PC Gamer BTS preview

[Lucky The Fox]

they said that corporations are going to be like religions, it could mean that the founder of a corporation is the first one to research a specific tech (¿Ecology for the standard Ethanol?). This would mean that the advantage of a corporation are limited to some players like that of religion. If you don´t share that religion or corporation you don`t gain the benefits of it.

Drat, never thought about that. Really changes things and is logical enough to be happen.

 

[Chemtech]

Well, perhaps I was a bit premature in my criticism. I forgot that this is only available to one civ, and chances are the civ that gets it will probably have oil. So it doesn't have to be a game breaker.

Crispy mentioned something that really caught my attention: resource ratios. This looks like the very first step toward QUANTITATIVE RESOURCES (here I go again on another tangent) which is sorely needed for Civilization. That sounds like the best option for ethanol, and is much more realistic. Needing 2 corn to make 1 "oil" would balance things out nicely, given corn's relative abundance and oil's scarcity in the game. That way they wouldn't have to change the existing balance and it all works out in the end.

[Post 700]

This makes me wonder if they will ever move to a system where not all resources of a given type are equal - in other words a "corn" might be "abundant", "average" or "sparse" - with either a 25% bonus/penalty for being above of below average - if they allowed either fractional food OR moved away from integers for everthing to more of a base 100 system. Basically multiply everything as it stands now by 100 - which allows things worth 125 or 75 without having to deal with fractions. Although I am not sure which is more confusing to people, fractions or not using whole numbers less than 30.

A system like this would also allow for technologies/units which could improve a resource rating - fertilizer etc etc.

 

[Nordiska]

I've always thought it would be interesting if resources produced fixed amounts and units required certain amount of a resource. For example an iron mine produces 10 a turn but to build a swordman costs 20 iron. So the solution would be to get more mines or have to build other units... more variety. This would also open up trade as instead of just trading "iron" you could trade 125 iron for 200 gold for a one time deal. Of course doing this to all the resources.

 

[Chemtech]

I'm torn on if I'd like a system like this - it basically would require you to "bank" all resources - which is fine, but it really turns Civ into a different type of game - games I've played before. Don't get me wrong, I've enjoyed them but it makes me think of "Settlers" where there were like 30 things to worry about...

Some of the things it would change would be the ability to disrupt another Civ's production by capturing/destroying their only iron mine - I mean if theyve been banking iron for 1500 years it probably doesnt matter if they dont have an iron mine anymore.

 

[Ken the Great]

really disappoints me that civ 4 artillery can't bombard anything.. any unit with bombardment should be able to bombard anything.. like in civ 3..

but that's just me

 

[Luckystrike77]

really disappoints me that civ 4 artillery can't bombard anything.. any unit with bombardment should be able to bombard anything.. like in civ 3..

but that's just me

I really do agree in that one, but that what happens when online multiplayer is prioritized over the single player game. I guess they wanted siege weapons to be less time consuming.....

I do hope they can bring back the old bombardment system from CIV 3 for modern navy units at least. Battleships being able to shot at other ships from a distance is cool, and not too time consuming in the big picture..... I'd also like to see ships firing missiles on eachother, and nuclear submarines.....

 

[Martinus]

I think you guys are missing the point of Civ4 - it is not a RTS or a tactical game, but a strategy game, with a high level of abstraction. One tile often represents many hundreds of miles. A modern era ship attacking another ship on the adjacent tile really represents firing missiles and whatnot - not a deck-to-deck engagement.

 

[Luckystrike77]

I think you guys are missing the point of Civ4 - it is not a RTS or a tactical game, but a strategy game, with a high level of abstraction. One tile often represents many hundreds of miles. A modern era ship attacking another ship on the adjacent tile really represents firing missiles and whatnot - not a deck-to-deck engagement.

Well, I think that bombardment between sea units is a better abstraction (thinking of the huge distances), and a funnier way to play, it also opens for more tactics in the naval battles, not just a big clash..... A little portion of tactics can't hurt a strategy game, if done in the right manner.....

 

[cbmclean]

Martinus,

You've got a good point about General Mills. I had forgotten that food resources only gave food bonuses to the city that actually worked it, and that ll connected cities jut got a health bonus. I can see where that might come in useful now.

