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[45°38'N-13°47'E]

I could change the code to make maintenance less linear for big empires, no matter their handicap. I mean, if we really want to avoid huge empires, which is a goal I approve but not everybody likes it.

 

[<Nexus>]

I could change the code to make maintenance less linear for big empires, no matter their handicap. I mean, if we really want to avoid huge empires, which is a goal I approve but not everybody likes it.

I like huge empires, just not so early.
If the AI could stay a real competitor till the trans-human era, that would be great.

I think we need an other great idea, like the happiness thing was, but what?

 

[GreedyManul]

Alright, I managed to list all buildings and civics that alter War , and I've got this:

Spoiler :

BUILDINGS (Local):

• Hypermarket: +25%
• Jail: -25% (replaced by Cryogenic Prison)
• Cryogenic Prison: -50%
• Police Station: -25%
• Security Center: -25%
• Press Agency: -10% (replaced by TV Station)
• TV Station: -20%
• Statue of Champion: -50% (national wonder)
• Royal Tournament: -50% (national wonder, obsolete at Military Tradition)
• Chronicler: -10% (requires Chronicles, obsolete at Photography)
• Monument of the Dictator: -25% (requires Despotism OR Personality Cult)
• Royal Monument: -15% (requires Monarchy)
• Voting District: +25% (requires Democracy)
• Interrogation Building: -25% (requires Junta OR Single Party)
• Revivalist Church: -10% (requires Intolerant)
• Holy Office: -25% (requires Religious Censorship)
• Think Tank: -10% (requires Technocracy)
• AI Surveillance: -30% (requires Technocracy)

BUILDINGS (Global):

• Mount Rushmore: -25% (national wonder)
• Universal Suffrage: -25% (world wonder)
• World News Network: -10% (world wonder)
• Secret Police: -25% (national wonder, requires Despotism)
• Propaganda Net: -25% (national wonder, requires Political Censorship OR Pesonality Cult)
• Peace Movement: +5% (requires Prosperity)
• The Sagas: -25% (world wonder, requires Asatru, obsolete with Automatic Weapons)
• Palace of Potala: -25% (world wonder, requires Buddhism)

CIVICS:

• Despotism: -20%
• Junta: -15%
• Folklore: -20%
• Divine Cult: -25%
• Intolerant: -50%
• Paradise: +100%
• Conscription: +100%
• Mercenaries: -25%
• Volunteer Army: -50%
• Terrorism: -100%
• Unmanned Warfare: -50%
• Interventionism: -50%
• City States: +50%
• Religious Censorship: -20%
• Political Censorship: -50%
• Mainstream Media: +50%
• Personality Cult: -90%
• Belligerence: -25%
• Prosperity: +50%
• Mobilization: +15%

At the end of the tech tree, with the best possible combo (Cryogenic Prison, Police Station, Security Center, TV station, Mount Rushmore, Universal Suffrage, World News Network, Palace of Potala, Despotism (-70% total), Junta OR Technocracy (-40% total), Intolerant (-60% total), Terrorism, Interventionism, Personality Cult (-115% total), Belligerence), you can have up to -665% War , with it going to -615% if you go for Volunteer Army/Unmanned Warfare instead of Terrorism. -615%, let alone -665%, is not just excessive; it's downright ludicrous. And if you build the Statue of Champion on a city, you can get it to have -715% (-665% if not terrorist).

Might as well say your empire gets HAPPIER with bloodshed and carnage, rather than get pissed at you. " We love bathing in the blood of our enemies!" should be added as a feature ASAP.

Even Vanilla AND is able to dive down far below -200% than it should. We really need to cut down on buildings and civics that mess with war weariness and recalibrate the rest. Especially civics and civic-dependent buildings; with the amount of choices one can make, it becomes a very tricky business.

 

[45°38'N-13°47'E]

I think we need an other great idea, like the happiness thing was, but what?

What about Permanent Alliances? From some early test, it looks promising, you can try with the latest revision (1023) although I still need to write most of the code.

