MrB1_Emeror Training C3C

[Mr. Blonde]

Byz has rifles at the moment, we can not get rid of them when pillaging the Salpeter. I traded the maps and money for Gunpowder from portugal, we will have to see where his resources lie. Sumer is down Magnetis, which will take some time for them to research. They have no money and can not buy it. Unis and banks will be my no.1 preference for the core. When in peace we will have place for 4 cities in the N, 1 in the peninsula and one at the coast to connect the peninsula with our mainland (I´m bothered about border expansion from Byz city). 2 Cav armies and the border full of muskets will hopefully prevent some Byz. folly. With steam we will be in a good position for trading (if he has no coal). With eng as our ally they can not trade, which will work for us. I vote for peace now so we can lower lux. The sumers free tech will come in maybe 30 turns (they got ToG 1 round before us and sold it for eco,...) We must be prepared for war with rails and either more cav or one of the defensive units, otherwise we will lose border cities really fast in the first attack from him. Next player has to check our cities and make peace if it has the majority of the votes.
Mineeace now
Cubic: Peace for sumers free tech (who knows when...)

 

[Cubic]

But by pillaging the saltpeter we keep them from building more Cav. We can then again play defensivly for a few turns, let their Cavs die befor our cities (or the English's) and then roll over them with our never ending stream of Cavalry.
Any thoughts concerning our GA? IMO now would be a good time, since we have some builder's turns ahead anyway and as mentioned before when the appropriate wonder comes in, we might well have won already!

 

[batteryacid]

Got ot- I will play today. May I Summarise what to do: Build Temples in the north. Build more cavs or not?- I guess no- more Muskets will be needed now anyway, our cav armies should be enough to secure the borders for now- Military Academy and Heroic epic is a must anyway (IF we want to win by conquest)
Peace with Sumer? 3 cities are not bad, we could give them magnetism and then rip the bonus thech from them (BUT we wouldn´t have 20 turns peace which would worsen our reputation)
Trade then Steam to England for Nationalism and MA against Byz (will be for the next player).

After Steam: Do we need nationalism or shell we go straight forward to replacable parts?

 

[Mr. Blonde]

I prefer researching direct to SciMeth, we can trade for luxes adn gpt. I mean, Eng will also research Nationalism first. If we go for ToE we should build unis and banks in the core cities. We should also fill up the empty spaces and lay rails before going to war. If we dont get ToE, we should be prepared and have researched RP and Comm, maybe mobilise and then go into conquer mode. We can not protect our border without rails and rif/inf. losing 2-3 cities together with ~10 units in the first round (this WILL happen) in Rep will cause HUGE WW from the beginning. So I suggest to 1) have rails 2) be in Comm and 3) have enough rif/int/art before even starting a defensive war. Although I prefer to be in the offensive from the beginning. Hopefully both start theri research on democracy so we will not have to be bothered with getting ToE and Hoover. We now have a palace and a MA prebuild.

 

[batteryacid]

900-1000 bc

We make peace after 1 turn with the sumers, get 3 cities of them. Sumer flips, but has no wonders in it, our former Sumer cities there are now cut of from our main land, but get resources through the Byzanz area. The former Sumer cities are now starved and have temples in them.

No new techs from both ai´s (only possibility would be communism or fescims from Byzanz which we can´t see now), we get steam power, have 2 coals in our lands. Byzanz has coal in the eastern coast city which is sourrounded by mountains, no roads and no harbour there.
England has no coal either, 2 coals in their area are blocked by small Mongol cites.

Our core is now worked, I put all workers to RR, we should get a rail-network (first core then to the borders) online asap.

Banks and Universities are now built in most core cites, I put 2 or three of them on prebuilds and wonders.

I refreshed some gpt for lux trades with the englishmen, we make 1 gpt at 90% science rate, we get medicine in 6 turns (question, first Electricity or Sanitation?- we are ahead in science output anyway, perehaos it is best to get to scientific methods, then repalcable parts for our Military rating, and then sanitation - we should somehow make for some turns money to upgrade all our spears to muskets or infantry- would cost us 2000g, on the other hand we are practically unvulnerable with the RR online, we MUST take Sumer after 20 turns peace because otherwise our new sumer cities are faster away then anyone can say "cavstack")

 

[Cubic]

Got the save, will play soon!

