Moe Weapons, More Japanese Imperialism?

[BvBPL]

In World War II, American GIs painted pin up girls on the fuselages of their airplanes. This was a deliberate US policy to boost the morale of men deployed abroad during wartime.

Now, Japan is painting manga "moe" style characters on their helicopter gunships and making cartoons about weird rabbit chaff launchers. A video game that reimagines WWII Japanese warships as school girls who slowly get naked as they fight is hugely popular in Japan. This has lead to some concern in places like, oh say, Korea where Japanese militarism is still something of a sore spot.

Heck, the JSDF uses cartoons to recruit people. Don't these dancing cartoon girls with their big saucer eyes make you want to sign up to shoot people in other countries?

Wait? What's that? You say the JSDF doesn't operate outside of Japan? That it would be unconstitutional for it to do so?

Please, tell that to Shinzo Abe, who this year reinterpreted the Constitution to allow for deployment of the JSDF aboard. A move so controversial, it literally caused fist fights over pacifism in the Japanese parliament. Abe has famously insulted Japan's war enemies by calling for an end to Japanese guilt over WWII, denied the existence of comfort women, and has been forced to apologize for referring to the JSDF as a military organization. All of which has raised concerned about an increasing militarization of Japan under Abe.

All this amid a backdrop of cartoons that turn weapons of death into saucer-eyed waifs.

Above: the most powerful battleship in history, the Yamato, reimagined as a teenage girl for the incredibly popular Japanese video game and entertainment franchise Kantai Collection. Fun fact: her sock is based the flag flown by Seiichi Ito during Operation Ten-go. The flag showed a hierarchy of responsibility, running from foolishness (the lowest), up through sensibility, the law, authority, and finally the Emperor. Ironic given that Ito opposed Operation Ten-go as being foolish and was ultimately ordered into the battle by imperial command..

Post script: Almost forgot to mention that amid this, some LDP ministers want to raise the Yamato.

 

[SS-18 ICBM]

Did you have any issues in particular you wanted us to discuss?

But this kawaii imagery is neither conceived of nor perceived as disrespectful. Rather, it’s a testament to the deep ambivalence the Japanese retain about both the history and the changing role of their armed forces. This spring, the hawkish Prime Minister Shinzo Abe was forced to issue a public apology after referring to “our military” instead of the standard “our self-defense forces” during a budget-committee meeting. A few months later, he escalated the situation by ending the nation’s long-standing ban on sending Japanese troops overseas. This extraordinarily controversial bill, which was forced through amidst fistfights on the Parliament floor and massive demonstrations throughout the capital, inspired a great deal of concern among citizens and neighboring countries.

This stressful, ongoing debate fuels the seeming paradox of an “endearing” military force. In Japan, where indirect communication is highly valued, cute illustrations have long played the role of tension-breakers and mediators in situations of conflict. Thus kawaii mascots, whether miniskirted girls or bunny-rabbit decoy launchers, are both a reflection of pop-cultural trends and a way to defuse the very touchy issues surrounding the military’s undeniable presence. Put another way, the time to get worried is when the branches of the Japanese military abandon their kawaii trappings, because that would signal that citizens and soldiers had made their peace with the subject.

Seemed like important points to me.

the most powerful warship in history

Based on what?

 

[warpus]

Japan doesn't have any imperial ambitions, but they do have an obsession with cute cartoony girls with tentacles up their..

 

[BvBPL]

Did you have any issues in particular you wanted us to discuss?

I think the infantilization of the military through the adoption of a cartoon aesthetic concurrent with Abe's reinterpretation of Article 9 is well worthy of discussion.
Particularly today.

Based on what?

Size. The Yamato was both the largest battleship ever constructed and had the largest guns ever placed on a naval vessel.

 

[Joecoolyo]

Based on what?

Size, guns, and armor. Nothing really comes close to it as the US scrapped the Montana-class before it was built.

 

[chijohnaok]

I have generally ignored or been unaware of most of the Japanese anime genre, although I do remember watching Speed Racer and Space Battleship Yamato when I was a child.

Several months ago I became aware of an anime cartoon called "Girls und Panzer" which is basically the story of a group of elementary school girls becoming part of tank war gaming (as in real tanks, not the online gaming sort). The idea of school girls driving and fighting with tanks is preposterous, yet I found myself watching the entire 14 episode series. I still can't explain why...
[The Girls und Panzer anime series can be watched here: http://www.hulu.com/watch/429128 ]

I do realize that Japan has a respectably sized military, something that should not be unexpected for a country of Japan's size and economic ranking.

