New/Upgrade System Q's: Pentium4 or D?

[Yusaku Jon III]

Might I suggest an A64 3500+ instead, and use the money saved for a better video card? I have an overclocked 6600GT myself, and I very much regret that I didn't just spend a little more for an X800XL or 6800.

Also, AMD doesn't use DDR2 RAM, and won't until the M2 comes out.

Actually, since I've decided to put off getting the new system for at least four or five more months to allow for my paying off a credit card, I now have plenty of time to take a look every now and again to see what AMD's latest products may look like to me. I've already gotten word of a dual-core processor coming out at this time, so it might be worth holding out a while longer.

As for the DDR2 issue, I thought there were some motherboards which supported it. If it's not really that important due to system RAM not being that big of a factor in any graphics performance, then I can do without it. Otherwise, I think DDR2 would help with load times.

M2, eh? Any ETA on that?

 

[dannyevilcat]

As for the DDR2 issue, I thought there were some motherboards which supported it. If it's not really that important due to system RAM not being that big of a factor in any graphics performance, then I can do without it. Otherwise, I think DDR2 would help with load times.

M2, eh? Any ETA on that?

No AMD system uses DDR2. The M2 will, but it will have a short life (only a year or so) before AMD starts using DDR3 with it's next-next generation processors. If you're interested, M2 is supposed to come out in early 2006.

Personally, I plan on upgrading to an Athlon 64 X2 around that time, and waiting out the transition period to DDR3. To me, it's not really worth it except for current Intel users looking to make a switch.

 

[Yusaku Jon III]

Well, with my new target date falling from late Februrary to mid-March, I might be able to take advantage of the DDR2 system. But with DDR3 coming out within the year after that, why even bother? In all honesty, with only casual gaming being intended for my new system, what's the difference that even DDR3 RAM would make to current systems which use 400- and 533-MHz SDRAM cards? Aside from having faster load times, I can't think of anything.

However, I did like what I heard from a local EB store clerk concerning the upgrades to 64-bit software. While Windows hasn't yet released an upgrade to support it, AMD's Athlon64 processors can support games with optional 64-bit operations. As the clerk said, AMD's making their chips better, not stuffing brute processing power into the same old architecture.

 

[Speedo]

Well, with my new target date falling from late Februrary to mid-March, I might be able to take advantage of the DDR2 system. But with DDR3 coming out within the year after that, why even bother?

Couple things to remember:

When M2 comes out next year, it will be expensive. (is the "top of the line" always is)

Re DDR3: If you always wait for the next great thing, you'll never build a PC. By the time DDR3 comes out, I promise there will be something else just around the corner that looks great.... at some point you just have to decide to do it. Even if you go with a current socket 939 board, you have potential upgrade up to the X2 4800+, and I'm sure AMD will kick out several more 939 CPUs before the M2 is introduced. That's still nothing to sneeze at.

However, I did like what I heard from a local EB store clerk concerning the upgrades to 64-bit software. While Windows hasn't yet released an upgrade to support it, AMD's Athlon64 processors can support games with optional 64-bit operations.

Dunno where he got this info.

Windows XP Pro 64bit (and Server 2003 64 bit) has been out for several months.

Any game supporting 64 bit extentions will have to run under a 64 bit windows.

However, at the moment there's NO reason to get XP x64.
-It offers no performance gains for 32 bit software
-There are only a few games out with true 64 bit support
-The vast majority of hardware is not supported by XP x64. Every component of your PC, both inside the box and things like printers, etc, will require new drivers to support 64 bit; at the moment many companies either aren't offering 64 bit drivers or haven't released 64 bit drivers yet.

 

[Yusaku Jon III]

Even if you go with a current socket 939 board, you have potential upgrade up to the X2 4800+...

Is that the dual-core processor that AMD's coming out with, or are we talking about something else again?

All things considered, a current Socket 939 system is what I'm most likely to be going for at that point, anyway. The price of new hardware would be a strong prohibition for me, if the M2 motherboards prove to be far too expensive for what I'm looking at.