 

[Cubic]

Preturn
Isin: changed Marketplace to Courthouse (too small and so corrupt!)
Zabalam: changed Musketman to Courthouse
Tutlub: changed Settler to Spearman (where did you want to settle?)

IT
Heliopolis: Bank -> Heroic Epic
Lish: Granary -> Musketman

T1 - 1010AD
Repositioning of troops, Railroading....

IT
Liz wants to exchange territory maps - What for? I decline
Some border expansions

T2 - 1020AD


IT


T3 - 1030AD
Found Athribis on the way to the former Sumerian core land -> Temple
Somebody has discovered Printing Press und traded it to everybody else (except Germany and Greece).
We can trade it against an obsolete tech with Mongolia or Portugal, but I decide against it. We won't need it for the time being and can always get it with a peace treaty.

IT
Pi-Ramesses: Library -> Bank

T4 - 1040AD


IT
Athens: Library -> University

T5 - 1050AD
England now has Nationalism and would sell it to us for Steam Power +13gpt. Byzanz would take the same or Steam Power and one of our luxuries.
I'll watch this!

IT
We get Medicine. Set research to Electricity, du in 10 @ +59gpt

T6 - 1060AD


IT
Sparta: Bank -> University
Nagsu: Spearman -> Temple

T7 - 1070AD


IT


T8 - 1080AD


IT
Pharsalos: Bank -> Library
Wine City: University -> Cav
Tutub: Spearman -> Temple

T9 - 1090AD


IT
Memphis: University -> Cav
Heliopolis: Heroic Epic -> Cav
England finishes Magallan in London!

T10 - 1100AD


Summary
Pretty uneventful turns, but progress was made nevertheless. Our railroad network is growing steadily, most cities in the west are allready connected and the core is nearing completion. Also banks and universities are build there, so we can start building Cavs again.
ATTENTION for the next player: During my last turn the trade price for Nationalism increased to Steam Power +31gpt with the Byzantines, they may have Steam Power soon. I suggest trading it to England (SP + 13gpt for Nationalism) and for what price ever to Byzanz! We're six turns away from Electricity and still nobody has Medicine, ToE looks pretty safe, gentleman!
Military wise we're weak vs Byzanz, average vs England (although we were strong during some of my turns) and strong vs everybody else.
Further plans: I'd favor getting ToE ASAP to get Electronics and Hoover. If possible we should research RP while ToE is building or immediately afterwards. I'd delay the war against Byzanz until Infantry if possible, but prepare for an eventual Byzantinian sneak attack!

Here's theSave

 

[Mr. Blonde]

Preturn: Steam and 14 gpt for Nat with Eng, Steam for printing press, 30g and 80 gpt with Byz, both have no coal. Byz is up Fascism, upgrade some Muskets to rifles
Turn1: Peace with Sumer expires, no MPPs around, Take Sumer
Turn2: Take Kahun, Sumer doesnt exist any more
Turn3: Some Cav is built, railing
Turn4: MA ready, start Army
Turn5: railing...
Turn6: El is in, Sci M in 6
Turn7: Worker movement, found 2 cities in N renew spice deal with eng 24 gpt
Turn8: Worker movement, renew incense deal with eng 23 gpt
Turn9: Worker movement, start hoover prebuild in Memphis
Turn10: Nothing happens, No new techs for the AI, we are down Fascism to Byz, up Medicine and Electricity. SciM in 2 turns. Strong to Eng, weak to Byz. Suggestion: build up Mil, maybe start cannons we have much money to upgrade...
Golden age when we start war/after building Hoover. 32 land 36 pop we will win very soon...
The SAVE

 

[batteryacid]