 

[<Nexus>]

Alright, I managed to list all buildings and civics that alter War , and I've got this:

Spoiler :

BUILDINGS (Local):

• Hypermarket: +25%
• Jail: -25% (replaced by Cryogenic Prison)
• Cryogenic Prison: -50%
• Police Station: -25%
• Security Center: -25%
• Press Agency: -10% (replaced by TV Station)
• TV Station: -20%
• Statue of Champion: -50% (national wonder)
• Royal Tournament: -50% (national wonder, obsolete at Military Tradition)
• Chronicler: -10% (requires Chronicles, obsolete at Photography)
• Monument of the Dictator: -25% (requires Despotism OR Personality Cult)
• Royal Monument: -15% (requires Monarchy)
• Voting District: +25% (requires Democracy)
• Interrogation Building: -25% (requires Junta OR Single Party)
• Revivalist Church: -10% (requires Intolerant)
• Holy Office: -25% (requires Religious Censorship)
• Think Tank: -10% (requires Technocracy)
• AI Surveillance: -30% (requires Technocracy)

BUILDINGS (Global):

• Mount Rushmore: -25% (national wonder)
• Universal Suffrage: -25% (world wonder)
• World News Network: -10% (world wonder)
• Secret Police: -25% (national wonder, requires Despotism)
• Propaganda Net: -25% (national wonder, requires Political Censorship OR Pesonality Cult)
• Peace Movement: +5% (requires Prosperity)
• The Sagas: -25% (world wonder, requires Asatru, obsolete with Automatic Weapons)
• Palace of Potala: -25% (world wonder, requires Buddhism)

CIVICS:

• Despotism: -20%
• Junta: -15%
• Folklore: -20%
• Divine Cult: -25%
• Intolerant: -50%
• Paradise: +100%
• Conscription: +100%
• Mercenaries: -25%
• Volunteer Army: -50%
• Terrorism: -100%
• Unmanned Warfare: -50%
• Interventionism: -50%
• City States: +50%
• Religious Censorship: -20%
• Political Censorship: -50%
• Mainstream Media: +50%
• Personality Cult: -90%
• Belligerence: -25%
• Prosperity: +50%
• Mobilization: +15%

At the end of the tech tree, with the best possible combo (Cryogenic Prison, Police Station, Security Center, TV station, Mount Rushmore, Universal Suffrage, World News Network, Palace of Potala, Despotism (-70% total), Junta OR Technocracy (-40% total), Intolerant (-60% total), Terrorism, Interventionism, Personality Cult (-115% total), Belligerence), you can have up to -665% War , with it going to -615% if you go for Volunteer Army/Unmanned Warfare instead of Terrorism. -615%, let alone -665%, is not just excessive; it's downright ludicrous. And if you build the Statue of Champion on a city, you can get it to have -715% (-665% if not terrorist).

Might as well say your empire gets HAPPIER with bloodshed and carnage, rather than get pissed at you. " We love bathing in the blood of our enemies!" should be added as a feature ASAP.

Even Vanilla AND is able to dive down far below -200% than it should. We really need to cut down on buildings and civics that mess with war weariness and recalibrate the rest. Especially civics and civic-dependent buildings; with the amount of choices one can make, it becomes a very tricky business.

Wow!

Good job counting all those.
Are those numbers including your changes?

 

[<Nexus>]

What about Permanent Alliances? From some early test, it looks promising, you can try with the latest revision (1023) although I still need to write most of the code.

That's a great idea to help smaller civs stay alive in the late game, but it won't stop big&strong civs becoming bigger&stronger by settling more unclaimed land, conquering barbarian cities and small civ that didn't join any alliance.

I am thinking about something hurts really big civs but not small ones, just like the happiness penalty for distance and empire size.

So here is an idea... It may be totally insane, but here it comes

Cities that are far away from a government center (Palace, Versailles, etc) would generate some barbarian culture. The further they are the more it generates for barbarians.
I'm not sure if it would help anything, just keep brainstorming.


An other thing I will include in my next version is setting all Government civics to -1 / 10% foreign , except for Democracy. Why punish only Despotism with it? Foreigners and xenophobia is always a problem in non-democratic societies (sometimes even in democratic ones too).

 

[45°38'N-13°47'E]

That's a great idea to help smaller civs stay alive in the late game, but it won't stop big&strong civs becoming bigger&stronger by settling more unclaimed land, conquering barbarian cities and small civ that didn't join any alliance.

I am thinking about something hurts really big civs but not small ones, just like the happiness penalty for distance and empire size.

So here is an idea... It may be totally insane, but here it comes

Cities that are far away from a government center (Palace, Versailles, etc) would generate some barbarian culture. The further they are the more it generates for barbarians.
I'm not sure if it would help anything, just keep brainstorming.