I don't think that the fascination that some Japanese people have with anime girls in military themed cartoons is a sign of some militaristic imperial resurrection by Japan.

 

[SS-18 ICBM]

I think the infantilization of the military through the adoption of a cartoon aesthetic concurrent with Abe's reinterpretation of Article 9 is well worthy of discussion.
Particularly today.

Would you prefer a straight-laced "support the troops" mentality from the Japanese people then?

Size. The Yamato was both the largest battleship ever constructed and had the largest guns ever placed on a naval vessel.

And yet it still got sunk by a bunch of planes.

 

[hobbsyoyo]

Size, guns, and armor. Nothing really comes close to it as the US scrapped the Montana-class before it was built.

At best we can say that it was the most powerful battleship in history, to quibble over wording. Even then, the upgrades that Iowa class-battleships undertook in the 80's I think would have made them much more lethal than anything produced in WWII that wasn't similarly upgraded (which is basically everything except the Iowas).

These days, the things you list don't really matter if we're discussing the 'power' of a warship. It's hard to quantify how powerful a warship is anymore given the existence of submarines that have neither guns nor armor and are only modestly-sized (compared to battleships) yet pack enough megaton nukes to wipe nations off the Earth in 30 minutes. Or carriers armed with nuclear bombs and bombers that could do the same and also fight a massive conventional campaign the likes of which nothing from WWII could even compare with.

 

[chijohnaok]

I would agree that Yamato was the largest battleship ever launched (by displacement) and carried the largest guns (by caliber) ever on a battleship but as evidenced by its sinking by carrier launched planes, it was not "the most powerful warship in history". US Navy aircraft carriers (more specifically their planes) of WW 2 were able to sink the Yamato.

That distinction today would probably go to the Gerald R. Ford-class aircraft carrier.

 

[BvBPL]

I don't think that the fascination that some Japanese people have with anime girls in military themed cartoons is a sign of some militaristic imperial resurrection by Japan.

"To be exact, it is the Japanese leaders' attitude toward the war that matters." Abe's attitude is decidedly more militaristic than previous administrations.

Both the Abe administration, and the increased conservativism of the LDP that he has led, and Kantai Collection reflect upon Japan as a culture. A problem exists where Japan and the Japanese do not have an accurate understanding of history and the horrors of war. Contrast Japan with Germany. While Germany has owned up to its terrible actions during the Second World War, Japan hasn't done so to nearly the same degree, and has instead engaged in revisionism. In the first season finale of the Kantai Collection anime, the protagonists, the personifications of Japanese warships, win the Battle of Midway.

Perception leads policy. Where people perceive war as a cartoonish endeavor for pride rather than a horrifying experience, public policy may naturally shift in lines with those beliefs. Looking at Abe's actions, we can see it already has.

And not just public policy, but also the views of the Japanese public and those of other nations. Two-thirds of Japanese have no friendly feelings towards Koreans, which probably explains why more than eight out of ten Koreans are alarmed by the increasing militarism coming from the Japanese government.

Regarding the power of the Yamato relative to other warships, this isn't a thread for discussing that. I've changed the first post to say it was the most powerful battleship of all time, I think that should suffice to put that discussion to bed. A discussion of the relative power of warships could be interesting, but I'd rather discuss other things in this thread.

 

[Wastl]

You missed mentioning Girls and Panzer, a show about school girls and WW2 tanks
I think they even made a movie this year.

I don't think that Imperialism has much to do with it. While Abe does seem a bit questionable about this matter, I really doubt that Japan has any plans for expansion. It doesn't help that the old approach was indeed a bit too limiting. Not necessarily when it comes to Japan itself, but for any participation in international missions. You cannot really have a situation in which Japanese participants cannot fulfill their duty. It would be a burden for the Japanese and a huge risk for them and other participants of the mission.


edit: oh, too late, already mentioned. Weird, I didn't see that post when I wrote it

 

[BvBPL]

Not necessarily when it comes to Japan itself, but for any participation in international missions. You cannot really have a situation in which Japanese participants cannot fulfill their duty. It would be a burden for the Japanese and a huge risk for them and other participants of the mission.

The duty of Japan to involve itself in international military missions, if it exists at all, could be fulfilled by providing logistic and monetary support rather than through combat support. As such, the notion that Japanese involvement in international endeavors requires the Japanese combat is inaccurate.

We shouldn't assume that the Japanese have any obligation to involve themselves in international combat adventures. It would be unconstitutional for them to do so.

