P666-04 : Yet Another Trash Game

[vra379971]

I'm back from Montreal!

Now..to vote.

 

[cabert]

I assumed that since the deadline was passed that it was too late. Plus posting a one line statement is much faster than playing a whole round

just a little picking, I didn't really expect you to play this round at this time
But I must say that I don't like the easy skipping too much, and hope to have more saves to choose from in the next rounds.

I think we'll leave it there ... far too much waiting already.

OK - votes to Öjevind then. If you're able to do so promptly, that would be great. Hopefully all the votes are in within 24 hours.

done for me
hard to choose...

 

[Cabledawg]

Are all the votes in yet?

 

[Öjevind Lång]

Are all the votes in yet?

No, I am still waiting to hear from one participant. I don't think we should wait much longer, though.

 

[Öjevind Lång]

I did some reading further back in the thread and found the following statement by Cam. "The 'Get your games in by Saturday morning and we'll get the voting done by Sunday night' worked well in P666-01 and P666-02 and I'm not sure why we are getting so many late entries and late voters in this game." Those are the rules, and it can't possibly still be Sunday night anywhere on the planet. Accordingly, I have decided to announce the result. The decision was fairly easy to make since we already have a winner, and the voting from the last participant won't change anything.

The winner is Cabledawg. I would certainly not compare his contribution to my catastrophic "winner" a while ago, but let me say that he has my sympathy. Joining a game and entering into the spirit of it, becoming familiar with the nuts and bolts of it, so to speak, isn't easy.


This is the save we will play now:

http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/61698/P666-04_AD-1400-Cabledawg.CivWarlordsSave

 

[Cabledawg]

I dont feel bad with you guys picking my save at all. Wasnt alot I could do with Qin's stack right there on that jungle hill all round.
The good news is....its not that bad. I had the second highest score. The most beakers at 390ish vs the next closest at 290ish. I have all the prereqs for taking Astronomy with Lib. I have a Great Scientist that can bulb all but 1 turn of Printing Press. All cities have courthouses or are close except for one on the east coast. Seoul is 7 turns from another great person. Prolly another Scientist.

So, 2 turns after you start my save, you can have Astronomy and Printing Press and be completely caught up in techs after some trades. We...as a team need to discuss if we really want Astronomy, Gunpowder, or Nationalism. Astro is the most expensive tech, then Nationalism....Genghis and mao allready have it though. We could take Gunpowder with Lib and because I have all the prereqs for Chemistry, we can have it in 5 or 6 turns and whip up on Qin with some grennys.

Qins stack is still there, so can we discuss how we want to dislodge him and what direction we want to take with lib....and how to use the Great Scientist we have and the one coming up in 7 turns.

 

[pigswill]

Despite the lack of conquest Cabledawg's save is looking good. Liberalism is safe; interesting choices re what to take from it. Its worth noticing that GK is only one tech from cavalry. Fortunately he doesn't hate us at the moment.
Nice stack available for war whenever required. It's looking likely that we'll all make significant progress in the next fourty turns.

Edit: Cabledawg posted while I was busy typing away. My thought would be to aim to research guilds and gunpowder and use liberalism for chemistry with the proviso that we need to keep an eye on either GK or KK getting education (easy to check, it will no longer be available as a trade).

 

[Cabledawg]

That seems risky pigswill. We can allways trade for Guilds. We could have Grennys rolling off in 8 turns or so and stop resrearch for a lil bit after Chemistry and upgrade those CR Macemen.

 

[Öjevind Lång]

There are also diplomatic issues to consider. How about bribing Genghis Khan into attacking Qin? We could then join in on our own or wait for a request from him to do so. I do think Qin is the logical next target, and no one else will get that upset if we attack him. (Well, maybe Asoka, but he doesn't matter.) After Qin, we should try to take out Kublai Khan. He is often underesteimated; the fact is that he is awfully good at trading technologies and getting ahead. He is already disturbingly powerful.
I like the idea of getting grenadiers.

 

[Endzz]

my computer is infected by trojans, we have not yet got all of em deleted.
to prevent further losses i will not use the computer, in other words play until then, so I will skip my turns/voting until I am back.
i don't know when will i be back.

 

[cabert]

astronomy is of little value on this LAND MAP!!!!
take whatever tech you want, but please be aware that we want to conquer our neighbours, including runaway GK.

There are also diplomatic issues to consider. How about bribing Genghis Khan into attacking Qin? We could then join in on our own or wait for a request from him to do so. I do think Qin is the logical next target, and no one else will get that upset if we attack him. (Well, maybe Asoka, but he doesn't matter.) After Qin, we should try to take out Kublai Khan. He is often underesteimated; the fact is that he is awfully good at trading technologies and getting ahead. He is already disturbingly powerful.

the best way to prevent other leaders to run away in tech is to get them involved in a war.
We should aim for permanent world war at this stage.

 

[FeedBack]

Uff. At last I'm able to read here again. Well, let's say I got busted at work... I cannot check the forums as I often checked. So, expect a little less conversation from myself until the network guys forget about it.... Sorry.

