Norway Sentences 1,052 Whales to Death

[ShannonCT]

And whales are a threatened species. We should preserve biodiversity and all species because it is important to our survival. There's still so much we have to learn about the world scientifically and we can't afford to lose any species.

Whales are not a species. They are, along with dolphins, an Order. Saying "whales are a threatened species" is like saying "primates are a threatened species." Minke Whales are a species, and they are not threatened. They are classified as low risk by the International Union for the Conservation of Nature.

Every one would just say: yes, ugly . While here, we are on the edge: Norway is a place where we expect something different from one of the population with the highest level of education in the World, average by inhabitant.

Everywhere, in any country, we will find disfunctionments. Well, let us say that this whale aspect is just one of them, and let us discuss about it, but also about the way things are presented: as pointed by someone, the article is perhaps also one-sided, and it is also what can be discussed as media can manipulate easily our soul.

The SeaShepherd article is more than one sided. It completely ignores the scientific findings of the International Whaling Commission. Portraying Norway as somehow disfunctional or anticonservationist for sustainable hunting is ignoring science.

Here's what the IWC found:

.....................................................................................................

After the moratorium entered into force in 1986, the Scientific Committee was commissioned to review the status of the whale stocks and develop a calculation method for setting safe catch limits. At the annual meeting of the IWC in 1991, the Scientific Committee submitted its finding that there are approximately 761,000 minke whales in Antarctic waters, 87,000 in the northeast Atlantic, and 25,000 in the north Pacific. With such populations, it was submitted, 2000 minke whales could be harvested per year without endangering the population. Nevertheless, the IWC Plenary committee voted to maintain the blanket moratorium on whaling, noting that formulas for determining allowable catches had not yet been adequately evaluated.

Ray Gambell, then the Secretary of the IWC, agreed at least in part with the argument of the pro-whaling nations: "In all reasonableness, we would have to say that a commercial catch could be taken without endangering [Minke] stocks."[28] In June 1993 the Chairman of the Scientific Committee, Dr Philip Hammond, resigned in protest to what he saw as contempt of the Scientific Committee’s recommendations.

Eleven years later...

The total population of Minke Whales is estimated to be in the order of 184,000 (IWC Scientific Committee 2004) in the Central and North East Atlantic.

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So Norway is hunting siginficantly fewer Minke whales than the IWC scientists said was sustainable, and over the course of 13 years, the IWC's estimates for Northern Atlantic Minke Whale population has more than doubled. Hmmmm.....

 

[Bast]

Finally, regarding all posters who said "we don't care about whales: there are more important matters such as Sudan, etc...", they are right about the fact that we should care, but I would make a simple answer:
I work and live full time in all those countries where you say "it matters". I spend actually my life trying to do something for/in those places. Now, to those who will say good bye to their wife in the morning, take their Volvo/Chrysler, go to their climatized office and worry about the Nasdaq, internet, the social party next time, and etc, etc, I just ask: what do you do? You care about other matters such as Irak/Sudan (and why only the kids?? How about others who are not on the photo?), so what is your concrete action about it? Do you join a NGO and give 1 year of your life, time, salary for helping those places? Or do you just go back home in the evening, watch the news and say "it is terrible". Because, I am just on the other side of your cocoon, and I still care about other matters such as animals, and especially see how a so-called superior race can just behave like inferior animal, and I know a lot about this, not by reading news, but watching it daily like you you watch your portfolio and baseball team result.

Very wel said!

 

[Bast]

Whales are not a species. They are, along with dolphins, an Order. Saying "whales are a threatened species" is like saying "primates are a threatened species." Minke Whales are a species, and they are not threatened. They are classified as low risk by the International Union for the Conservation of Nature..

I'm not expert on conservation issues but I do know this. Those lists are not definitive. They're always having to reassess and take something off or put something on.

Frankly, I think we should be preserving all species because we just don't understand enough about any of time or our climate.

I'm a champion for preserving the status quo. Not because I love animals more than people or I hate people. But because I know that this planet used to be very different in past. We humans can only live in this ecosystem as it exists right now. We could not have lived on this Earth 200 million years ago. We wouldn't be able to eat the plants and the climate most likely would've been too hot for us.

So it's in our best interests to perserve all the species that cohabit with us and our habitation for as long as we can.

