Oh my goodness! Liberalism slingshot to...

[Aamto12]

Assembly Line!! Check the attached. Included also is a shot of my wonder-hogging capital.

Yeah, I was able to delay Liberalism THAT late and use it to grab Assembly Line free. And no, this isn't a Noble game. Or a Prince game. Or a Monarch game. This is actually an Emperor game. Amazing what a continent at war will do, eh?

It goes without saying I got SUPER lucky in being able to do this (and I actually made it a point to try once I saw I had Rifling + Constitution before anyone had Education). No tech whore AIs, Monty, my direct neighbor to the north was kept occupied by Boudica, on the eastern end of the continent and the other AIs (Wang, Joao, SB) were in a constant war with each other, while the lone other AI, Frederick, was isolated on a small island. So I was able to research unhindered, while keeping only a token military force. I've also done a complete Wonder hog in Cuczo. I think I'm missing only Stonehenge, The Pantheon (much to my dismay, as I was about to complete it!), the Hagia Sophia, and the Statue of Zeus (another I was about to complete before it was snatched) as far as land-locked wonders go. And then I got the Colossus but missed GLH in my coastal cities. Also, I popped two mine resources in Cuczo during the course of the game (the Plains hill Gold and the grassland hill Copper). So that was lucky, too!

As for the rest of the game, I think I'm going to hit Steel, shut down research, and then pump out Infantry/Cannons and steal the rest of this map. I would use Cavalry (no one at this point even has Replaceable Parts) but I don't have horse. Nuts. You'll also notice I don't have my continent mapped at this point that's how little I've had to pay attention to the rest of the warring world. Well, a simple trade to Boudica next turn remedied that.

Has anyone else done some crazy slingshots with Liberalism?

 

[spur390]

I'll cross my fingers for a war-torn world next game. My last two monarch games the AI got Liberalism while I was trying to learn paper.

 

[Kesshi]

Aamto12,

Look at the year.

Spoiler :

 

[Willem]

I was amazed one time when I got Feudalism with an Oracle free tech, I certainly wasn't expecting it. I was very lucky with some Goody Huts free techs.

 

[CHEESE!]

Kesshi, that is INSANE.

Teach me your glorious ways!

OMFGZ, you have all of Europe, the Middle east AND AFRICA! and still at 60%!

Lol, no archery??

 

[Tatran]

Has anyone else done some crazy slingshots with Liberalism?

Yep, once I had the opportunity to get Railroad as free tech (Monarch game) from Liberalism.

 

[Kesshi]

Kesshi, that is INSANE.

Teach me your glorious ways!

OMFGZ, you have all of Europe, the Middle east AND AFRICA! and still at 60%!

Lol, no archery??

CHEESE!,

To be fair, that was a noble game. I'm playing the Earth map over and over trying to get the highest score possible. I finished greater than 350,000. However I was Agustus and not Julius.

I'm in the middle of another game, this time as Julius (Organized) and upped it to Prince, and I'm doing far far better.

Spoiler :

Ever city you see there is mine except for Yaroslavl and Hadrumetum. That's 35 cities, and I'm still pushing, hard. I'm about two turns away from taking over Hadrumetum. I'm also 2 turns away from Divine Right, a few away from the AP being built, and it's still only 300 BC!

I've improved my ways from the Noble game as well. Instead of having three military cities at this point, I have two. I discovered what I was doing was not the most efficient way to push forward and remedied it accordingly. Also, I'm staying in Slavery and other than a few special cities, every city I'm getting is being whipped every time possible. This makes for minimal city maintiance. I'm gathering more and more happiness resources and buildings all the time, so I'm actually keeping up with the unhappiness from whipping. Eventually it'll have to stop, but by then, the cities will have a TON of buildings, and be very useful to my empire, even with +6 to 8 cannot forget your cruel oppression. Also, early on, in this game, I got the health quest and decided to go for it. While I did get the health bonus, it triggered the -population, which delayed my inital development by a few turns. This may affect my final score, as it'll delay my winning by a few turns.

This game my goal is to Liberalism into Assembly Line even earlier. After which it's nonstop craziness. I'm currently being very meticulous in my micromanaging, so it's taking a long time for every turn.

 

[Kiwi Tyrant]

Have you tried it without the Pret rush?

 

[Kesshi]

Kiwi Tyrant,

Sure have. I used to play India on the Earth map. I really really like Asoka's abilities.

Spoiler :

This is from about 8-10 months ago, and I was only a Prince or Monarch player then. So I didn't play nearly as well as I do now. This, too, is from a Noble game. In this game, I chose Future Tech 1 from Liberalism after it and Communism were the only things left. Yes, I obsoletede the Kremlin before I could build it (Liberalism is a requirement for Communism.)

The reason I chose a Praetoran rush for these new games is because of how powerful it is. My target is the highest score I can get, and I know that Praetorans are overpowered, thus I can achieve my goal easier.

