Hydromancerx
C2C Modder
Well I guess before I change any buildings or units we should put back in the resources that are now goods. I suppose this would be a huge test if we break stuff.
New Resources
- Thread starter Hydromancerx
- Start date
Esatto!
Buona idea!
Ps. @ DH and Hydro Very good job with the nice and numerous subdued animals!
EldrinFal
King
- Joined
- Mar 22, 2011
- Messages
- 926
Yeah, I think a combination of both is ideal. Some make sense as Goods that aren't traded at that level, and others SHOULD be trade-able resources. And the resources can be both found on the map and man-made, as it's always been.
With the restriction lifted, I think additional resources could be considered that represent a more consolidated form of goods. So as an example, tires and paint aren't trade-able resources, but if you have both and then make an Automobile Factory, it produces Cars which ARE a trade-able resource. Something like that.
Hydromancerx
C2C Modder
So I sent a request to strategyonly to bring back the following resources ...
- Biofuel
- Alcohol
- Glassware
- Pottery
- Concrete
- Smart Medicine
- Nanobots
- Fertilizer
- Vulcanized Rubber
- Synthetic Rubber
- Wool
- Honey
If these don't break the game then we can add ones that have never been resources before. I want to make sure the game is not broken before I have to redo it all. *sigh* so much work to undo and then do some more.
- Biofuel
- Alcohol
- Glassware
- Pottery
- Concrete
- Smart Medicine
- Nanobots
- Fertilizer
- Vulcanized Rubber
- Synthetic Rubber
- Wool
- Honey
If these don't break the game then we can add ones that have never been resources before. I want to make sure the game is not broken before I have to redo it all. *sigh* so much work to undo and then do some more.
Thunderbrd
C2C War Dog
This is very good news for the future development of further corporation concepts discussed very long ago in some AND brainstorming... hmmm 
VERY well done AIA!
VERY well done AIA!
Dancing Hoskuld
Deity
@Hydro, I do have a cloth and bunch of gem resources ready. Personally, I would prefer them as manufactured resources rather than map resources. Gems include amber, jade, emeralds, rubies, sapphires and diamonds.
Hydromancerx
C2C Modder
I have "Cloth" too. I also have "Raw Gems" and "Cut Gems". I would only want more types of gems if they are map resources. Otherwise its easier just to simply them to say "Cut Gems". As for the upgrade chain I have this ...
Gem Resource -> City Vicinity Building -> Good (Raw Gems)-> Gem Cutter -> Good (Cut Gems) -> Jeweler -> Good (Jewelery)
How do you propose we alter this?
Dancing Hoskuld
Deity
Not really historically accurate is it.
If you had gone the soft gems/hard gems route then perhaps. Cut gems are fairly modern. carved and shaped gems have been around for ever eg cabochons. Soft gems like amber and jade are easily worked, harder gems like amethyst have been turned into beads since before copper was used.
Hydromancerx
C2C Modder
Not really historically accurate is it.
I am thinking about just taking out the Cut Gems anyways and have it go directly from Gem Cutter -> Jeweler
Hydromancerx
C2C Modder
@C2C Team
So which way should I be focusing? Goods System or Resource System?
Goods System
All building made resources such as Steel or Aluminum are converted into Goods. The buildings and units they effect need to be converted such boats, tanks, and aircraft. Getting the number under the known safe limit is key in adding any new map resources like titanium or poultry.
Resource System
All Goods are converted into building made resources. Building changes thus need to require resources instead of goods. Most units already have resource requirements so no much work to do for that. The down side is there are around 60 goods to convert into resources of which only around 20 have been converted.
As you can see I have a lot of work either way. Which way should I be working on? Adding more resources or converting building made resources into Goods? Both tasks will take a lot of effort to do if I want to get it in before the freeze. And if we freeze now we have like it particularly done in both directions. Which is a mess.
strategyonly said:
So which way should I be focusing? Goods System or Resource System?
Goods System
All building made resources such as Steel or Aluminum are converted into Goods. The buildings and units they effect need to be converted such boats, tanks, and aircraft. Getting the number under the known safe limit is key in adding any new map resources like titanium or poultry.
Resource System
All Goods are converted into building made resources. Building changes thus need to require resources instead of goods. Most units already have resource requirements so no much work to do for that. The down side is there are around 60 goods to convert into resources of which only around 20 have been converted.
As you can see I have a lot of work either way. Which way should I be working on? Adding more resources or converting building made resources into Goods? Both tasks will take a lot of effort to do if I want to get it in before the freeze. And if we freeze now we have like it particularly done in both directions. Which is a mess.