Turn 1: Worker moves, all military units which were built are transfered to our border cities
turn 2 : scientific methods are out, we research replacable parts in 7 turns at 90% science and still make 25 gpt, we get ToE in 9 turns which makes 2 0% science turns for making money and upgrading Rush temples in north eastern border cities - we have the money and beed the border extensions there in case the Byz wants to attak them. Check- England and Byz are up communism and Fascism now- we should go for commumism after ToE is built
Turn 3: trade medicine against communism, try to get some more gpt out of them, but have no money, neither have the Byz.
Turn 4: Byz changed to fascism!!! We are average against them now, strong compared to Englishmen, make a MPP with England- just in case....
Turn 5 our palace is one part away of being finished- too late so change the style now
Turn 6:England is in anarchy now- do they also change into Fascism? This could be messy in the near future.
turn 7:nothing
turn8: England is in democracy now, noone has coal (except us)
Turn 9: Repalcable parts is out- set sci to 0, upgrade rifles and cannons (spears will cost us 3500, we need Military Police in communism anyhow), we have 2 rubber, the Byz 1 but not yet connected, the Englishmen has none. Some mongol units appear on the scene- Wonder what they want to do
Turn 10: The Mongols declare war, I kill all units except 1 with our cavs , but no promotions, I let them one of our spears to attack for them- we want england in a war against the Mongols, they will declare in the interturn after our spear was attacked by the mongol Bowmen.
ToE is one turn away, we run on 100% cash . Palaceprebuild for Hoover is on the way, we build Artillery and Infantry , build some armies after ToE is finished- infantry armies (and the Pentagon) would be nice to have.
Byz cripples itself with Fascism now, we outresearch and outproduce him easily (all of his cities lost a lot of pop), the core is worked, workers move north for Jungle cites.
Questionable: Communism after ToE is built? We will have to go to war soon anyhow and need to be in Communism for this purpose.
Declare war with Byz after all the deals ran out? England has a MPP with us and has to follow- well, it are your turns now, Cubic, I can see the dawn of war now and the victory at hand. We have artillery now, Infantry- the cavs to finish crippled units- what can be nicer? Well, Tanks.

 

[Cubic]

Preturn
Changed all Cav builds to Artillery - We have 42 Cavs, how many will we need?

T1 - 1280AD
Mongolian Longbow attacks our Spearman and kills it, but redlines.
The Mongols send a Warrior and a Keshik in our land.
England declares war on the Mongols!
Byzanz demands Wine! I tell her to stuff it and we're at war!
England declares war on Byzanz!
We finish ToE and get Atomic Theory and Electronics.
Thebes starts building an Army.
Start Hoover Dam in Memphis.
I won't change to Communism right now, we get lots of War Happiness!
Set research to Sanitation, due in 5t @ +10gpt
Kill the Mongolian Warrior, Longbow and Keshik.
Capture two Byzantinian Workers in the NE.

T2 - 1285AD
Mongolian Longbow attacks Kutallu, our Cav wins by 1hp.
I kill 4 Byzantinian Cavs and 2 Rifles flawlessly
I kill 4 Crusaders defending the Byzantinian's Saltpeter and pillage it. Lose 1 Cav.
Also kill 3 Muskets in Kish.

T3 - 1290AD
Edfu: Courthouse -> Marketplace
Kill 4 Byz Cavs and 1 Rifle in our Lands, no losses
Kill 1 Musket and 1 Spear in Kish and take it!

T4 - 1295AD
Knossos: Library -> Aqueduct
Capture Dyrrachium, killing 4 rifles but lose 2 Cavs
Our army is now strong vs the Byzantines!

T5 - 1300AD
I capture Septum and Nicomedia, no losses

T6 - 1305AD
We research Sanitation.
Set research to Industrialisation, due in 7t @ +3gpt
Herakleia: Aqueduct -> Marketplace
I abandon Ephesus (the island city). It was undefended, corrupt and threatened by a Byz Longbow. I'll make up for it!
Take Argos, no losses.

T7 - 1310AD
Renew our Incense deal with England. They give 42g and 18gpt
Abydos: Bank -> University
Take Naissus, no losses
Adjust Sci, we still get Industrialization in 6 but @ +83gpt

T8 - 1315AD
Renew our Wine deal with England. They give 27g and 19gpt
Asyut: University -> Infantry
We get a MGL near Smyrna! I form an army and load it with Cavs.
We capture Smyrna (7 resistors) and Lagash (no resistance).

T9 - 1320AD
Portugal signs a MA against us and declares war!
I change Thebes to The Pentagon (due in 3).

T10 - 1325AD
Buto: Bank -> Library
Heliopolis: Artillery -> Hospital
Capture Heraclea and Chalcedon (7 resistors), lose 1 Cav

Summary
Have I recently mentioned that Cav Armies + Artillery own? Well Byzanz learns this lesson right now. They're practically defeated, it's just a matter of turns till we've sweeped them off the planet .
I stayed in Republic 'cause we were getting war happiness and some important projects were on its way. But we'll finish The Pentagon in 2 and Hoover in 5 turns and then it's time to practise The Internationale .

Here's the border after my turns:

And here's the SAVE for the next better player!