Naturally, though... should the DDR3 memory become available at prices that a poor stiff like I could afford, I'd need a whole new mobo and the next generation memory is already on the shelves.

 

[Speedo]

The A64x2 4800+ is the fastest dualcore CPU currently offered by AMD: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16819103544

 

[Yusaku Jon III]

I've just read in the latest PC Gamer special that the Socket 939 motherboard should be able to support X2 processors. Are there any makes and models you could point me towards, if these are on the market?

 

[vbraun]

Socket 939 mobos have been out for at least a year now.

 

[Speedo]

I've just read in the latest PC Gamer special that the Socket 939 motherboard should be able to support X2 processors. Are there any makes and models you could point me towards, if these are on the market?

The Athlon64, Athlon64x2 and Athlon64FX series processors are all Socket 939. I would recommend getting one by ASUS, Gigabyte or MSI. I personally like the ASUS A8N series, and am getting an A8N SLI-Premium.

 

[MarineCorps]

The Athlon64, Athlon64x2 and Athlon64FX series processors are all Socket 939. I would recommend getting one by ASUS, Gigabyte or MSI. I personally like the ASUS A8N series, and am getting an A8N SLI-Premium.

Athlon64 is also for socket 754.....

 

[Speedo]

Athlon64 is also for socket 754.....

You're right, that slipped my mind.
All of the Socket754 A64's are the older Clawhammer core though. If you're buying an A64 nowadays you'll be better off going with the newer Venice core Socket939 variants.

 

[Zelig]

The Athlon64, Athlon64x2 and Athlon64FX series processors are all Socket 939. I would recommend getting one by ASUS, Gigabyte or MSI. I personally like the ASUS A8N series, and am getting an A8N SLI-Premium.

DFI builds the best enthusiast boards S939 boards for now... but if you didn't know this already, you'll probably be fine with one by whatever other company.

You're right, that slipped my mind.
All of the Socket754 A64's are the older Clawhammer core though. If you're buying an A64 nowadays you'll be better off going with the newer Venice core Socket939 variants.

Actually, there are newer S754 revision "E" processors (Palermos) that will easily match any S939 processor slower than the 3500+ in speed for a lower cost.

 

[Speedo]

DFI builds the best enthusiast boards S939 boards for now... but if you didn't know this already, you'll probably be fine with one by whatever other company.

You go have fun with it then... I'll stick with the features of my ASUS board.

Actually, there are newer S754 revision "E" processors (Palermos) that will easily match any S939 processor slower than the 3500+ in speed for a lower cost.

You would be thinking of the Sempron line, not Athlon64's. While decent in their own right, they're hampered with a L2 cache 1/4 the size of the A64's.

 

[dannyevilcat]

DFI builds the best enthusiast boards S939 boards for now... but if you didn't know this already, you'll probably be fine with one by whatever other company.

As appealing as DFI boards are, their constant BIOS updates are a turn off.

 

[Zelig]

You go have fun with it then... I'll stick with the features of my ASUS board.

Name a feature your Asus board has that my DFI doesn't.

You would be thinking of the Sempron line, not Athlon64's. While decent in their own right, they're hampered with a L2 cache 1/4 the size of the A64's.

Although I always splurge on the highest cache AMD systems I can afford, you might be surprised how little the extra cache helps in real world situations for most people, especially when the clock speed is simply bumped up.
And the new Semprons aren't much different from the Venice/San Diego/Manchester/Toledo cores, they support the same instruction sets, are 64-bit capable, and have the same memory capabilities, minus dual channel.

As appealing as DFI boards are, their constant BIOS updates are a turn off.

Well, in defense of DFI, it could be argued that the overwhelming options offered in the BIOS offset the increased updates required to make them all work perfectly.

However, I'm running a BIOS version from 05/02, with the latest official one being from 6/23, and changes in that one just to support newly released dual core processors. Over 4 months on a BIOS for a top of the line board doesn't seem too bad...