PH17: pholkhero and the Holy Grail
- Thread starter pholkhero
- Start date
Well, that if any religion we better take buddhism. But for now keep neutral for a while, let the AIs hate eachother. Wouldn't change any open border setting yet.
mc-red
King
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It was a struggle trying to get to aesthetics and its not in. I have ended up starving cities to run only cottages and scientists.
The builds are deliberately being done slowly because I don't want upkeep costs.
Qin has a great spy don't know what he did with it.
KK is a Budhist now.
We have nothing much to build so I started a settler in the capitol.
I stopped here in case someone wants to do something different with the tile assignments but by definition the payoff from cottages takes time.
The builds are deliberately being done slowly because I don't want upkeep costs.
Qin has a great spy don't know what he did with it.
KK is a Budhist now.
We have nothing much to build so I started a settler in the capitol.
I stopped here in case someone wants to do something different with the tile assignments but by definition the payoff from cottages takes time.
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Well, let's see if aesthetics gives us the life line we so desperately need... I guess it will be in in 5 or 6 turns, we should at least try to get alpha and IW out of it, we may have to research a bit of alpha first though. Let's forget about hoping for literature and GL, guess we'll never make that, so no need to sit on aesthetics.
And KK in red fist mode! Hopefully he's eyeing his worst enemy Izzy, if it's us, well, we can prepare for a re-roll!
And KK in red fist mode! Hopefully he's eyeing his worst enemy Izzy, if it's us, well, we can prepare for a re-roll!
pholkhero
Deviant Mind
good turns all, but hopefully Kublai will be going after Izzy. Do the AIs really scout your land and sell it? i had always thought that applied to MP games, but ya never know.
i would be more concerned he was scouting it for himself, which still argues to NOT let him in. however, OB get us +1 after some time, too...might be nice to counter the "border crowding" mallus we get.
maybe if you want to post the tech screen when Aesthetics comes in we can all chime in, Tally??
i would be more concerned he was scouting it for himself, which still argues to NOT let him in. however, OB get us +1 after some time, too...might be nice to counter the "border crowding" mallus we get.
maybe if you want to post the tech screen when Aesthetics comes in we can all chime in, Tally??
I am at turn 6, and will polish and complete later. Here's the deal on the deals.
From my notes:
turn 128 - 800BC
pulled archer back into borders near Rostov. no change in eco.
want an archer for st pete. Ran our chariots around checking out the barb city near SW of Moscow.
turn 134 - 650BC - We get aesthetics, and can trade math straight up with QSH, he is pleased. he will trade masonry (we can get that in 3 turns @ 20%) fishing and meditation for it as well, but math would take us 13 turns @ 20%. We would need alpha to trade with anyone else. He won't trade alpha for aesthetics. He will trade it around next turn and maybe we can get alpha from someone about to get it. Our considerations for discussion include:
1) Construction needs masonry, so we could tech masonry ourselves, trade math for aesthetics. I am about to put beakers into masonry.
2) We could hang onto aesthetics and try to build the ToZ since we have an ivory monopoly, but i say we need a strong (and unique) unit, and i think ToZ needs poly.
3) QSH and KK are both buddhist. Did KK found Buddhism? No OB with KK, so it's conjecture. QSH has meditation, so he could build some missionaries. But the AI that has the shrine is the one most likely to do so.
4) KK is worst enemy of Isabella, so i think it's a shrine shootout.
From my notes:
turn 128 - 800BC
pulled archer back into borders near Rostov. no change in eco.
want an archer for st pete. Ran our chariots around checking out the barb city near SW of Moscow.
turn 134 - 650BC - We get aesthetics, and can trade math straight up with QSH, he is pleased. he will trade masonry (we can get that in 3 turns @ 20%) fishing and meditation for it as well, but math would take us 13 turns @ 20%. We would need alpha to trade with anyone else. He won't trade alpha for aesthetics. He will trade it around next turn and maybe we can get alpha from someone about to get it. Our considerations for discussion include:
1) Construction needs masonry, so we could tech masonry ourselves, trade math for aesthetics. I am about to put beakers into masonry.
2) We could hang onto aesthetics and try to build the ToZ since we have an ivory monopoly, but i say we need a strong (and unique) unit, and i think ToZ needs poly.
3) QSH and KK are both buddhist. Did KK found Buddhism? No OB with KK, so it's conjecture. QSH has meditation, so he could build some missionaries. But the AI that has the shrine is the one most likely to do so.