 

[Mr. Blonde]

Wow, great progress. I will play tomorrow, batteryacid right after me. Maybe some cityfilling is left for you after these 20 turns. That Byz collapses that fast was unexpected, however, we should plan for the next succession game. To all members of the team, post any ideas.

 

[batteryacid]

hehehe- good turns- I promise I won´t let you something to do Cubic
by the way: WHAT THE HELL IS WITH OUR GOLDEN AGE???

Next succession game: Question 1 : Monarch or Emperor? I would be for staying in Monarch and setting EVREYTHING (including our own tribe) to random- so we have to adapt our strategy to the Nation we draw. We should perehaps also try to take the first start we get (as long as we don´t have a 3 tile island or a similar challenge- on the other hand it would be fun to try to win out of such a situation-at least we could show some good fighting spirit).

To this game: We played it very good I think, the game was won (in my opinion) in the war against the greeks, where we won a lot of luxes and decent land. . We had 3 scientific neighbours which isn´t that nice (we lost the philosophy gamble and 3 or 4 other important techs to the damn Sumers). IMHO it was essential to attak the first before they got into middle ages and the second before the industrial age. We had a bit luck that no aggressive AI was able to conquer 1 or 2 other AIs in the early game.

So: Next game: everything random, perehaps a Nation without cultural trades?

 

[Mr. Blonde]

Preturn: 39% area, still much to go...

Turn1:Take Amorium, Take Caesarea, lots of movement
Turn2: Smyrna flips, lose 1 Inf. Take Adrianopole without losses, retake Smyrna
Turn3: Ind is in, set Sci to 60% and go for Corporation
Turn4: Hoover comes in , GA starts
Turn5: Regrouping. Should have taken attention, lose Kuara to 1 landed Keshik against Inf ...
Turn6: Some Hospitals finish, Start some factories, Revolt, since we lose ALOT GA production to corruption and WW started due to flips
Turn7: Greece falls to us
Turn8: Caesarea flips, we are commies now. Retake Caesarea
Turn9: Take Nicea, 2 cities left
Turn10: Take Varna, 1 city left
44% Area, 50 with leaks. 7 turns deals with Eng still left. Rearrange Mil that we take down Eng very fast, if Factories are up, start mil in core again. Rest is routine...

 

[batteryacid]

turn 1 : the Byz are no more!! We have the corporation now, and have espionage in 4 turns. Eveything happy, Palace expanded- only 2 parts of finishing it now. We have 46% area and 56% pop- guess I can´t finish the game in my turns. We get a science leader- will rush Secret police HQ or battlefield medicine with it. A big fat Portuguise stack is on the way to Oxford- perehaps we are lucky and can get some English cities before we declare war on them.
Turn2 : Railing the borders
Turn 3 : More railing, Portugal is heading to our city- will be fun to watch with 20 Artillery and 20 cavs in place. All units are now upgraded, Factories and Hospitals in the core online
Turn 4 : Take the lonely mongol city in the north, kill 15 Portuguise units but no leader!
Turn 5: get espionage- SPHQ in 3, Battlefield medicine in 4- I rush universal suffrage
Turn 6,7: Rail rail rail the land gently...
Turn 8:War is on the way- take oxford, hastings, leeds and Pool in the first round- this guy has barely 3 units in his cites- they are toast
Turn 9: Take Nottingham and York without trouble, 16 german HORSEMAN show up at our front
Turn 10: those damn Germans are slowing us down- kill a lot of Horsemans, get one leader, next army in place, take Reading and Warwick. We have now refining and (what relief) have 2 oil in our hand. I set research straight to Tanks.

10% landmass to go- should be possible for you, since some border extensions are on the way. The only thing that could delay us would be a flip in one of the two front cities, where most of the offensive units are gathered.
Good luck tomorrow, Cubic

 

[Cubic]

Preturn
Well, we're at war with the rest of the world!

T1 - 1430AD
Heliopolis: Factory -> Infantry
Corinth: Factory -> Infantry
Kua: Marketplace -> Courthouse
Edfu: Bank -> Library
We finish our palace! Looks good!
Capture Norwich!

