Ottoman Question

[FlakJacket]

In honour of them making it into PTW, and plus the fact that I'm interested in them, I have a What if... question about the Ottoman empire.

What do people think the consequences might have been if the rains had held off long enough for Suleyman to bring his heavy canons up and hadn't killed off 75% of his camels carrying the supplies, he was able to break the seige of Vienna and take the city in 1529?

 

[cameramano]

I took an Ottoman history class last year. It wouldn't have mattered. Poor planning bogged that expedition. The empire would have overexpanded.

 

[Admiral Super]

What if they had survived the first world war?

 

[Hamlet]

Originally posted by Admiral Super
What if they had survived the first world war?

Rather moot, considering they would have been presured to decolonise had they been on the side of the allies at some point.

 

[G-Man]

Originally posted by Admiral Super
What if they had survived the first world war?

They entered the world war after a revolution, with growing arab nationalism, backwarded economy, debts, dependency on european power and incredeable corruption. They'd collapse anyway.

 

[Kennelly]

They couldn't survive WW 1.But if they hadn't entered it,probably French and British would have tried to hold it together rather than supporting Arab nationalism.As long as the oil had been accessible I think the Allies would have supported every government-and preferred a central one rather than a dozen.Plus it could have been a not to underestimate factor for the western Europeans against the Soviets,i.e. in Persia or Caucasus.

 

[G-Man]

Still, I doubt western support would've helped it much. Arab nationalism was already existing before the war, and so was zionism, Serbian expansion attempts and all the other things that made them such an easy prey for the Brits.

 

[Heffalump]

The Ottoman empire was a sick, old beast that lingered on long past it's time.

European powers helped sustain it ... partly out of fear that if they didn't then valuable lands would fall to another power that was far more dangerous than the hapless Ottomans. The Russians & Brits played this interesting chess match.

The Ottoman empire was hugely lucky just to make it to WWI....

 

[ArmOrAttAk]

How did the rain kill 75% of his camels?

 

[cameramano]

Even if the Ottomans had taken Vienna, they would have lost it shortly thereafter. The Empire was slowly losing relative superiority. European technology was getting better. The Ottomans still had a highly trained elite corp of soldiers, but they could not deal with large professional armies with the latest in arms.

Political reasons (the Janissaries had major political power) caused this to happen. Also, as the empire grew older, it corrupted the way leaders were picked. The new order all but assured a weak Sultan and Viziers.

 

[Yoda Power]

Originally posted by Admiral Super
What if they had survived the first world war?

I know this has been answered before, but in the early twenties a revolution would have took place, the french and english would take the arab part of the empire to secure the oil. The sultan would have to abdicize, and Ataturk would became president. So it really playd no big role.

 

[LionQ]

Originally posted by FlakJacket
In honour of them making it into PTW, and plus the fact that I'm interested in them, I have a What if... question about the Ottoman empire.

What do people think the consequences might have been if the rains had held off long enough for Suleyman to bring his heavy canons up and hadn't killed off 75% of his camels carrying the supplies, he was able to break the seige of Vienna and take the city in 1529?

If he had took over the city, 7 months later Charles V of the German Reich would have took it back.

 

[jeriko one]

One of the main reasons of the demise is the Suleyman the Magnificent`s expenditure on war. Historians in Turkey argue that Sultan Selim(Suleyman`s father) brought economic stability because he conquered Egypt and Ottomans flourished with the booty from Egypt. But Suleyman spend it all on conquests. 35 years of war with both Iran and Europe was not a good thing for the economy.

The second reason is the change in spectrum. Science was an important thing until 1.Vienna Siege but after that Sultans respected the silly suggestions of science advisor. These advisors were mainly mullahs, imams and people who do not even read any philosophy or other sciences. They acted according to Kur`an
and they changed It too. The catchphrase was "It is the work of a devil" or "heathens". We are the people who brought mass artillery in siege warfare look what we have become it is a shame I think.

And also Ottomans were lucky to make it to WWI. Germany protected them. But they did it for their own interests of course.

 

[LionQ]

Indeed of course. If Germany was so succesfull as in the WWII in the WWI, then they had conquered Turkey too. Indeed they were lucky to make it to WWI. If the WWI was a few years later, the Ottoman Empire didn't exist anymore, because every state would have become their one nationalistic state, preparing for the War.....