4) KK is worst enemy of Isabella, so i think it's a shrine shootout.
I'd switch research to alpha and keep on researching it until Qin is willing to trade it for Aesthetics. At that point we can trade aesthetics AND alpha to the rest of the AIs for useful stuff like IW, math, masonry and whatever else they want to toss in.
mc-red
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HC and KK are really into hate mode with Izzy, so we should avoid trades or OB with her. So if Izzy founded Buddhism, why did she adopt Judaism? Go figure. Her preferred religion is Christianity, so i suppose it's along the way.
I think math is a good trade on our way to warphants. I will pull the trigger on it unless i hear otherwise from the group. I will wait a reasonable period of time before finishing my turn set for the group to respond.
We should be able to trade something for HBR (though my experience has been that the AI is reluctant on it for some reason), and then all we have to do is construction.
I think math is a good trade on our way to warphants. I will pull the trigger on it unless i hear otherwise from the group. I will wait a reasonable period of time before finishing my turn set for the group to respond.
We should be able to trade something for HBR (though my experience has been that the AI is reluctant on it for some reason), and then all we have to do is construction.
mc-red
King
- Joined
- Dec 2, 2007
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- 967
@Talamane I normally would hold out for alpha and the chance for a bunch of trades.
High level players though always recommend singleminded focus on the goal. Here that being elephant/cat rush. So I see your point.
Even so I think getting a chance at alpha+some techs here would really offset the delay to getting our war plans executed.
High level players though always recommend singleminded focus on the goal. Here that being elephant/cat rush. So I see your point.
Even so I think getting a chance at alpha+some techs here would really offset the delay to getting our war plans executed.
I would put it more strongly: going alpha will probably get our war plans executed sooner and with a more solid tech base to boot!
136 started SoZ in Novgorod. Hoping that QSH will build it first (industrious), but we have ivory. Not sure if hooking up all the ivory was such a good idea, we may get a demand. Trying to build SoZ without a forge is ridiculous of course, but we need the cash. Moscow's queue is already full of stuff and Nov is our best hammer city. Nov archer built goes to St Pete to replace reinforce warrior.
137 Liebniz builds an academy, of course. Tough call, he could bulb math/alphabet, but i think the reduction in beakers with the academy will push the alpha/aesthetics deal with QSH through. alpha in 14 @ 30% before academy. HC builds TGL. Are there water tiles of any significance on this map? LOL.
alpha in 10 @ 30% after academy! Sign OB with KK. We may get a demand from Izzy, but i think it's a moot point. We need the diplo gains with a potent neighbor more than one faraway who is hated by him and others. Now some deals. I did the best i could, but i am a newb.
With QSH, aesthetics for alphabet.
Before aesthetics gets stale, trade iron working and masonry for aesthetics from HC, set tech on math.
138 We have iron near Rostov, good call on that city location! HC wants OB, uh no. I want buddhism, not hinduism. Micro (remove a geek) St Pete to keep it from shrinking. We should try to toggle it every turn if we can.
With one turn on math, trade alpha for math with KK, set tech on HBR in 11
144 - KK and QSH declare on Izzy.
145 - 425BC I stop here since either QSH or KK will ask us to join in their fight against Izzy in a few turns--she is getting big. A DoW would put us way back on HBR and construction since we have so many geeks working--we have no production for units. If KK asks us to join, turning him down puts him in a bad mood. Currency and more happy faces would be needed to afford more units.
Since HC is big on religion, i don't see us surviving his axes if we adopt buddhism until we have phants or at least cats and then we take it to him. Izzy may bribe him into war with QSH and KK, but i doubt it. I cannot see a way around this diplo dilemma. QSH founded and adopted Confucianism on this last or previous turn to further muddy the water.
No barb raids at all, no barbs in our borders. One of the pluses of being neighbors with immortal AIs i suppose.
We can now build swords, axes, and in two turns, horse archers. We could found a trash city to the south and grab some furs, btw. HC has construction and needs alpha, but won't trade. Once we have some turns in on construction, that may change. Since he doesn't have anything that QSH or KK wants, we should keep an eye on that one. QSH and KK have both construction and HBR, but won't trade. KK might trade aesthetics for construction, once we have some turns put into it, just like HC.
