Orbital Mind Control Lasers (Civ Flavour Brainstorming)

[Milaga]

Here are some ideas I've been piecing together about adding a little more flavor, balancing civ strengths and adding alternatives to weaknesses. I deliberately tried adding more stuff since, after all, these are mostly ideas. I gave some though to balancing but I haven't played nearly enough Planetfall to be able to tell how it will play in an actual game.

Lord's Believers

• Civilization Trait: Fundamentalist
  • Bases store 10% of after growth
  • Bases have +50% defense against
• UB: Believer Headquarters (Headquarters)
  • +1
  • -1 Planet Attitude
• UU: Shaper (Former)
  • Cost: 45 (instead of 60)
  • +20% work rate
  • -50% upkeep for damaged units
  • cannot be captured

Miriam

• Charismatic
• Strong

Morgan Industries

• Civilization Trait: Corporate
  • +1
  • +100% yield
  • +20% maintenance
• UB: Corporate Headquarters (Headquarters)
  • +10% energy
• UU: Industry Scout (Scout Patrol)
  • Better results from unity pods

Morgan

• Efficient
• Industrious

Gaia's Stepdaughters

• Civilization Trait: Ecologist
  • Bases have +2 Planet Attitude
• UB: Gaian Roots (Headquarters)
  • +10% to production of Colony Pod and Sea Colony Pod
• UU: Planeteer (Invitro)
  • Cost: 70 (instead of 60)
  • +50% attack in Xenofungus
  • +50% attack in Hybrid Forest
  • +25% defense in Xenofungus
  • +25% defense in Hybrid Forest
• UU: Crafter (Former)
  • -20% work rate
• UU: Aquacrafter (Aquaformer)
  • -20% work rate

Dierdre

• Efficient
• Defensive

The Human Hive

• Civilization Trait: Despotism
  • +10%
  • +20% defense against
  • -10%
• UB: Hive Headquarters (Headquarters)
  • -50% war
• UU: Sentinal (Chopper)
  • Unit starts with +1 free special ability slot

Yang

• Disciplined
• Prepared

U.N. Peacekeeping Forces

• Civilization Trait: Humanitarian
  • -10% maintenance in all bases
  • +20% war
  • +10% non-military production
• UB: U.N. Headquarters (Headquarters)
  • +10% secret project production
  • -10% military production
• UU: Peacekeeper (Infantry)
  • +10% base defense
  • Garrisoned base 20% less likely to revolt
  • This unit cannot be upgraded and is never obsolete

Lal

• Charismatic
• Defensive

Spartan Federation

• Civilization Trait: Survivalist
  • Garrisoned units have +15% PSI defense
  • Garrisoned units provide +1
• UB: Base Headquarters (Headquarters)
  • +50% defense
• UU: Scout Rover (Rover)
  • +10% chance to withdraw from combat
  • This unit does not count for maintenance purposes

Santiago

• Disciplined
• Strong

University of Planet

• Civilization Trait: Scientist
  • +10%
  • -20%
• UB: University Headquarters (Headquarters)
  • +1
  • +10%
  • +20%
• UU: Science Team (Probe Team)
  • Double movement in Flat Arid
  • Double movement in Flat Moist
  • Double movement in Flat Rainy

Zakharov

• Industrious
• Prepared

 

[Milaga]

Here are the explanations of the leader traits.

• Charismatic
  • +1 in each city
  • Food riots and revolts 20% less likely
  • +25% production of Recreation Commons
• Defensive
  • All units start with the Defensive promotion
    • +15% combat while inside cultural borders
    • -10% attack while outside cultural borders
  • +25% production of Perimeter Defense
• Disciplined
  • All units start with the Disciplined promotion
  • -10% war in all cities
  • +25% production of Punishment Sphere and Bioenhancement Center
• Efficient
  • +1 on all plots with at least 4
  • -50% Ultraponics maintenance
  • +25% production of Recycling Tanks
• Industrious
  • -40% cost of upgrading a unit
  • +40 to starting energy
  • +25% production of Maintenance Bay and Assembly Hall
• Prepared
  • -1 xp/level needed for promotion
  • +25% production of Command Center
• Strong
  • +25% in all bases
  • +10% military production

I've also been playing around with bad leader traits for minor leaders or to mix up gameplay a bit. All leaders can start with two civ traits and a randomly selected bad one.

• Subordinate
  • -5% in all bases
• Stubborn
  • Double the number of turns between civic changes
  • -10% production
• Inept
  • +1 in all cities
• Corrupt
  • +10% maintenance in all bases
  • +100% Ultraponics maintenance
  • Production does not overflow
• Indecisive
  • +100% anarchy duration
  • +100% chance for a food riot or base revolt
• Beaurocratic
  • +25% maintenance for number of bases
  • -10% production of special projects
• Pacifist
  • All infantry units start with the Pacifist promotion
    • -1 attack strength
  • +20% war

 

[Maniac]

As you read in the other thread, there's no need to think in the vanilla mindset of "1 civ = 2 leader trait, one UU, one UB".

