NitroJay's Late Start Saved Games

[LuKo]

And who represents Poland? [ ]

 

[McA123]

Hooray! Someone is doing something for Vanilla. I can't wait to play it.

 

[Whitefire]

For some reason, I dislike treating Scandinavia, Poland, etc. as barbarians. (In Vanilla). I tend to think of Vanilla Germany as a nation representing not only Germany, but Scandinavia etc. also.

Thats fine and all, but Germany didn't exist until Napoleon forcibly created the German state. Prussia was the closest thing to modern Germany in 1780, and even then it was just an uber-state, not an empire. Giving Germany control of land beyond Prussian borders would not hold true to the history of the region (which is the point of this project).

And the British India question. I think that you should give the English direct control over SOME Indian port cities.

Does Madras sound good?

 

[NitroJay]

I'm awesome...

This took what seemed like forever!!! But here it is...

Viking Historical Start

http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/100826/Start_Save_-_Vikings.CivWarlordsSave

Spoiler :

Here's the deal... I originally was going to make the Eastern Roman Empire (i.e. Byzantines) independent, but changed my mind on the last lap... Instead of making them Greek though, as other's suggested, I made them Roman. After all, it IS the Eastern ROMAN Empire... Anyway, The Viking Start is in the year 550AD. The Eastern Roman Empire is at it's height, controlling all of Italy, Turkey, North Africa, Egypt, and Italy - Having recently defeated the barbarians there. (I forget the name of the barbarians... Something that starts with an O...) Anyway, the ERE is currently at war with Persia, which isn't going anywhere. Persia should be able to conquer Egypt, but I haven't really checked to see if they do...

The first time I ran through this scenario, what I feared most happened... Rome (i.e. The Eastern Roman Empire) was WAY overpowered. They were able to slap down the Arabians as they spawned... They killed the celts and moved on to Persia... Not even CLOSE to history... So, I weakened them a bit... Threw in a few extra strong barbarians in Northern Europe and weakened the defenses in Egypt. IN THEORY, the Eastern Roman Empire should only be around long enough until the European civs spawn... I wanted to get this out as soon as I could, so I didn't play too much into it... PLEASE let me know how your games turn out with this save... This save will be the building block for everything thing else I do, so I want it to work...

As for the rest of the world, Persia is on the verge of creating the 2nd Persian Empire, India is holding it's own. China is ending the North/South Dynasty era and is reuniting, and Japan is doing a good (although unnoticed) job on their islands... China has built the great wall, only because when I tried to get rid of it, since it's a little too early, it would remove the wonder but NOT the wall... However, it's only a little early... I'm sure it's no big deal.

For those of you who download and play these saves, PLEASE let me know how your games go...! It's really important that I work out any issues with this save before I keep going with my current setup...! I need the feedback! I'm going to start researching Arabia next (I think that's the next in line)... I look forward to seeing how this save works...

 

[Edungeon]

I can't play the game today, because i'm a little bussy, but I downloaded you save game.

Some Suggestions:

I think that to not make the Roman Empire too overpower, make Egypt, Carthage and Greece his vassals... and not Roman Land ( just a personal opinion though ).

Some weird stuff that I find:

It is impossible to make a town out of borders! Make a city here, it is better...

Why this land is very improved? ( with roads and stuff ) with there isn't even city ruins?

 

[Mercenary82]

The Byzantine Empire shouldn't have Italy in 550 AD, the Ostrogoths had captured it from them by then, though the Byzantines did regain it again 2 years later. Italy under barb control except Sicily would be more accurate, and ensure that the Byzantines don't get overpowered.

 

[sdLeo]

--> load save --> enter editor --> change human player civ --> you can play as them

Call me a noob, but I went into the worldbuilder and i couldn't find where the 'change human player civ' button/dialog/menu/UFO thing is...

Can I have a 'change human player civ' for dummies walk-through on this one?

I'll try hard to figure this one out meanwhile...

@nitro: Thank you for your work, very much appreciated!

 

[kairob]

The problem with the stability part is that in this situation we want rome to lose lots of terratory without collapsing, and yeah they should just get weaker and weaker and weaker . I'll play a game this everning and see how it goes, but it does look promasing

 

[NitroJay]

I'll fix that town thing... I don't know how that got in there...

As for the over improved land in North Africa, it confused me too... When I started the World Builder, Carthage had two cities in North Africa (The two that are now controlled by the Romans) and there was that road leading off to nowhere... I made a mental note to change it, but I must have forgot. If I put a city there, it'll be barbarian or independant.