137 Liebniz builds an academy, of course. Tough call, he could bulb math/alphabet, but i think the reduction in beakers with the academy will push the alpha/aesthetics deal with QSH through. alpha in 14 @ 30% before academy. HC builds TGL. Are there water tiles of any significance on this map? LOL.
alpha in 10 @ 30% after academy! Sign OB with KK. We may get a demand from Izzy, but i think it's a moot point. We need the diplo gains with a potent neighbor more than one faraway who is hated by him and others. Now some deals. I did the best i could, but i am a newb.
With QSH, aesthetics for alphabet.
Before aesthetics gets stale, trade iron working and masonry for aesthetics from HC, set tech on math.
138 We have iron near Rostov, good call on that city location! HC wants OB, uh no. I want buddhism, not hinduism. Micro (remove a geek) St Pete to keep it from shrinking. We should try to toggle it every turn if we can.
With one turn on math, trade alpha for math with KK, set tech on HBR in 11
144 - KK and QSH declare on Izzy.
145 - 425BC I stop here since either QSH or KK will ask us to join in their fight against Izzy in a few turns--she is getting big. A DoW would put us way back on HBR and construction since we have so many geeks working--we have no production for units. If KK asks us to join, turning him down puts him in a bad mood. Currency and more happy faces would be needed to afford more units.
Since HC is big on religion, i don't see us surviving his axes if we adopt buddhism until we have phants or at least cats and then we take it to him. Izzy may bribe him into war with QSH and KK, but i doubt it. I cannot see a way around this diplo dilemma. QSH founded and adopted Confucianism on this last or previous turn to further muddy the water.
No barb raids at all, no barbs in our borders. One of the pluses of being neighbors with immortal AIs i suppose.
We can now build swords, axes, and in two turns, horse archers. We could found a trash city to the south and grab some furs, btw. HC has construction and needs alpha, but won't trade. Once we have some turns in on construction, that may change. Since he doesn't have anything that QSH or KK wants, we should keep an eye on that one. QSH and KK have both construction and HBR, but won't trade. KK might trade aesthetics for construction, once we have some turns put into it, just like HC.
Not looking bad! 
Indeed if we are asked to join the war against Izzy we migth formally give in to that, we're not running too much risk.
Techwise, finish HBR of course and get those stables out. I think we could really use monarchy in order to grow more. Unfortunately we'll first need meditation (or poly) and priesthood, maybe we should research those next (will not take too long and so as not to run into WFYABTA considerations unnecessarily) and then hope we can trade for monarchy. Meanwhile also keep an eye on construction if it pops up as a trade opportunity.
While Novgorod has nothing better to build it can continue with SoZ, but once we can build stables I'd definitely squeeze that in if we're basically hoping for wonder-fail money. I'd also fire those scientists in Novgo after a GS is popped in 5 turns and max it out on production. I'm also wondering if it's optimal to maintain all scientists in St Pete and Moscow, especially when we can start building useful stuff (stables, better military).
Indeed if we are asked to join the war against Izzy we migth formally give in to that, we're not running too much risk.
Techwise, finish HBR of course and get those stables out. I think we could really use monarchy in order to grow more. Unfortunately we'll first need meditation (or poly) and priesthood, maybe we should research those next (will not take too long and so as not to run into WFYABTA considerations unnecessarily) and then hope we can trade for monarchy. Meanwhile also keep an eye on construction if it pops up as a trade opportunity.
While Novgorod has nothing better to build it can continue with SoZ, but once we can build stables I'd definitely squeeze that in if we're basically hoping for wonder-fail money. I'd also fire those scientists in Novgo after a GS is popped in 5 turns and max it out on production. I'm also wondering if it's optimal to maintain all scientists in St Pete and Moscow, especially when we can start building useful stuff (stables, better military).
pholkhero
Deviant Mind
good turns Tally and sorry i missed all the discussion ~ for the record, we are playing with no set turn lengths, just until a "suitable stopping point" so what you did was fine.
i like the plan for the near-future, and i'm up next so this is the official got it. any other advice to add to nocho's sagacious words??
roster:
pholkhero >> UP NOW and has it
fox >> on deck?
nocho
mc red
talamane >> just played
ozbenno >> skipped for the near-term
i like the plan for the near-future, and i'm up next so this is the official got it. any other advice to add to nocho's sagacious words??
roster:
pholkhero >> UP NOW and has it
fox >> on deck?
nocho
mc red
talamane >> just played
ozbenno >> skipped for the near-term
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