Music of Civ VI

[fatalitod]

The other Phoenicia themes. I like the medieval a lot.

 

[cosmicmangobear]

RANKINGS TIME!

GS Themes:

8. Inca - Just sounds a little… off. Doesn’t quite come together like the others. A shame, too, because they look like such a fun civ to play.
7. Phoenicia - It’s aight. Nothing special.
6. Canada - O CANADA! OUR HOME AND NATIVE LAND!!!
5. Mali - Not too over the top. Not too slow. Sounds African-ish but a bit too westernized.
4. Sweden - I’m just here for the rock guitars.
3. Hungary - This one is just so bold and energetic, I can’t help but love it. I can’t wait to dominate as Hungary with this theme playing in the background.
2. Maori - Peaceful and beautiful and fun and different. I caught myself humming the tune to this one a few times. Ugh, such a good vibe.
1. Ottomans - The best one! Sounds epic and one of the very few Civ 6 themes that rivals its counterpart in Civ 5. Most importantly, though, it sounds TURKISH! They did a fantastic job of evoking the intended culture.

 

[cosmicmangobear]

Uhh… I hate to double post, but home girl looks a little unhinged. “DIDO WANT BRAAAAAAINS, I mean, uh, TRAAAAADE!”

 

[Ziad]

The other Phoenicia themes. I like the medieval a lot.

The Ancient theme speaks to me. That ney!

 

[Basileus Rhomaion]

The greatest contribution the Phoenicians ever made was that they invented the alphabet (albeit with only consonants, given that Phoenician is a Semitic language), which is an easy-to-understand writing system and it led to facilitated trade and communication. Almost all widely used writing systems used today trace their origins to the Phoenician alphabet (the only major writing systems that survive to this day not ultimately derived from the Phoenician alphabet are based on Chinese characters).

A small correction: The Devanagari in India (and any other Brahmic script such as in Thailand) and Hangul in Korea are not based on either the Phoenician alphabet or Chinese characters. Given that they are used by several billion people in total, I'd wager they qualify as "major" as well

Also, while the alphabet as an idea was first standardized in the Phoenician script, the symbols used were essentially simplified Egyptian hieroglyphs. Egyptian hieroglyphs were also used to depict sounds based on either the starting sound of the thing each symbol represented or with a combination. Sometimes they just meant just the thing in and of itself, so the entire system was not standardized and didn't follow rigorous rules. Phoenician traders took some of the symbols, used them explicitly for the sounds and standardized it. So there's definitely a great Egyptian contribution to the invention of the alphabet as well and it was more of a collective effort (as things often are).


EDIT: To correct myself as well, I actually looked up the origins for the Brahmic scripts, and they do in fact descend from the Aramaic (and by extension Phoenician) alphabet, so the first example of the 2 is invalid.

 

[Ziad]

Also, while the alphabet as an idea was first standardized in the Phoenician script, the symbols used were essentially simplified Egyptian hieroglyphs. Egyptian hieroglyphs were also used to depict sounds based on either the starting sound of the thing each symbol represented or with a combination. Sometimes they just meant just the thing in and of itself, so the entire system was not standardized and didn't follow rigorous rules. Phoenician traders took some of the symbols, used them explicitly for the sounds and standardized it. So there's definitely a great Egyptian contribution to the invention of the alphabet as well and it was more of a collective effort (as things often are).

The idea is that Phoenicians made its use practical, and its proliferation in the ancient world was directly caused by its ease of use. Think of it like the Americans not inventing the computer but the ones to proliferate it to the modern world.

And they did technically invent the alphabet. Hieroglyphs are not an alphabet. You are correct that they didn't invent the concept of writing.

 

[Basileus Rhomaion]

And they did technically invent the alphabet. Hieroglyphs are not an alphabet. You are correct that they didn't invent the concept of writing.

I didn't claim the opposite, I'm just saying were it came from. The idea of symbol per sound was in a premature state in the Egyptian script before being standardized by the Phoenicians. And ultimately the concept of writing is older than either of the aforementioned, of course.

 

[CivLuvah]

My ranking of the themes:

1. Ottomans (It's stuck in my head! I was singing it while washing the dishes once)
2. Māori
3. Hungary
4. Inca (especially the Atomic theme)
5. Sweden
6. Phoenicia
7. Canada (I like the "Vive le Canadienne", but the inclusion of the national anthem is just jarring)
8. Mali

 

[Siptah]

And they did technically invent the alphabet. Hieroglyphs are not an alphabet.

Well... while hieroglyphs as a whole (which doesn't exist as a unity) aren't an alphabet, the group contains one. You can write everything perfectly readable with one consonant signs + determinatives which is practically an alphabet. Two and three consonant signs were substituted by one consonant signs in some occasions anyway, sometimes just to make it visually more pleasing. Foreign names were often written with these one consonant signs. The interim stage between hieroglyphs and the Phoenician alphabet, the Proto-Sinaitic script, can be classified as the first alphabet we know of. Yet, as said so often before, firsts aren't that important in history.

 

[Phoenix1595]

I can’t really rank them now, because all of them have at least one theme that makes an otherwise decent ranking fantastic.

I do agree that the Ottomans are the blue ribbon holder for me. Their themes are consistently good.

I will also give the Mali Atomic theme its props, since Mali is not getting a lot of love. If anyone watched the movie “Timbuktu” or heard a good sampling of today’s music from the region, you’d respect Knorr and Rizzo for nailing the head on this. It is beautiful, understated and sublime. Same for the Hungarian Atomic theme— it is just screams Eastern European dance club (which can also be heard in many of the ex-pat clubs in NYC).

Anyway, the soundtrack as a whole gets props from me. Love your work, Geoff!