As for the Ostrogoths controlling Italy, the history book I have here says that Justinian captured Italy from them in 541 AD. There was a Ostrogoth revolt shortly after, but it was subdued by 552 AD. So for all intents and purposes, I made Italy under Eastern Roman Rule in 550.

As for Rome being over powered, I don't think they are. Their current military is stretched pretty thin and the barbarians/celts should be invading them from the north and Persia should keep them in check from the east. Arabia spawns in 620 AD to further complicate things. Spain shows up shortly after that. I feel I've made the Eastern Roman Empire pretty weak, despite their huge amount of territory. But please try to play the save and post your "how the world turns out" story, I'd like to know how it goes. I'll make adjustments based on what I'm told.

As for making Egypt/Carhtage vassals, I disagree... They were conquered, not allowed to govern on their own... But I'll consider it if Rome doesn't end up collapsing as the Europeans/Arabia spawn. (As they should with the sudden loss of lots of cities...)

Thank you for the feedback! Keep it coming! I'm starting to feel better now after being sick for 3 days, so I should be able to get back in the swing of things...

 

[NitroJay]

OOh... And speaking of roads to nowhere...

I'm sure I put the nail in the coffin for Persia, but I thought it's be something to do... I added in roads from Persia to China to represent the Silk Road. Ha! In game turns, I'm sure this just speeds up the horse archers that invade Persia from the north... lol

 

[Edungeon]

Yeah, the Roman Empire doesn't stand a chance against the barbarians, i just saw 3 axeman against a fortified spearman...

 

[mitsho]

Call me a noob, but I went into the worldbuilder and i couldn't find where the 'change human player civ' button/dialog/menu/UFO thing is...

Can I have a 'change human player civ' for dummies walk-through on this one?

I'll try hard to figure this one out meanwhile...

Yes, sorry, this is my mistake. I have never tried it out before, but read of the possibility in another thread. So I must state that I just had a big mouth, sorry .

I think it has something to do with the debug mode though, but I am sure it is possible I just don't know yet though. Perhaps somebody else knows?

mick

 

[Whitefire]

I dragged my save into the scenarios folder.

 

[LuKo]

Personally I think that Eastern Roman Empire is much better represented by Greeks than Romans... It had only name of Roman Empire... (same as i.e. Holy Roman Empire).

 

[Lord Apolon]

@LuKo: I'm not sure about this. Honestly it can go either way. However, I will debate one thing: the East Roman Empire is not the 'same' in terms of nomenclature as the HRE. The HRE was founded by Charlemagne and other Germans/Franks, not Romans. It took up the heritage of Rome to some extent but had no actual continuity with it. The Byzantine Empire, however, had direct political continuity with Rome, having been established when Diocletian divided the empire, and ruled by citizens of the Roman Empire rather than Germans.

Yes, it was very Greek in culture.. more so later on. Justinian's native language was Latin.. later emperors knew Greek foremost.. but you are right that it was very Greek. Personally I prefer them as Rome, but I wouldn't mind Greeks at all either.

And why yes, I AM a student of classics. The Byzantine Empire in particular. Who would have guessed? (Not to say I'm more credentialed; I'm just an undergrad. But that's why I'm nerdy about it!)

 

[sdLeo]

The call on making the East Roman Empire Roman or Greek is a tough one indeed. Ask any Greek person though (then or now), or any of the people who came into contact with the Byzantines (including nowadays' Arabs), and they'll answer that those people were Romans. Christians in the Middle East, inheritors of the 'Byzantine' Empire (the Byzantines never called themselves that but Romans) are called Roum (Romans) by their Muslim neighbours...

Although I agree they were Greek in culture (as eventually the whole empire became - Greek in culture, that is), they proudly considered themselves Roman citizens.

 

[Talkie_Toaster]

I dragged my save into the scenarios folder.

When I do that and try to load it up it still comes up playing the autoturns...

Then the world's just the same as if 'd loaded the normal mod.

 

[Lone Wolf]

Ask any Greek person though (then or now), or any of the people who came into contact with the Byzantines...

BTW, the Russians (who inherited Orthodox Christianity from the Byzantines) usually called them Greeks, not Romans.

 

[sdLeo]

Drag into single/saves folders

 

[LuKo]

I'm not a specialist about history but as far as I know eastern part of Roman Empire wasn't romanized because Greek culture was too great.