An other thing I will include in my next version is setting all Government civics to -1 / 10% foreign , except for Democracy. Why punish only Despotism with it? Foreigners and xenophobia is always a problem in non-democratic societies (sometimes even in democratic ones too).

Mmm, of course it depends on options but after renaissance there's not so much unclaimed land in most of my games.

I'm not sure about happiness penalty but it might be worth trying. I don't think barbarian culture would help in any way.

 

[GreedyManul]

Wow!

Good job counting all those.
Are those numbers including your changes?

Nope. It was the vanilla version of your addon, for faithfulness; adding my changes in too would blur the picture.

But yeah, something must be done to curb the excess War Weariness reduction. I pity Vokarya for having to do so much janitorial work... maybe I can try cooking up something in his place.

 

[<Nexus>]

Mmm, of course it depends on options but after renaissance there's not so much unclaimed land in most of my games.

I'm not sure about happiness penalty but it might be worth trying.

I think it will stop conquerors for a bit every time they conquer some cities to make them happy and useful again.

I don't think barbarian culture would help in any way.

Yeah, probably not.

I also tried these for iDistanceMaintenancePercent and iNumCitiesMaintenancePercent.

now plan
Settler 60 60
Chieftain 80 80
Warlord 90 90
Noble 100 100
Prince 110 130
Monarch 120 160
Emperor 130 190
Immortal 140 210
Deity 150 240

In a running game with a well established empire (with 90% at ) it immediately set my 2000+ income to around -700. A few turns later it went back to +1000 with some of my cities building

 

[<Nexus>]

Nope. It was the vanilla version of your addon, for faithfulness; adding my changes in too would blur the picture.

But yeah, something must be done to curb the excess War Weariness reduction. I pity Vokarya for having to do so much janitorial work... maybe I can try cooking up something in his place.

Thx, will start to work on it soon...

 

[<Nexus>]

Might as well say your empire gets HAPPIER with bloodshed and carnage, rather than get pissed at you. " We love bathing in the blood of our enemies!" should be added as a feature ASAP.

Wait... Do you mean that bellow -100% wars generate happiness?
Or you were just joking and I didn't get it?

 

[GreedyManul]

Wait... Do you mean that bellow -100% wars generate happiness?
Or you were just joking and I didn't get it?

Joke.

 

[<Nexus>]

Just for your instance, I'm currently working on the War issue.
I want to introduce and apply the following principle: "War is no good for the business!" So I want to add war penalties on important money-maker buildings (market, bazaar, bank, etc.) and some economy civics too.
I'm working on my spreadsheet right now...

 

[gay_Aleks]

In such a case, perhaps you should introduce a Civic that counters that? Military-Industrial Complex and all that jazz.

 

[<Nexus>]

In such a case, perhaps you should introduce a Civic that counters that? Military-Industrial Complex and all that jazz.

Do you mean a civic that reduces War ?
See THIS POST where thegreekweegee collects how you can get a -715% War
I want to cure just that
Oh, by the way: some civic in Media category are just doing what you where suggesting.

 

[gay_Aleks]

No, I mean. This unhappiness malus will be not part of WW, no? Since it's a separate malus. So it'd make sense if this is affected by some civics.

 

[<Nexus>]

Oh, yes!
The other principle I wanna use is Media Censorship
I will remove the War bonuses from Press Agency, TV Station and World News Network. My modmod has a Media category to manipulate war propaganda, so it's not obvious for those buildings to affect war

 

[<Nexus>]

No, I mean. This unhappiness malus will be not part of WW, no? Since it's a separate malus. So it'd make sense if this is affected by some civics.

I'm editing <iWarWearinessModifier> and <iGlobalWarWearinessModifier> numbers that can be applied to buildings, and <iWarWearinessModifier> is also used in civics.
It is not possible to have an optional <iWarWearinessModifier> modifier on buildings that is applied with only some civics.
Is that what you meant?
(Sorry, it's hot over here )

 

[gay_Aleks]

Ahh. I see. I thought that the "War is no good for the business!" will be separate from the normal WW. To be fair, I kinda want some way to make it so that you can still get high normal WW but lower "War is no good for the business!", as we all know that sometimes business and the people aren't always on the same page...

 

[<Nexus>]

Ahh. I see. I thought that the "War is no good for the business!" will be separate from the normal WW. To be fair, I kinda want some way to make it so that you can still get high normal WW but lower "War is no good for the business!", as we all know that sometimes business and the people aren't always on the same page...

Yes, I know I will have to be careful, but currently War has completely disappeared from the game