Part of the challenge is managing and conquering such a large empire with the smallest army possible. I'll be pushing to higher difficulties as I hone my skills on lower ones, and I hope to do this in an Immortal game. Actually, I think that after I get around the whole managing a large empire, Immortal may be a little bit easier because I'll actually be able to trade technologies with other civilizations. Even on Prince I was only able to take Archery from another civ in exchange for peace. I traded for a few others, too, but to be honest, they just don't tech nearly fast enough to be worth anything. Oh well, time will tell what future games will be like. I'll report back when I get liberalism on this game.

 

[Kiwi Tyrant]

Those little numbers showing how many turns 'til pop goes up, how many turns to build etc. look handy. Can you give me the link to them Kess?

 

[Kesshi]

Kiwi Tyrant,

It's in your options. See the picture below:

Spoiler :

Tick that on, and you're good to go. (FYI, I play BTS, but I chose the vanilla CivIV opening screen. I like the Baba Yetu song. )

 

[negZero]

Kesshi I would love to know how your able to build an empire like that so quickly

 

[TheMeInTeam]

When I successfully warrior rushed all of europe on noble in earth 18 civs, I wound up taking mass media with liberalism. It's so fun to do things like this .

 

[Kesshi]

Kesshi I would love to know how your able to build an empire like that so quickly

I made a thread describing the religious economy that I'm using in the strategy section. You can find it here.

When I successfully warrior rushed all of europe on noble in earth 18 civs, I wound up taking mass media with liberalism. It's so fun to do things like this .

TheMeInTeam,

I found that warrior rushing stretched my empire too thin for my likes. The early maintiance was killer, and I had a tough time managing to recover in a timely fashon. By waiting I ensure that when I do capture the cities, they are for sure worth more coin when captured, and possibly have neat buildings that my troops haven't pillaged, and also possibly have workers nearby that are more than willing to work for me after some persuasion.

Though, if there is a better way to start off taking over Europe than by waiting until after I have Iron Working, I'd be all ears. I'm looking to improve my game as much as possible.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

I made a thread describing the religious economy that I'm using in the strategy section. You can find it here.



TheMeInTeam,

I found that warrior rushing stretched my empire too thin for my likes. The early maintiance was killer, and I had a tough time managing to recover in a timely fashon. By waiting I ensure that when I do capture the cities, they are for sure worth more coin when captured, and possibly have neat buildings that my troops haven't pillaged, and also possibly have workers nearby that are more than willing to work for me after some persuasion.

Though, if there is a better way to start off taking over Europe than by waiting until after I have Iron Working, I'd be all ears. I'm looking to improve my game as much as possible.

You're right - After I took out France/Rome/Germany/Greece I called it quits and spammed wonders (after all, doing this gives us stone and marble...). I'm not sure this is more optimal than waiting for IW, but you do get to bypass defenders. The 2-4th civs might have workers the warrior can steal (I think I got 2 stolen workers). In terms of hammers saved it's huge...settlers take a lot more hammers than warriors! Warriors are very hammer-efficient that early on.

If I were to do it again I'd probably still warrior rush but I'd go for an early religion like you outline in your 34 civ game because honestly it spreads like wildfire (esp if you get sailing early) and building warriors isn't inhibited by early tech path whatsoever . Sal favors hindu but if you're izzy like I was you can easily beat him to it. If you're rome just take izzy's buddhist and get sailing early...!

AP/Spiral/Sankore/Rep/Merc. Warrior rushing 4 cities shouldn't be crippling maintenance especially on noble/prince, and once you get BW you can whip out workers and get a prophet wonder (manipulate distribution of wonders so you get one, all of the european capitols are good for wonders so distribute GPP to get a prophet first then whatever next).

Hammerwise, which are the limiting factor early IMO, nothing competes with warrior rushing AIs that spawn at this distance!

 

[Kesshi]

If I were to do it again I'd probably still warrior rush but I'd go for an early religion like you outline in your 34 civ game because honestly it spreads like wildfire (esp if you get sailing early) and building warriors isn't inhibited by early tech path whatsoever . Sal favors hindu but if you're izzy like I was you can easily beat him to it. If you're rome just take izzy's buddhist and get sailing early...!

TheMeInTeam,

You're nuts if you think you can get an early religion with 33 other civs panning for them! In my 34 civs games, I virtually ignore religion until I get Music. After Music I use the Great Artist to pop Theology, but that requires that I have A) Drama, B) Monarchy (so Priesthood as a prereq) and C) Meditation. Yes, I get Music before Meditation!

I completely shun religions in the early game. I only go for a religion when I know who nearby has an early religion, and in a 34 civ game, Isabella usually doesn't get an early religion. In my Noble game it was Saladin who had Hinduism. And in my Prince game, it was Ramses who had Judea. Only when I knew who had the holy cities, did I start focusing on spreading the appropriate religion around.

 

[blitzkrieg1980]

I made a thread describing the religious economy that I'm using in the strategy section. You can find it here.

How did you get those techs so quickly? You're on prince and were able to have divine right by 10BC without being attacked, with all those cities, running Mercantilism (no SP because not teched yet)?