 

[Alexadamz]

1. Ottomans. Simply awesome and the choir part just nails it in more awesomeness.
2. Maori. More singing, though the haka part is not my favorite. But more oral music in themes is good.
3. Mali. I don't like much the first part, but the second half is too relaxing. Good for the end of a tiresome day.
4. Hungary. don't know why, but I like the synth pop rithm of the first part in the Atomic version.
5. Inca. The Ancient flutes are great and the Atomic version sync everything so well together.
6. Phoenicia. Clever composition inspired by an old "partition". The end is very relaxing, like Mali's.
7. Canada. Vive le Canadienne is really nice, but the anthem part feels weird, as it is the only theme with an anthem in game. As many others have said, they could mix Vive le canadienne with Maple leaf forever and that would be really good to indicate the double origin of the country. I guess they didn't do that mainly because the leader in game is a french-canadien.
8. Sweden. I don't know why, but it feels bland, in some ways that sometimes I mistake it for the Canada's theme. The nyckelharpa part is nice though, in the Ancient and Medieval themes.

 

[Zaarin]

The interim stage between hieroglyphs and the Phoenician alphabet, the Proto-Sinaitic script, can be classified as the first alphabet we know of.

Worth noting, however, that most linguists agree that the language written in Proto-Sinaitic was still a variety of Canaanite (but not Phoenician).

 

[God of Kings]

A small correction: The Devanagari in India (and any other Brahmic script such as in Thailand) and Hangul in Korea are not based on either the Phoenician alphabet or Chinese characters. Given that they are used by several billion people in total, I'd wager they qualify as "major" as well

Also, while the alphabet as an idea was first standardized in the Phoenician script, the symbols used were essentially simplified Egyptian hieroglyphs. Egyptian hieroglyphs were also used to depict sounds based on either the starting sound of the thing each symbol represented or with a combination. Sometimes they just meant just the thing in and of itself, so the entire system was not standardized and didn't follow rigorous rules. Phoenician traders took some of the symbols, used them explicitly for the sounds and standardized it. So there's definitely a great Egyptian contribution to the invention of the alphabet as well and it was more of a collective effort (as things often are).


EDIT: To correct myself as well, I actually looked up the origins for the Brahmic scripts, and they do in fact descend from the Aramaic (and by extension Phoenician) alphabet, so the first example of the 2 is invalid.

That makes Egyptian hieroglyphics (via the Phoenician alphabet) the ancestor of all modern scripts, excluding Chinese characters, Hangul, and both Kana scripts.

Yes, the Thai script, Cherokee Syllabics, and Canadian Aboriginal Syllabics were ultimately derived from Egyptian hieroglyphics.

 

[Ziad]

I think splitting the themes is more appropriate for a ranking.

I'd place Ancient Phoenicia as #1 but Ottoman Atomic at #1 for example.

 

[Guandao]

I won't rank the themes because I haven't heard all of them in full. But I do like the Kora (Mali), Maori chanting, and Ottoman mehter chant. Phoenicia's themes have actually grown on me. Even Canada's ain't bad. Sweden is pretty good as well. Hungary is fun. I'm not into the Inca themes as much, because of the Hispanicization of the later era themes (plus Knorr's Inca themes in Civ5 are much better). It's the same reason I find the Aztec and Mapuche themes to be somewhat mediocre.

 

[Ziad]

That makes Egyptian hieroglyphics (via the Phoenician alphabet) the ancestor of all modern scripts, excluding Chinese characters, Hangul, and both Kana scripts.

Yes, the Thai script, Cherokee Syllabics, and Canadian Aboriginal Syllabics were ultimately derived from Egyptian hieroglyphics.

The alphabet being a phonetic representation of speech is a massive linguistic shift from the semantic hieroglyphics.

It's more accurate to say that the Egyptian hieroglyphs are the ancestor of the alphabet's physical representation, with little connection to its actual functional linguistic applications.

So your statement is only partially true, and even that's stretching it considering the shapes themselves were also massively simplified.

It's still very much correct to say that the alphabet is a Phoenician invention, even if it had a connection to the Egyptian hieroglyphs. Everything is connected in the end.

 

[God of Kings]

The alphabet being a phonetic representation of speech is a massive linguistic shift from the semantic hieroglyphics.

It's more accurate to say that the Egyptian hieroglyphs are the ancestor of the alphabet's physical representation, with little connection to its actual functional linguistic applications.

So your statement is only partially true, and even that's stretching it considering the shapes themselves were also massively simplified.

It's still very much correct to say that the alphabet is a Phoenician invention, even if it had a connection to the Egyptian hieroglyphs. Everything is connected in the end.

Yes, I know that the Phoenicians invented the alphabet and the Greeks invented the true alphabet and that the Phoenician alphabet is based on Egyptian hieroglyphics. There's no doubt that everything is ultimately connected.

 

[Guandao]

We already know, but here is Geoff Knorr's reply to me about the origin of the Phoenician themes in Civ 6.

For Phoenicia, Roland used the research material on the ancient Hurrian hymn tablets as his basis, in particular the most complete of the hymns, no. 6 (also known as the Hurrian Hymn to Nikkal). Some of the ideas presented in the ancient text of these tablets would be common with the culture of the Phoenicians.
It's interesting to note that we do not know with any certainty how to interpret the musical notation on these ancient tablets. There are at least 6 different interpretations, each being quite distinct from the others. This informed Roland's decision to use a combination of all of the various interpretations for his Phoenician theme.
We hope you enjoy the expansion!

All the best,
Geoff

 

[Ziad]

Greeks invented the true alphabet

Vowels are overrated.

 

[God of Kings]

Vowels are overrated.

Now we know why vowels have to be purchased in Wheel of Fortune.