In your post, you said

In fact, this seems like a middle-ground implementation of the feature I always wanted to see in Civ - i.e. being able to "move" stuff like food or hammers between your cities.

I don't know if you ever played Civ II, but one the goods you could send from city to city using caravans was food. Thus you could transfer food from cities with food surpluses to those that you wanted to increase the food supply. I liked that feature and I missed it in Civ 3 and 4.

 

[Martinus]

Yeah, the caravan thing was cool.

 

[Chemtech]

Yeah, that of course led to the giant stack of shield (Civ 2 hammer equivalent) convoys and the "instant wonder"... god I loved it so!

 

[Sir K]

Are you going to be able to send distress messages to other civs?or are they only going to be able to ask you. could be a strategic move to slow down and distract a quickly developing, more powerful civ. and another way to get warmongers like montezuma to attack someone.

 

[chaz1356]

Can you become a vassal state in the expansion? I know it seems so humiliating but the fun part is breaking out in rebellion and earning your freedom then kicking the crap outa the host nation.

 

[Gaius Octavius]

This makes me wonder if they will ever move to a system where not all resources of a given type are equal - in other words a "corn" might be "abundant", "average" or "sparse" - with either a 25% bonus/penalty for being above of below average - if they allowed either fractional food OR moved away from integers for everthing to more of a base 100 system. Basically multiply everything as it stands now by 100 - which allows things worth 125 or 75 without having to deal with fractions. Although I am not sure which is more confusing to people, fractions or not using whole numbers less than 30.

A system like this would also allow for technologies/units which could improve a resource rating - fertilizer etc etc.

I've always thought it would be interesting if resources produced fixed amounts and units required certain amount of a resource. For example an iron mine produces 10 a turn but to build a swordman costs 20 iron. So the solution would be to get more mines or have to build other units... more variety. This would also open up trade as instead of just trading "iron" you could trade 125 iron for 200 gold for a one time deal. Of course doing this to all the resources.

I'm torn on if I'd like a system like this - it basically would require you to "bank" all resources - which is fine, but it really turns Civ into a different type of game - games I've played before. Don't get me wrong, I've enjoyed them but it makes me think of "Settlers" where there were like 30 things to worry about...

Some of the things it would change would be the ability to disrupt another Civ's production by capturing/destroying their only iron mine - I mean if theyve been banking iron for 1500 years it probably doesnt matter if they dont have an iron mine anymore.

If you guys are really interested in this, you should join the discussion on the quantitative resources page in Creation and Customization I started. We're in the process of working out the details for a new mod as we speak, and most of the problems you mentioned have reasonable solutions.

</EndShamelessModPlug>

Can you become a vassal state in the expansion? I know it seems so humiliating but the fun part is breaking out in rebellion and earning your freedom then kicking the crap outa the host nation.

No, but there is a mod that lets you do this now.

Tip of the day: visit other Civ 4 forums here!

 

[icemanjsg]

BTS will not be worth the cd/dvds they are printed on if airplanes still can't kill other units,I suspect the worst.

This is actually a terrible thing, my friends and I have all taken a week of work to have a massive LAN and this grinds everyones gears!

 

[TheLastOne36]

Gaius Octavius here's your load: http://pc.ign.com/articles/791/791168p2.html

Standerd oil company consumes Corn, sugar or rice to make oil.

 

[Gaius Octavius]

So basically they've adopted TheLopez's building resource converter mod. Okay, this is what I thought. Looks good, but apparently there's more than one corporation, as evidenced by the "Aluminum Corp." Good grief, I hope they haven't given us one for every critical late-game strategic resource... what's the point then?

 

[Marshall Thomas]

My guess is that high-powered artillery is an advantage that regular artillery can have to distinguish it from the new mobile artillery, -for game balance. I doubt that mobile artillery can also be high-powered.

 

[cbmclean]

I don't know if you guys have read the new article about BTS, but I am absolutely pumped about this expansion! Did you notice the bit about on-map ocean trade routes? This is something I've always wanted in a Civ game. Call-to-Power had soemthing like it, and I loved that feature of that game.

 

[dutchking]

All this stuff with Corporations and Espionage is confusing to me...so much in one game...