Pole Shifts, the effects on civilization?

[Shadylookin]

i have to wonder how the earth is top heavy. isn't it weightless since it hangs out in outerspace(like astronauts in outerspace that float around in their ship) Though i have heard that the magnetic poles will shift though i have no idea how creditable that is

 

[stormbind]

No, but "weight" is very different from the perspective of Earth

The force dragging it down is the Sun, but other planets also apply a force which increase/decrease it's relative "weight".

If 2+ giants (i.e. saturn + jupiter) lined up behind earth then they would apply a large force to pull it the other way: resulting in reduced weight (overall).

The sun is always down though, if it wasn't we would fly off into space and suffer a terrible fate

As I see it, the only force that could flip the earth using gravity without destroying it's orbit would have to be increased weight from lining up the planets in the direction of the sun (they can be behind the sun). It's technically possible but I don't know if it ever happens, I'm not an astronomer.

Not too much force though, or you could have a very different catastrophe.

Afaik, using gravity is what Einstein postulated. One certainly hopes the gravitational forces applied never come anywhere near to achieving that

Just thinking about it is enough to give me the willies

 

[Perfection]

Originally posted by stormbind
It wouldn't do a lot to the rotation because it's only applying a force, which meets resistance... so there is change but it's slow (from our perspective) but fast (geological perspective).

Conservation of angular momementum, it would change the same no matter how fast or slow.

Originally posted by stormbind
And yes, the magnetic particles all flip over but many permanent/resistant magnetic materials are being push/pulled in one direction at the moment and when it flips; they will be push/pulled in the opposite direction and surely across the whole world that's going to create a big push inside the planet?

Not really, because the push pulls for the most part cancel each other out.

Also the earth is not "top heavy" there's a bulge at the eqauter.

 

[stormbind]

Originally posted by CurtSibling
@stormbind:

The bible was written by men who did not even know why rain fell or clouds formed.

Hence, it is anything but scientific - it is a codex of primitive men.

I felt obliged to point out your fallacy.

I wasn't about to use it as physics text book

What I meant was, the stories may desribe what witnesses really did see.

Rising waters. Continuous rain. Aurora effects in the sky. Extended length of days/nights... all plausible effects if the crust was to slip - wouldn't you say?

 

[stormbind]

Originally posted by Perfection
Conservation of angular momementum, it would change the same no matter how fast or slow.

I already mentioned this. I said that the momentum of the crust (which is not affected), when the velocity of the core changes, would result in resistance. Thus momentum is precisely what I was thinking about

Not really, because the push pulls for the most part cancel each other out.

I'm not sure I agree. Can you give an anology?

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The British Geographical Society says "Indeed projecting this forward in time would suggest zero dipole moment in about 1500-1600 years time." which puts some serious doubt on the estimations that a field reversal would be in the next decade. Having said that, the mathematical model may be complicated than meets the eye. *shrug*

 

[Sultan Bhargash]

Did y'all ever realize that though a day is 24 hours long whether you are near the pole or at the equator, people at the equator are spun a much greater distance in that time than people near the pole, and thus if time and space are relative you could say that time goes faster at the equator?

 

[stormbind]

Did you know that the magnetic force in Roman times was twice as strong as it is today? (Probably as I got that from one of the links referenced in this thread)

Did you know that the Bermuda Triangle has lower magnetic force than other regions!

What would cause that? -- seriously

As the magnetic power continues to drop, will other "low power" pockets appear all over the Earth?

 

[Perfection]

Originally posted by stormbind
I already mentioned this. I said that the momentum of the crust (which is not affected), when the velocity of the core changes, would result in resistance. Thus momentum is precisely what I was thinking about

Well if the momentum of the core changes one way without a counterbalances change in either planatary rotation or orbit, then how can it be conserved.? Resistance cannot account for the missing momentum because the momentum is still changing. The initial momentum = the final, your model does not satisfy this physical requirement.

 

[stormbind]

Originally posted by Perfection
Well if the momentum of the core changes one way without a counterbalances change in either planatary rotation or orbit, then how can it be conserved.? Resistance cannot account for the missing momentum because the momentum is still changing. The initial momentum = the final, your model does not satisfy this physical requirement.

There are two objects with angular momentum - the crust, and the core. The core contains the magnetic material.

If the forces being applied the core change then the velocity of the core changes. Just accept that because to challenge whether or not the force changes is a seperate issue

Unlike the core, the crust is not subjected to the same change in forces. By the law of inertia it just keeps moving in the same direction and ignores whatever the core is doing.

So the core is moving one way, and the crust is moving another.

There is a viscous layer that seperates the core from the crust.

Friction will be applied and this in turn causes the crust to end up moving in the same (new) direction as the core.

If the difference in their respective velocities applies a force greater than the coeficient of friction, then it's going to slip isn't it?

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As for the initial and final rotation being the same, that can be true without ruling out the possibility of an interuption.

Given the above model, immagine if the core stopped moving for a moment and then continued -- it would have the effect of slipping without interfering with the rotation.

 

[Perfection]

Originally posted by stormbind
If the forces being applied the core change then the velocity of the core changes. Just accept that because to challenge whether or not the force changes is a seperate issue

Where do you propose these "forces" come from?

 

[stormbind]

That's the crunch question

Mathematical models show that during the magnetic reversal, there are multiple temporary poles - weird huh?

The question is: Would the velocity of the particles in the core be affected by the changing magnetic forces?

If they were affected, then they would not all be moving in the same direction at the same time (abnormal compared to normal operation) - This would disrupt the velocity/rotation of the core as a whole until they are again syncronised and pointing to just one pole.