Generally speaking, all your suggestions are good to keep in mind, but they all kinda fall in the category of minor mathematical boni. None strike me as stuff that would significantly affect how a faction's playstyle feels like.

 

[Pfeffersack]

Many nice ideas and IMO, even numerical (dis)advantages can affect your playstyle a lot...however, there is one thing I would really dislike to have:

Corrupt
* +10% maintenance in all bases
* +100% Ultraponics maintenance
* Production does not overflow

That would kill one of the best MM-reducing improvements Civ4 brought compared to Civ3...the no longer need to MM tiles to avoid waste when completing something...

 

[Maniac]

Many nice ideas and IMO, even numerical (dis)advantages can affect your playstyle a lot...

I certainly agree.
An idea: instance of immediately suggesting concrete faction benefits, how about we try to define how we want a game with a faction to feel like? We can then try to translate that general feeling into game concepts.

Anyway, here's some stuff I've thought of in the meanwhile:

For the Spartans: they should have a quality army, and should be able to operate well in small battle groups. So instead of their current Combat I promotion, I figured they could get:
+1 first strike (from other thread)
+5% bombard damage
+10% healing speed in neutral and enemy territory
+10% withdrawal chance

That way they don't need lots of support units to succesfully invade someone (every unit can reduce base defenses), and the healing bonus will also help both in invasions and exploration. Each unit is a self-sufficient battle unit.


For the Hive:

+1 in squares with 4 (advanced heavy industry)
+1 mineral from every Drone and Labourer

+ for every Labourer means all new bases would start with an extra mineral for free though. I don't want ICS to always be the best strategy for the Hive, so I'd compensate this benefit by increasing their colony pod cost by 40, to 160.

Some ideas to create large armies of weak units:

Orc Warrens: for every infantry built, you get a copy for free, but it doesn't have any XP or special ability slots.

Every infantry unit starts with a promotion that gives it -20% strength.

The Hive's 'Chichen Itza' bonus gets further increased. Because infantry units are the only ones who can profit well from plot defense, infantry would still be the best choice for base defense. For offensive actions the Hive would need to rely on bombardment units to soften the enemy before the infantry moves on.

Boreholes, greenhouses and mines in Hive territory can only be pillaged by psi units (because these improvements are underground). This further allows the Hive to concentrate on static defense without much harm as a consequence.

 

[slugwalk]

Sorry, I just noticed this thread, my recent post in the V8 feedback should be here instead.

 

[slugwalk]

Boreholes, greenhouses and mines in Hive territory can only be pillaged by psi units (because these improvements are underground). This further allows the Hive to concentrate on static defense without much harm as a consequence.

Greenhouses wouldn't work well underground (Even with piped in sunlight via fiber optic cable, you couldn't get anywhere near as much light as a greenhouse on the surface).

Your other ideas are very interesting though.

 

[Maniac]

I figured their greenhouse algae would use other energy sources, geothermal for instance.

 

[orlanth]

How about some terrain-specific faction differences:

Due to requiring extensive bedrock, Hive can found bases built into Ridge tiles (with all the benefits of terrain defense and a difficult tactical approach), but not in Flat Moist or Flat Rainy terrain.

(In the Warhammer mod Subterranean races can only found cities in Hills, this didn't turn out nearly as painful as I expected )

 

[mindlar]

For the Believers, I see their mindset as "We've found the paradise that God intended for us and we will make it that way". With such a mindset, they should be the premier terraforming faction and benefit the most from terraforming.

I see their bonuses/maluses as:
-1 planet in each base (don't care about getting along with planet)
25% faster at clearing fungus (fungus is a blight)
33% less likely for fungal bloom within their territory (notice the signs and sometimes able to stop an erruption)
+1 mindworm/IOD on each fungal bloom within their territory (offset the above, when planet manages to bloom in their territory it knows it needs to hold it)
+1 from settlements
+1 and +2 from edens

When running the terraforming civic they can slowly turn their forests into gardens giving +.25 (+.75 total)

Overall they will end up with about 5/6 (2/3 the blooms * 5/4 the native life) the total amount of native life, but the attacks will be about 50% more dangerous since the number of units that stay stationary will remain at 2.

 

[slugwalk]

For the Believers, I see their mindset as "We've found the paradise that God intended for us and we will make it that way". With such a mindset, they should be the premier terraforming faction and benefit the most from terraforming.

I'm not sure I see Believers as automatically being Edenists or Anti planet. I think the pro-Planet/Anti-Planet decision should be one that's not automatic for any Factions other than the Gaians. My idea for the Believers would be to give them their religion at the start of the game and have them get benefits from spreading it and, when the AI is controlling them extra hatred of factions with other religions. Also they shouldn't be able to switch religions or use the consensus civic. To deal with other religions, they should have a unique unit of inquisitors to remove other religions.
I know this is very different than the way they are designed now, but I think its more interesting than just having them be the Terraformer faction.

 

[Maniac]

I intend to let the Believers start with the Edenism religion.