How have you been able to keep such an army while teching the whole time and getting wonders AND a great economy? You have to spread your religion to get the shrine bonus and you have to build the buildings to get all those extra gold/research/production, plus you have to grab the AP for that production bonus. Basically, I read your article, but still have no idea how you were able to accomplish this. I have troubles with a 12 city empire in 10BC on Warlord!!! (not organized or financial)

 

[TheMeInTeam]

TheMeInTeam,

You're nuts if you think you can get an early religion with 33 other civs panning for them! In my 34 civs games, I virtually ignore religion until I get Music. After Music I use the Great Artist to pop Theology, but that requires that I have A) Drama, B) Monarchy (so Priesthood as a prereq) and C) Meditation. Yes, I get Music before Meditation!

I completely shun religions in the early game. I only go for a religion when I know who nearby has an early religion, and in a 34 civ game, Isabella usually doesn't get an early religion. In my Noble game it was Saladin who had Hinduism. And in my Prince game, it was Ramses who had Judea. Only when I knew who had the holy cities, did I start focusing on spreading the appropriate religion around.

I was thinking earth EIGHTEEN civs, which is what I played when I got mass media with lib. Also, I did it as IZZY, who starts fishing/mysticism, the combo set for founding an early religion. On noble, no AI can possible match a coastal izzy start when she goes for an early religion. You're pretty literally guaranteed a religion this way, although it will delay the rush slightly (less so if it's on a lake or more likely you can work a seafood resource), but it's not like the AI is very imposing with its early noble warriors and their 8 tile from your capitol spawn .

Seriously...it is literally impossible to beat the player to early religion if they can work a 2+ commerce tile and start with mysticism on noble/prince.

Edit: Although kesshi didn't explicitly mention it, he probably bulbed divine right after using an earlier prophet on a shrine. He's basically running prophets EVERYWHERE, so lots of them is to be expected (a shrined holy city can run several extra priests by the way). For divine right you only need theology and writing actually - It's just beaker intensive. I actually oracled DR on emperor once (I rerolled for a 2 gem starts ). Crazy game...my tech sucked and I had about 4-5 cities at first (I was hatty), but I wound up winning because I just kept brokering theology and then divine right with the AIs for war/economy techs, and went on some crusades. If you were to set it to "no tech brokering" which IIRC Kesshi did, it's even more powerful as you can REALLY abusively hold off on trading theology/DR with some AIs until they get the tech you're looking for, and with that many civs it will give you tons, and tons, and tons of mileage. You could probably trade theo/DR for everything up until around education in terms of beaker cost if you can avoid WFYABTA .

Edit 2: I've played earth 18 civs like 5 times, and the one guy who always gets hindu is sal. On 18 izzy always gets buddhism also - but I can imagine that would change with the extra civs.

 

[Kesshi]

Edit: Although kesshi didn't explicitly mention it, he probably bulbed divine right after using an earlier prophet on a shrine. He's basically running prophets EVERYWHERE, so lots of them is to be expected (a shrined holy city can run several extra priests by the way). For divine right you only need theology and writing actually - It's just beaker intensive. I actually oracled DR on emperor once (I rerolled for a 2 gem starts ). Crazy game...my tech sucked and I had about 4-5 cities at first (I was hatty), but I wound up winning because I just kept brokering theology and then divine right with the AIs for war/economy techs, and went on some crusades. If you were to set it to "no tech brokering" which IIRC Kesshi did, it's even more powerful as you can REALLY abusively hold off on trading theology/DR with some AIs until they get the tech you're looking for, and with that many civs it will give you tons, and tons, and tons of mileage. You could probably trade theo/DR for everything up until around education in terms of beaker cost if you can avoid WFYABTA .

Edit 2: I've played earth 18 civs like 5 times, and the one guy who always gets hindu is sal. On 18 izzy always gets buddhism also - but I can imagine that would change with the extra civs.

TheMeInTeam,

You should know me better than that... I loathe bulbing! The only thing I plan on bulbing is Theology from my free Great Artist. I manually teched Divine Right, that's just how fast I'm teching. Over 500 beakers per turn at 10BC, and Mercantilism is just around the corner. I could have founded Philosophy in the BC also, if I wanted.

To be honest, I don't run a whole lot of Priest specialists early on. As I said before, I virtually ignore religion until I realize who has a holy city nearby, and only then do I focus on that religion. This ensures the earliest possible holy city with the minimal amount of missionary spreading. Because I ignore religions early on I really have to work to get a Great Prophet before I capture the Holy City. In my Noble game, I didn't get a Great Prophet until a few turns after I captured the Holy City.

The first Great Prophet producing World Wonder I build in these games is usually The AP. And while Rome has built the Moai Statues, that's only 1 GPP per turn, which is nill when I have cities that have 3 or 4 wonders in them.

Getting an earlier Great Prophet is something I'll need to work on in the future. I'll need to develop a food city and spread every religion I get to that city for extra temples (and eventually Cathedrals) for at least one guaranteed Great Prophet, preferably more.

 

[blitzkrieg1980]

How can you possibly start teching that quickly? I just don't understand how you are able to maintain such an empire so early on without courthouses, with a military that could take over so much land, and without falling back on tech? Especially on levels Noble & higher