Dancing Hoskuld
Deity
The only reason I can see for moving something from a good to a resource is if it is going to be tradable. If everyone will have the good/resource then it is better off as a good. If it is something that only some nations will have then it can be a resource.
Hydromancerx
C2C Modder
Its not as simple as that. I need apples to apples, not apples to oranges. For instance every nation can produce X but not Y and a building requires X OR Y. For instance every nation can make clay if they have fresh water. In turn they can make bricks. However some building require Bricks OR Stone OR Marble. Limiting say clay to a resource is fine, but then people get pissed off if you cannot say build better houses if they cannot build them with bricks.
The other factor is that making a good into a resource means you can do extra stuff such as bonus gold or food for another building that has that resource. Such as +
% for Hats at the Bazaar or whatever. Sure any nation can make hats but making them could give a bonus to other buildings that goods just can't do.I see absolutly no reason to stop the Good to Resource Conversion. There have been a rash of small bugs in the past couple days, but they seem unrelated to the resources.
The only directly related problem i've seen is performance drop, but that's fixable. I don't know why, but my 2008 laptop runs this mod without problems, even with ~30 new resources. As soon as Koshling fixes his bricked SSD he can look into these miscallaneous bugs.
Hydromancerx
C2C Modder
@ls612
Yeah strategyonly replied back and looks like he wants me to "stay the course" and continue with the goods to resources. Which, while a lot of work is what we really wanted all along. The "Goods System" was just a work around when there was a limit on resources.
That not to say we cannot still have some goods or good-like buildings. I for instance want to keep Good (Gorge Power) and Good (Fusion Power) which give free power and production to all the cities on the continent. It would not make sense for it to become a resource.
The other cool thing about resources is that I can finally make cultures into resources so one could trade cultures.
Yeah strategyonly replied back and looks like he wants me to "stay the course" and continue with the goods to resources. Which, while a lot of work is what we really wanted all along. The "Goods System" was just a work around when there was a limit on resources.
That not to say we cannot still have some goods or good-like buildings. I for instance want to keep Good (Gorge Power) and Good (Fusion Power) which give free power and production to all the cities on the continent. It would not make sense for it to become a resource.
The other cool thing about resources is that I can finally make cultures into resources so one could trade cultures.
EldrinFal
King
- Joined
- Mar 22, 2011
- Messages
- 926
I agree with this. And although the Resource hard cap has been removed, smart choices still need to be made about what to make a Resource.
Here is my opinion of how it should be broken down...
Resource
- Placed on the map as a Bonus (Horses, Cows, Wheat, Rice, etc.)
- Significant and meaningful manufactured goods (Cars, Electronics, Clothing, Alcohol, Jewelry, etc.)
- Special or unique goods produced by a National or World Wonder, which also make sense as a trade-able resource (Military Secrets, Medicines, Machine Parts, Cloned Organs, Red Matter, etc.)
Good
- Minor subsidiary resources found due to proximity of Terrain Features (Flowers, Dates, Hay, Sawdust, Sea Shells, Hamsters, etc.)
- Component / Requisite type goods that have little purpose beyond being required to build another buildings (Bricks, Rope, Sails, Nails, Horseshoes, etc.)
- Cultural goods (Literary, Musical, Theatrical works, Movies, etc.)
- Anything else not deemed worthy to trade at the national level
Thunderbrd
C2C War Dog
I don't mind having a lot of the goods included as resources... those can thus be tied into new corporations and such as well.
But cultures as resources... now that's deserving of its own thread to rethink the whole manner in which cultures are achieved... Hydro, could you do us the favor of explaining how the 'new' culture mechanism would play out then?
But cultures as resources... now that's deserving of its own thread to rethink the whole manner in which cultures are achieved... Hydro, could you do us the favor of explaining how the 'new' culture mechanism would play out then?
Hydromancerx
C2C Modder
@EldrinFal
Well I am converting as many as I can. One main reason is for transparency. Goods happen to be hard to track in the civpedia on what makes what. Resource on the other hand are easily traceable on what building makes what resource.
Well I am converting as many as I can. One main reason is for transparency. Goods happen to be hard to track in the civpedia on what makes what. Resource on the other hand are easily traceable on what building makes what resource.
Hydromancerx
C2C Modder
When I have time to organize all my thoughts about it I will. In the meantime I need to keep plugging away at these resources. Not only converting them but then replacing all the references to the goods with the resource and restoring previously taken out bonuses such as production, health, happiness, etc when you own a resource.
Thunderbrd
C2C War Dog
Hell of a huge job to do there H... I'm not envious.
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