Interesting that you should suggest international missions. Abe has reinterpreted Article 9 to allow for Japanese defense on a regional, rather than merely local, basis. "International," without additional qualifiers, would suggest to me operating on a global scale rather than a regional one.

 

[Manfred Belheim]

Perhaps, given that 70 years has passed, Japan should be allowed to do what the hell they want now? Or do they have to be America's fem-dog until the end of time?

 

[Hygro]

They do. You cross us dirty and we run you until we break.

 

[Wastl]

The duty of Japan to involve itself in international military missions, if it exists at all, could be fulfilled by providing logistic and monetary support rather than through combat support. As such, the notion that Japanese involvement in international endeavors requires the Japanese combat is inaccurate.

We shouldn't assume that the Japanese have any obligation to involve themselves in international combat adventures. It would be unconstitutional for them to do so.

Interesting that you should suggest international missions. Abe has reinterpreted Article 9 to allow for Japanese defense on a regional, rather than merely local, basis. "International," without additional qualifiers, would suggest to me operating on a global scale rather than a regional one.

A nation of Japans status is expected to do a bit more than just send money. And no, I wasn't talking about combat-missions either.

Being involved in international missions does require certain things, even if it is not directly a combat-mission. Just remember what happened in the Balkans when UN-troops had to sit and watch while people got slaughtered, because they weren't allowed to do anything.
Japan could not even help out humanitarian convoys if attacked, because they are forbidden from doing so. They also need other countries to guard their own humanitarian help, because they aren't allowed to protect themselves either. This puts a burden on them and is a grave risk for everyone involved in these rather dangerous zones.

There is absolutely no reason to have a situation in which Japan couldn't possibly protect civilians or doctors. You don't need to allow any actual combat-missions outside the country, but you cannot have such a loophole in the laws that can lead to having to watch catastrophic crimes happening right in front of your eyes, when you would have the means to save these people.

 

[Joecoolyo]

I have generally ignored or been unaware of most of the Japanese anime genre, although I do remember watching Speed Racer and Space Battleship Yamato when I was a child.

Several months ago I became aware of an anime cartoon called "Girls und Panzer" which is basically the story of a group of elementary school girls becoming part of tank war gaming (as in real tanks, not the online gaming sort). The idea of school girls driving and fighting with tanks is preposterous, yet I found myself watching the entire 14 episode series. I still can't explain why...
[The Girls und Panzer anime series can be watched here: http://www.hulu.com/watch/429128 ]

I do realize that Japan has a respectably sized military, something that should not be unexpected for a country of Japan's size and economic ranking.

I don't think that the fascination that some Japanese people have with anime girls in military themed cartoons is a sign of some militaristic imperial resurrection by Japan.

Girls und Panzer is awesome! Such a funny show. One of the first animes I saw too.

At best we can say that it was the most powerful battleship in history, to quibble over wording. Even then, the upgrades that Iowa class-battleships undertook in the 80's I think would have made them much more lethal than anything produced in WWII that wasn't similarly upgraded (which is basically everything except the Iowas).

These days, the things you list don't really matter if we're discussing the 'power' of a warship. It's hard to quantify how powerful a warship is anymore given the existence of submarines that have neither guns nor armor and are only modestly-sized (compared to battleships) yet pack enough megaton nukes to wipe nations off the Earth in 30 minutes. Or carriers armed with nuclear bombs and bombers that could do the same and also fight a massive conventional campaign the likes of which nothing from WWII could even compare with.

I agree on both points. What exactly was retrofited in the 80's? I know they got a missile system of some sort, but I'm not sure if those were anti-air or anti-ship.

 

[Akka]

Before jumping to conclusion, it would be good to put thing in context here.

First, there is a noticeable difference in how such drawings would be perceived in Japan compared to most Western nations. All cultures have different appreciations and value, and if we tend to put emphasis on "sexy", "beautiful" and "early adulthood", the Japanese tend to value "cute", "pure" and "childhood". As such, many imageries which would appear childish and condescending if directed to a Western public might appear endearing and just normal to a Japanese public.
It's actually rather weird in a fun way to walk in Japan and see warnings for construction sites or regulation made by anime-like little girls.

Second, it's not because such imagery is common it means that all of it is mainstream. Replacing about everything with highschool girls is a recent fad in the anime world (there is also a serie which replace all the leader of the Sengoku Jidai, the rough equivalent of the Japanese Civil War in the XVIth century, by girls, porn games which replace historical leader by girls - so you can bang them when you win the war - and so on), and it's just pure fanservice most of the time, not a political statement.