Because at the end of the day, whales, humans and everyone else will go. We will be extinct one day and the Earth's climate will change to one unrecognizable to us. The planet will do this on its own. So we shouldn't help it.

Of course I'm not talking about killing chickens on a farm for example. This is only for natually existing species.

 

[ShannonCT]

I'm not expert on conservation issues but I do know this. Those lists are not definitive. They're always having to reassess and take something off or put something on.

Well, then I guess we can't take any creature from the sea because even though the leading environmental organizations say the creature is not threatened, they could be completely wrong.

I'm a champion for preserving the status quo.

Then Norway better start hunting more Minke Whales, since the Minke's seem to be rapidly increasing their populations at Norway's current kill rate. Check the numbers.

So it's in our best interests to perserve all the species that cohabit with us and our habitation for as long as we can.

Agreed. We dont want to send any more species to extinction. Minke Whales are not under threat of extinction from Norway's hunting. Not even close.

 

[GreyBeard]

I have hunted at times in my life and I am not opposed to hunting but I think it is short sighted to have a whale hunt at this time. Anything Norwegian has been added to my boycott list. It's not much but it is something a person can do to show their objection.

 

[Sir_Lancelot]

I'm not particularly thrilled about it, but I'm more concerned with the massacres of thousands of my own species in other places.

Humans are not an endangered species.

You can take another view on it: Humans are an endanged species. Humans are the only species that actually does endanger itself.
Finding proof shouldn't be too hard, just watch the news a bit more.


Didn't have to look hard for proof, here is one:

I'd set up an organization, that would hunt the whalers. Of course not with guns, that would be too fast - I'd let them die slowly, then I'd skin them and sell their meat in supermarkets.

 

[Sir_Lancelot]

I am pretty sure Norwegians can survive without eating whale meat. I simply refuse to accept, that it is necessary to hunt any animals in such brutal way only because some idiots like the taste of their meat.

Seriously:

It's a slim chance that you are vegetarian, but I take the chance that you are not. And I ask: Would you stop eating meat because you don't have to? No one needs to eat meat.

And just in case anyone would ask if I want more people to starve: Cows are not the most efficient way to produce food. More food per acreage can be produced if we change to other food sources. Also, the modern agriculture is a heavy polluter. Pollution... how much does that count?

 

[Sir_Lancelot]

Frankly, I don't see why other countries simply don't force the few remaining whalers to do something else. I guess it would take only few armed warships to put an end to whaling once and for all.

Committing an act of war in the process. How many human lives are you willing to end in order to save a few hundred Minke Whale lives?

Never fear. I'm sure the Norwegian whale-ships stands a good chance against the Czech navy.

 

[Winner]

If people eat them and they are killed as efficiently as possible, yes.

Unbelievable

What about humans? If they were killed as efficiently as possible, of course?

 

[Winner]

Seriously:

It's a slim chance that you are vegetarian, but I take the chance that you are not. And I ask: Would you stop eating meat because you don't have to? No one needs to eat meat.

If there was a way how to produce meat that would taste like meat without killing animals, I'd gladly stop eating the real meat.

I'll repeat it once again:

1) Norway has no right to hunt whales without the approval of the other countries.
2) Whaling is unneccesary, brutal and potentially dangerous for entire species.
3) More sentient animals shouldn't be hunted at all. If you kill a chimp, for instance, it is not different from killing a mentaly disabled human.
4) Norway, as one of the richest countries in the world, has absolutely no need to do this.

If it is your national tradition, give it up, we're not in the Middle Ages anymore.

 

[Homie]

As a Norwegian I say..............Hunt those whales!

And to the "This is illegal" crowd:
Like we care. Just because a bunch of countries agree on some rule doesn't make it illegal for OTHER countries to break that rule. Hehe, how do you guys make sense of it in your heads that Norway is acting illegally when it is not bound by this treaty, because it never agreed to it?

 

[Oruc]

I dont care if they hunt whales, their just animals

 

[Perfection]

What about humans? If they were killed as efficiently as possible, of course?

Whales aren't humans, they're just another breed of loser mammels.

 

[Bast]

If there was a way how to produce meat that would taste like meat without killing animals, I'd gladly stop eating the real meat.