About the game, as I told Ojevind, I voted only with the reports I read. I got home too late to open the games. I'll take a look at Cabledawg's save tomorrow and maybe post some thoughts before playing wednesday. In a blind guess, I think we may indeed be able to get chemistry. It only depends on how many turns we are away from gunpowder. Guilds is not that necessary now. We can even risk two or three turns by the time anyone gets Education. Liberalism is not that cheap tech, even for the AI, and it almost never research it right after Education. After Chemistry, it's Steel right away. With cannons we will trample Qin and Asoka in no time.

Well, see you guys tomorrow!

 

[Cabledawg]

what year are we stopping at?

 

[Cam_H]

^ 1650AD.

Sorry - I've not caught up with this thread yet - work's become v. busy all of a sudden!

I have empathy with Cabledawg's game in that it was similar to mine, leveraging the unique building and about to launch into Liberalism is a strength, but other games showed the power of ongoing conflict. We're well set up for Industrial Age warfare, although Genghis is seemingly in a strong place too.

fbelintani gets exemption from this upcoming round and will act as Returning Officer.

 

[cabert]

I have empathy with Cabledawg's game in that it was similar to mine, leveraging the unique building and about to launch into Liberalism is a strength, but other games showed the power of ongoing conflict. We're well set up for Industrial Age warfare, although Genghis is seemingly in a strong place too.

going for liberalism was clearly a good move
being passive in the conquest game not so
I must say I had a very hard time deciding which game to vote for .
Anyway we're in a good position for war and for trade (having some monoply techs). So it's really not a bad game.
I'm just getting a bit nervous about our goal : only 1 neighbour down at 1400AD is not enough.
I expect us all to take risks in order to get a few more down (or at least weaker).

 

[futurehermit]

We have horses and first to liberalism. Let us go to CAVALRY--i.e., take nationalism from liberalism, self-research gunpowder/music/miltrad--DO NOT TRADE THESE TECHS AWAY OR PRINTING PRESS (PP is prereq for rifles which are only counter to cav!)

 

[Cabledawg]

My game up to 1650. Didnt have time for pics. Just a quick report.

Spoiler :

I started out by bulbing partial Printing Press and researching the rest which would help our economy out.

I wanted to try to get Military Tradition from Liberalism. All I need is Music and Nationalism. I got Guilds and Music for Printing Press and money through a few civs which allowed me to keep the slider high.

I researched Nationalism and did indeed take Mil Tradition just after Qin declared on me. Right after i got Nationalism, I popped a Great Engineer....suhweet. Built the Taj in 1 turn and started pumping out units after a quick switch to Theology.

I popped a General soon after Qin declared and used him for an Mil academy in Pyongyang. I took out most of Qins cities easily. During the war, Asoka uncapitulated from Kublai...so theres my next target. Qin had 2 more cities...1 was way on the other side of the map. So, I capitulated Qin and in the deal, I took that other city as well. Reason is, the maintenance would kill him and he couldnt defend it anyway in a war with Asoka. So, Ill go to war with Asoka asap and he will take that city. I also built another Mil Academy in Tokyo.

I shuffled some units around and went to war with Asoka. Took 3 cities quickly and he capitulated as well.

During this time, I built Forbidden palace in Osaka. Whipped courthouses and libraries in new cities. Built some missionaries for new cities. Made sure to keep building money buildings and science in capitol. I started West Point in Pyonyang due in 16 turns i think.

I still have 2 Scientist sitting around and another General. Kyoto needs an academy. The group can discuss what to do with the other General but we need another medic 3. I didnt lose the first one, but I have 2 nice stacks ready to attack Kublai and it would be nice to have another medic 3. Our power is above him, so it should be easy. We are #1 in score and doing well.

As for research...well. I researched up to Democracy. After Osaka gets its forge(2 turns). It can start the SOL. I didnt get Steel, but Im like 3 turns away and we can turn off research for a few turns to upgrade those Trebs to cannons, then attack Kublai.

The save had 9 cities...I ended up with 19...good science, great production, great power

http://www.deadzoom.com/member/yoohoo3131/P666-04CabledawgAD-1650.CivWarlordsSave

 

[FeedBack]

I won't read it... I won't read it... I won't read it...

Well, I just took a look at the save. Definetily, it's possible to get Chemistry from Lib. The only thing needed to do is to get some cash for 1 more turn of research. We can sell Philo for 110 gold. After we get Gunpowder, we can sell education around (somebody has 410 gold to spare) to fund the last turn of Lib. Then, its time to build a lot of grennies. I can tell it will be tough to take Qin at this moment. The SoD will be history in no time with 13 (yes, THIRTEEN) hwachas to trample them. After that, we may have to ask Kublai for help. Don't forget to let some newly built grennies around to defend our improvements.
I'll play tomorrow.

I won't read it... I won't read it... I won't read it...

 

[futurehermit]

grenadiers would work as well...not as strong as cav, but getting them sooner is certainly a bonus. plus they're protective grenadiers, which is a good thing...

 

[cabert]

I played up to 1540

Spoiler :

Qin is my vassal,
I have cavalry,
I have a large number of drafted macemen,
GK, KK, Asoka are at war with Mao,
I'm researching chemistry and asked Qin to research PP.
I got banking in qin's capitulation.

Next step : Asoka+KK (I'm just waiting for their troops to be on the other side of the map )