a city springs up adjacent the resort tile provided optimum city spacing is met and those pesky immigrants may migrate to this wild west town to populate it.

Again Thanks

I think this is a good idea although maybe the city should be built directly on top of the fort. That way you have more say in the location of the city.

And you could create a unit called Militia or something (like in Civ1 ) that would be immediately spawned upon the city's creation that would be weaker than a regular but could be upgraded as well... so you don't get a free frontline unit out of it, but you also don't serve up a city to Barbarians nearby just to be destroyed.

Also, since you're consuming the fort, you could create a Castle building (or better yet make a new kind of building called "Fort") within the city that would simulate the fort that was once on that plot. So that militiaman could actually stand a fair chance of beating any barb units that might decide to harass the city in its infancy.

 

[Grey Fox]

Well, if I build a fort, I probably dont want a city (that I have to maintain) but a defensive location.

 

[Dom Pedro II]

Well, but sooner or later, that area is going to be inhabited anyway... by either you or by your enemies... I'd rather my fort that I build out on the frontier have the possibility to turn into a city and expand my borders than not.

 

[Sureshot]

very nice, i've been hoping for something like this, so many nice things can be done with this.

 

[Zuul]

Could you set a improvement to be able to be build in neutral but not enemy territory? Maybe have a must be within x number of tiles from friendly land.

 

[TheLopez]

Hmmmm... it should be possible... I guess I'll have to add it to my todo list...

 

[Jeckel]

That wouldn't be a bad addition, let me throw a vote for that feature.

 

[Rod]

hello,

I have a very tricky question. Related to the Moderator Action: Cultural Borders stop at ocean/coast.

The idea of this mod is that cultural borders are only on land, but not on sea. So there is the problem to work city tiles in coast or ocean terrain.

So now comes the question:

can you enable your mod to work city tiles outside cultural borders and to build fishing nets and these oil things outside cultural borders ??
Please read the forum rules: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=422889

 

[Caesium]

Just think about you idea and you'll realize, that this won't have any effect.
The city only works on tiles, that are in cultural borders.
You may have the best ressources etc. near to the city - as long as these tiles aren't in your boarders, you can forget about them.

Please correct me, if I'm wrong.

 

[TheLopez]

Yes, you are correct Caesium, you cannot benefit from resources outside your cultural borders.

 

[Dom Pedro II]

Just think about you idea and you'll realize, that this won't have any effect.
The city only works on tiles, that are in cultural borders.
You may have the best ressources etc. near to the city - as long as these tiles aren't in your boarders, you can forget about them.

Please correct me, if I'm wrong.

He realizes that... what he was asking is if there were a way to mod it so that a city COULD work outside its cultural borders.

 

[Caesium]

He realizes that... what he was asking is if there were a way to mod it so that a city COULD work outside its cultural borders.

That's clear, but, why sholud we then have cultural boarders? then we could also remove them completely from game.
In my opinion this is senseless.

 

[Dom Pedro II]

Well, I was just clarifying the point... I didn't say it was a good one

But seriously though, if you added qualifiers to this: for example, it would only apply in neutral territory and even then only on water tiles, then borders still have very much of a purpose... not to mention the fact that borders serve purpose in wars from anything from road/railroad use to heal rates for units.

But I personally have no interest in people being able to work tiles outside their cultural borders... PERHAPS it might be useful as a bonus to certain civs, but even then... my main issue with culture over oceans is mainly a cosmetic one... I don't like how it distorts the contours of the land in the mini-map. I would be happier if the cultural borders did not show on oceans thus correctly displaying the outlines of the continents.

 

[Rod]

Hello,

Don Pedro exactly catches the point, the whole idea is a cosmetic one. That is why i do not ask for removing cultural borders, but I formulated my specific question.

In anyway I really appreciate all your answers as they all make valid points, but I still miss the answer on the question.

Is it possible to create a modification which enables a city to work on tiles outside its cultural borders, but within the city radius ?

 

[Grey Fox]

The biggest problem I see with that is when the city shares its city radius with another city, especially a foreign one. Who will work the tile then? Thats where city borders come in handy.

 

[Rod]

The biggest problem I see with that is when the city shares its city radius with another city, especially a foreign one. Who will work the tile then? Thats where city borders come in handy.

Do we remember Civ I ? Long time back I know...but for me it was like yesterday ..
In Civ I there were no Cultural Borders .... hard to believe I know.

So how it worked there ?

Every city grabbed what it could and when a city grabbed one resource/tile first, it had it. If you and a opponents city overlapped it was all about securing the borders first.
Only when you moved a military unit on a tile of another city then the city had to leave this field and you could overtake it.

Exactly the same we are doing now in this mod with the sea tiles. As there are no cultural borders on sea anymore, every city can grab whichever sea tile it wants as long as it is in its city radius. Who is first is keeping it. Only when a hostile sea units is occupying a tile then the owner is forced to leave it. In this case we can have naval blockades.

What about the resources ?

Automatic. Whenever I take a tile with a resource it automatically gives me the fishing nets.(or the oil or the whaling boats as long as I have the technology discovered) But in this case we have to reduce the boni, they are in anyway tooooo high.

Other option : No sea resources at all. The Harbour will provide a health bonus to compensate the not existing health boni from the not existing resources.

 

[TheLopez]

Updated Warlords version to be compatible with the v2.0.8.0 patch.

 

[remi_936]

Does these available for Civ 4 v1.74 & Warlords v2.13?

 

[seasnake]

Hey, saw this and was wondering two things. First, does this work with BTS, and second, is there a tag that makes building certain improvements an automatic act of war (like entering without OpenBorders?)

I'm trying to add one new improvement, trench. You can build it in enemy territory and your territory, but it's an act of war if you do it.

 

[Jeckel]

You don't need this mod for BTS they made it an official xml option, look in the fort improvement info entry, it can be built outside borders.