I'll repeat it once again:

1) Norway has no right to hunt whales without the approval of the other countries.
2) Whaling is unneccesary, brutal and potentially dangerous for entire species.
3) More sentient animals shouldn't be hunted at all. If you kill a chimp, for instance, it is not different from killing a mentaly disabled human.
4) Norway, as one of the richest countries in the world, has absolutely no need to do this.

If it is your national tradition, give it up, we're not in the Middle Ages anymore.

I love you, Winner.

 

[ArneHD]

If there was a way how to produce meat that would taste like meat without killing animals, I'd gladly stop eating the real meat.

So you would rate your own comfort (good food), over killing animals? Even though you are against killing animals? Pigs are arguably more intelligent animals, raised in a lot more pain.

I'll repeat it once again:

1) Norway has no right to hunt whales without the approval of the other countries.

What others? What treaty bind Norway to this?

2) Whaling is unneccesary, brutal and potentially dangerous for entire species.

Apperently not, the minke whale is not endangerd and can sustain the rates of animals taken.

3) More sentient animals shouldn't be hunted at all. If you kill a chimp, for instance, it is not different from killing a mentaly disabled human.

Prove that animals are sentient, then we can talk. Also note my previous argument that pigs and dogs are more intelligent than whales. Stop factory farming them if you care so much.

4) Norway, as one of the richest countries in the world, has absolutely no need to do this.

They are a resource within the boundaries of norwegian economic space.

If it is your national tradition, give it up, we're not in the Middle Ages anymore.

Would you give up any part of your natinal heritage? I think not.

 

[CurtSibling]

It is up to Norway what they do with their own territorial waters.
If people want to protest whaling, there is a simple consumer tactic.

Hit the Nords where it hurts:
Just don't buy their products.

I don't.

...

 

[ArneHD]

It is up to Norway what they do with their own territorial waters.
If people want to protest whaling, there is a simple consumer tactic.

Hit the Nords where it hurts:
Just don't buy their products.

I don't.

...

On the other hand what norwegian products exist where you live?

 

[ShannonCT]

If there was a way how to produce meat that would taste like meat without killing animals, I'd gladly stop eating the real meat.

So you eat meat because you like the taste. Just to be clear, animals die to please your tongue.

1) Norway has no right to hunt whales without the approval of the other countries.

1) The IWC scientists say it is safe to hunt Minke whales and 50% of the countries on the committee agree. Some countries are ignoring the science to further their agenda of a permanent ban on whaling.

2) Whaling is unneccesary, brutal and potentially dangerous for entire species.

2) Farming chickens, cows, and pigs is unnecessary, and much more brutal than whaling. Whales live their lives free and die with a couple minutes of pain. I'm sure dying of old age or disease would be more painful.

I'll repeat: WHALES ARE NOT A SPECIES. Minke whales are the species in question and they are not endangered and never have been. They are not even threatened. Ignore the science at your peril.

3) More sentient animals shouldn't be hunted at all. If you kill a chimp, for instance, it is not different from killing a mentaly disabled human.

3) Whales are no more sentient than cows or pigs or fish. If you are refering to whales being intelligent or sapient, there is no evidence that whales are more intelligent than the cows or pigs you eat. Dolphins and chimps are by some measures quite intelligent, but nobody is purposely hunting them.

Killing a mentally disabled person is the same as killing a chimp??? Is this the Adolf Hitler school for human rights?

4) Norway, as one of the richest countries in the world, has absolutely no need to do this.

If it is your national tradition, give it up, we're not in the Middle Ages anymore.

This isn't about need or wealth. If hunting a species endangers that species and puts it at risk of extinction, it's wrong. If a species can be hunted humanely and the population can remain stable or increase (as it appears to be doing), there's nothing wrong with it. Unless you think hunting and fishing is barbaric, you have no point about Minke whales.

 

[Panda]

It is up to Norway what they do with their own territorial waters.
If people want to protest whaling, there is a simple consumer tactic.

Hit the Nords where it hurts:
Just don't buy their products.

I don't.

...

What about Norwegian Black Metal?

 

[bhsup]

Heck, I'm tempted to go out and try to buy some whale meat right now just to show my support for the Norwegians. I'll ship to any Norwegian who ships me some whale meat a very nice selection of American buffalo meat. Have to check on the legalities...