Due to requiring extensive bedrock, Hive can found bases built into Ridge tiles (with all the benefits of terrain defense and a difficult tactical approach), but not in Flat Moist or Flat Rainy terrain.

I kinda like the idea, but base graphics don't work on Ridges. That's why I don't allow founding bases there, not for any gameplay reasons.

Regarding more rules in general on base founding, earlier in Planetfall's development, it was not allowed to build bases on Rocky, but I got questions from people why they sometimes couldn't found bases. So too many rules and restrictions seems too confusing.

 

[slugwalk]

I intend to let the Believers start with the Edenism religion.

Are you saying you're going to make them start with it, or are you emphasizing that you want them to be tied to terraforming?
How wed are you to the tight connection to the Believer's religion and an emphasis on terraforming? I think it would make more sense for the Lord's Believers to be focused on belief in God, rather than a belief that Planet should be remade in Earth's image. It doesn't eliminate conflicts between religions; the Believers would still have problems with all the other religions. For example, the Believer religion would see the VoP religion as an obvious case of the worship of false idols.

The problem with forcing the Believers to be Terraformers is that they automatically have two enemies: the Gaians (and any other factions that choose Hybrid) and Planet. I've found it almost impossible to play the Believers, and the AI doesn't seem to do much better.

 

[Ahriman]

Morganites.
Consider giving them bonus food and hammers from trade routes, as well as big trade route commerce bonuses and bonus trade routes. I agree with your point earlier about encouraging them to try to maintain open borders with as many civs as possible, this is a good way to encourage it.

 

[Maniac]

How wed are you to the tight connection to the Believer's religion and an emphasis on terraforming?

Very.
I can't imagine the University or Hive following a religion centered on a belief in God. I can imagine them being guided by the goal to turn Planet into Earth's image.

 

[slugwalk]

Very.
I can't imagine the University or Hive following a religion centered on a belief in God. I can imagine them being guided by the goal to turn Planet into Earth's image.

Are you saying that the Believers wouldn't be able to spread their belief in God, but would be able to spread a belief in reshaping Planet? I think it would still be possible to spread the religion to the populace, but it might end up being a destabilizing influence. Similar to the issues China has with many religious groups today. The unrest it would cause with the populace would be reflected by the existing "We want religious freedom!" unhappiness effects. In fact the penalties for certain religions (perhaps VoP and Belief in God) could be greater for certain Civs (University and Hive).

 

[Lord Tirian]

Are you saying that the Believers wouldn't be able to spread their belief in God, but would be able to spread a belief in reshaping Planet?

I think the problem is a bit the name "religion" due to the Believers strong connection of religion. I tend to view Planetfall's religions more as "ideologies" (though that word is also intertwined with the ideologies of the factions) or "value framework". Less dogmatic than the word religion.

Edenism isn't so much a religion, for me, but rather the deep belief that the correct course of action for humanity is adapting the planet to its needs. Believers may interpret this as the conclave biblical holy land, university may see it as "progress is the future", Gaians may even see it as creating a garden to enhance planet's variety (which they can even do, as their positive planet value can lessen the sting of terraforming, as long as you don't overdo it).

Similar for, let's say Voice of the Planet - University may see it as a scientifically motivated grand experiment to study Planet and so forth.

Cheers, LT.

 

[Maniac]

Gaians may even see it as creating a garden to enhance planet's variety (which they can even do, as their positive planet value can lessen the sting of terraforming, as long as you don't overdo it).

Yeah I kinda imagine that before they knew that there existed something called Planetmind, the Gaians would be strong Edenist supporters, and Deirdre would be good buddies with Miriam.

Imagine the story potential! Former friends turn into sworn enemies.

 

[slugwalk]

So if you're going to use these ideologies, perhaps the AI shouldn't be programmed to always go to the same ones. This would give games more variety. Also, it would make the game less predictable. As is, Diedre and Miriam tend to go all out for VoP and Edenism, respectively, so I don't go for these ideologies if I'm not playing them.

 

[Pfeffersack]

I think the problem is a bit the name "religion" due to the Believers strong connection of religion. I tend to view Planetfall's religions more as "ideologies" (though that word is also intertwined with the ideologies of the factions) or "value framework". Less dogmatic than the word religion.

Edenism isn't so much a religion, for me, but rather the deep belief that the correct course of action for humanity is adapting the planet to its needs. Believers may interpret this as the conclave biblical holy land, university may see it as "progress is the future", Gaians may even see it as creating a garden to enhance planet's variety (which they can even do, as their positive planet value can lessen the sting of terraforming, as long as you don't overdo it).

Similar for, let's say Voice of the Planet - University may see it as a scientifically motivated grand experiment to study Planet and so forth.

Cheers, LT.

That's the critical point IMO - are we talking of religions or ideologies?

I am still trying to improve this part of the leaderheads (now that I have figured out how the "different religion" modifiers exactly work) and I have some cool ideas...but I always run into that question. Hive or University are the best examples...it does not make sense to let them care about religions at all, but things change if we have ideologies.