T2 - 1435AD
Germany wants to talk, but they won't contribute to our world domination (by giving cities for peace) so I have them kicked out!
York: Temple -> Library
Smyrna: Courthouse -> Library
Pharsalos: Factory -> Infantry
Knossos: Factory -> Cavalry
Erech flips, we lose 1 Inf and 1 Cav
Zabalam: Marketplace -> Courthouse
Nicomedia: Courthouse -> Marketplace
El-Ashmunein: Marketplace -> Cav
Retake Erech and conquer Coventry!

T3 - 1440AD
Athens: Factory -> Infantry
Nottingham: Temple -> Library
Liverpool: Temple -> Library
Choybalsan: Temple -> Courthouse
Capture London and Newcastle!

T4 - 1445AD
Watch some battles between Germany (Longbows and Spears) and Mongols (Cavs). The Germans actually capture a Mongolian city!
We get Steel. I set research to Combustion, due in 5t @ +113gpt
Sumer: Marketplace -> Courthouse
Kish: Library -> Courthouse
Buto: Factory -> Cav
Bubastis: Temple -> Courthouse
Conquer Brighton, Mandalgovi
Found This SW of Reading.

T5 - 1450AD
Our Golden Age ends!
Hastings: Temple -> Library
Capture Canterbury (last English city on the main continent), Erdenet, Der, Evora and Marad
Found Oryx SW of Newcastle, Sebennytus SW of Brighton and Cairo SE of York

T6 - 1455AD
Oxford: Temple -> Courthouse
Reading: Temple -> Courthouse
Capture Coimbra and Emerita

T7 - 1460AD
Umma: Marketplace -> Courthouse
Kuara: Factory -> Aqueduct
Edfu: Library -> Factory
Conquer Guimaraes, Lagos, Lisbon (i.e. we eliminate the "solid" Portugeses), Sagres and Leira

T8 - 1465AD
Erech: Temple -> Courthouse
Kua: Courthouse -> Library
Kutallu: Marketplace -> Library

I press enter and:

Congraz people!

For those of you who want to watch the replay, get a highscore entry, etc. - Here's the final SAVE . Just press SHIFT-ENTER and dominate the world .

 

[batteryacid]

"...Hey ey ey and a bottle of Rum..."
Wow Cubic- you really played yesterday? Hope it wasn´t my late (and slow - I missed Star Trek 4 completely- talk about making sacrifices for hobbies) playing that cost you your precious sleep. Ready to start a new SG? Today we should have enough time to discuss a bit, and perehaps start it already. We finished the game in 4 pages- must be a record- I hope that people will read about our glorious game despite the minimalistic posting we made. -Any ideas about our next challenge, Cubic - ...to go where no civplayer has gone before... A mixture of AW Deity and Master of the Bow ?

 

[Mr. Blonde]

Finally finished. It was more easy than I thought, I must admit.
My summary of the game:
A very good starting position, several luxes online very quickly.
Philosophy gamble was a huge waste, costed us 3 techs. After this tech trading was screwed up in the ancient age.
3 scientific civs as neighbours is somehow challenging. Always behind in culture and tech up to late middle ages. The war against greece was timed alright, but lasted too long. Result-we were behind 5 MA techs after finishing.
We were a bit unlucky with tech in MA, gunpowder, metallurgy and ToG were researched by the AIs 1-2 turns before us, I expected them to go to the democracy branch (experience from Monarch level)
Dogpile against Sumer was perfect, although Byz got salpeter. The game was won after that, maybe a Byz attack right after the sumerian war could have screwed us, but I think we had a good working core and we would have won this war. Maybe we would have switched to razing/conquest victory in that case.
The deals at the end with Eng were not neccessary, they delayed victory for 5 rounds (I think cubic didnt expect Byz to fall that quickly). Also I didnt see any fights between computers although they were at war with each other. I think only Eng and Mong had a war in ancient times where some cities switched sides

Summary: In this case the religious trait was a waste. Tech race is slightly different than on monarch. Pangea is always easy as you can grasp resources and luxes very quickly if you need them.

Question: what variant do we play next?

 

[Belisar]

My congrats to everyone from the team
A solid military win, not bad for the first emperor game.
Now, emperor was a peace of c..., ongoing to deity?? Or some military ..CC variant??
And I would play as well....

 

[batteryacid]

Belisar!!! Now we can proof that you really exist and are no imaginary sucession game player!!

Perehaps it´s time for a variant, in my opinion it would be better to stay at emperor level and put everything on random, and play with every civ that we draw, and on all types of map settings- that should be interesting enough (since the danger of playing all games in the same style is too big otherwise)