Third, it's actually true that Japan has a long-standing problem with right-wing nationalistic revisionism, which refuses to admit that Japan did wrong in the past and see any digging of the truth on this matter as treason.
Compounding this problem, japanese school system is DREADFUL when it comes to modern history, barely even touching the WW2 (I've seen some classroom history books in which the entirety of WW2 and its premises were about 1 to 3 pages long). This makes the japanese public rather blind to the whole core reason why their neighbours hate them, and make these neighbours complaints about Japan sound like pointless whining and harassment from said japanese public PoV.

Several months ago I became aware of an anime cartoon called "Girls und Panzer" which is basically the story of a group of elementary school girls becoming part of tank war gaming (as in real tanks, not the online gaming sort). The idea of school girls driving and fighting with tanks is preposterous, yet I found myself watching the entire 14 episode series. I still can't explain why...

Because it's totally aware of how ludicrous the setting is, but just run with it, revel in the fun and take refuge of audacity while keeping its tongue firmly in its cheek.

 

[chijohnaok]

I agree on both points. What exactly was retrofited in the 80's? I know they got a missile system of some sort, but I'm not sure if those were anti-air or anti-ship.

Upgrades included anti-air missiles; also anti-ship missiles, ground attack missiles, and advanced electronics.

Here is a link to wikipedia which describes the upgrades that were made to the Iowa-class battleships:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iowa-class_battleship#1980s_refit

 

[BvBPL]

There is absolutely no reason to have a situation in which Japan couldn't possibly protect civilians or doctors. You don't need to allow any actual combat-missions outside the country, but you cannot have such a loophole in the laws that can lead to having to watch catastrophic crimes happening right in front of your eyes, when you would have the means to save these people.

You are, of course, right. Article 9 has long been understood to permit Japanese self-defense. However, it also prohibits war and foreswears a national right to war and war potential.

In your context, where Japan might be responsible for convoys of humanitarian aid, armed defense of those conveys would seem to be permissible. You wouldn't get any argument against that from me. However, that part of their constitution would also seem to limit their ability to engage in many international missions. So armed convoys of aid to dangerous areas full of warlords are probably permissible, but engaging in international missions to, say, stop ISIL through attacks would not be.

Abe, however, is seeking to broaden the definition of defense to include not just defense of Japan, but defense of the Pacific / Asian region. Which is disturbingly similar to the Great East-Asia Co-Prosperity Sphere imperialist justifications Japan claimed for the Second Sino-Japanese War which directly led to the Pacific War of WWII. Abe, as with much of the LDP, is also a revisionist as to Imperial Japan and the Second World War, denying the atrocities committed by Japan and reframing the Japanese involvement as a war of defense, rather than aggression. Abe is literally an imperialist as well, the draft amendment the LDP offered to the Japanese constitution includes naming the Emperor as head of state. On top of that, we have these bizarre anime celebrations of WWII, and the anime-ization of the JSDF.

By themselves, any one of these things might not be important, but taken together they raise issues worth discussing. Many Japanese people are outraged at the expansive defense policy proffered by the Abe administration. They are rightfully worried about putting more military power into the hands of a revisionist, imperialist nutter.

First, there is a noticeable difference in how such drawings would be perceived in Japan compared to most Western nations.

Good points, and thank you for bringing them up. However, the fact that it is cute doesn't enter into my concern as much as it is about popular culture. I wasn't a fan of America's Army when that came either.

A problem here is that there seems to be a very permissive structure as to romanticizing WWII in Japan. The West would be up in arms if a western TV studio broadcast a Friends-like sitcom featuring imitations of the Third Reich with Himmler as Joey or something like that, but cartoon shows along the same vein are prominent in Japan. If we accept your thesis that cartoons are mainstream in Japan, and I do, then the portrayals should be more worrying, not less.

Furthermore, the fact that these things are abstract cartoon instead of realistic portrayals is worthy of note, even accounting for the different place cartoons have in Japanese culture. The more abstract art form distances the viewer from the violence and lessens the effect of that violence. This may in part account for the increased romanticism around the war.

Of course America also romanticizes WWII. However, there's a significant difference in that our head of state does not deny the excesses committed by the US in the prosecution of that war. We don't have a president who is trying to rewrite history. No one is trying to say we didn't lose at Bataan the way Kantai Collection suggests an Imperial win at Midway.

 

[Snorrius]

Perhaps, given that 70 years has passed, Japan should be allowed to do what the hell they want now? Or do they have to be America's fem-dog until the end of time?

Revenge is a spicy dish but best served cold. Behave while you weak, strike them when they are falling. Japanese will be a "fem-dog" while it make sense, and will strike Americans when there will be an opening.