I'd like to see what someone suggested in another thread, Roman legion with early corps ability. More interesting gameplaywise than just another combat bonus and a reflection of how well organised and disciplined legions were historically.
I'm sorry, do you have any sources on Legion or Hoplite? I haven't seen any so far.
Besides, I think this thread should be moved to I&S sub-forum for proper discussions.
I'm sorry, do you have any sources on Legion or Hoplite? I haven't seen any so far.
Besides, I think this thread should be moved to I&S sub-forum for proper discussions.
Legion is confirmed in tooltip in the famous leaking stream. It's in Iron Working, so likely to replace Swordsman. No info other than this, although people speculating about it acting as if having Military Engineers attached.
We have no info about Hoplites, but the Sailing tech doesn't have Trireme unit, so either Trireme is not a Galley replacement, or, more likely, it isn't Greece unique unit. So Hoplite is very probable.
Legion is confirmed in tooltip in the famous leaking stream. It's in Iron Working, so likely to replace Swordsman. No info other than this, although people speculating about it acting as if having Military Engineers attached.
We have no info about Hoplites, but the Sailing tech doesn't have Trireme unit, so either Trireme is not a Galley replacement, or, more likely, it isn't Greece unique unit. So Hoplite is very probable.
Legion is confirmed in tooltip in the famous leaking stream. It's in Iron Working, so likely to replace Swordsman. No info other than this, although people speculating about it acting as if having Military Engineers attached.
We have no info about Hoplites, but the Sailing tech doesn't have Trireme unit, so either Trireme is not a Galley replacement, or, more likely, it isn't Greece unique unit. So Hoplite is very probable.
There is no reason why a lack of Trireme at Sailing indicates that there is no Trireme. The Trireme could be at Shipbuilding or any Civic like State Workforce or Early Empire.
A Trireme could work as a replacement for the Quadrireme because it isn't a weaker design, it's just a smaller ship. It is quicker and more maneuverable and happened to be the specialty of Athens.
There is no reason why a lack of Trireme at Sailing indicates that there is no Trireme. The Trireme could be at Shipbuilding or any Civic like State Workforce or Early Empire.
A Trireme could work as a replacement for the Quadrireme because it isn't a weaker design, it's just a smaller ship. It is quicker and more maneuverable and happened to be the specialty of Athens.
Maybe Trireme is a unique unit tied to a city state, maybe Carthage. Another explantion is that the civ who can build Trireme can build it from turn 1 and thus no tech unlock it.
I expect Rome in general to get early corps, similar to Phillip getting early fleets.
As for both units this is what I'd like to see:
Legion:Replaces Swordsman, cover promotion, can build forts and medieval roads, bonus combat strenght the farther you are from your capital.
HopliteReplaces spearman, gains XP from battles faster, combat bonus when adyacent to another Hoplite.
So the Legion would be all about getting them into early corps, and sending them out to conquer while building infraestructure, the combat bonus far from the capital would certainly encourage getting a wide empire, and the legion would help connect it and defend it.
The hoplite would be about getting a very reliable fighting force early on, the extra xp means veteran troops before anyone else, and the bonus to adyacency means you can build a literal phalanx formation and march on steadily against enemy forces, as long as you cover your flanks, facing a hoplite formation should be really hard.
I expect Rome in general to get early corps, similar to Phillip getting early fleets.
As for both units this is what I'd like to see:
Legion:Replaces Swordsman, cover promotion, can build forts and medieval roads, bonus combat strenght the farther you are from your capital.
HopliteReplaces spearman, gains XP from battles faster, combat bonus when adyacent to another Hoplite.
So the Legion would be all about getting them into early corps, and sending them out to conquer while building infraestructure, the combat bonus far from the capital would certainly encourage getting a wide empire, and the legion would help connect it and defend it.
The hoplite would be about getting a very reliable fighting force early on, the extra xp means veteran troops before anyone else, and the bonus to adyacency means you can build a literal phalanx formation and march on steadily against enemy forces, as long as you cover your flanks, facing a hoplite formation should be really hard.
Legions acting as military engineers is fun and flavorful. I like the free ranged defense promotion for the Legion. I mean, Civ VI's equivalent of the Cover promotion is literally named "Tortoise," after a formation the Legions used. I'd also add a big strength bonus on top of everything. I feel like the Legion should be one of the premier UUs in the game. It's the Legion!
Maybe in addition to the adjacency bonus (a nice idea that captures the spirit of the hoplite phalanx), the Greek Hoplite could get a bonus against melee infantry. So it would be a spearman that, in sufficient numbers, could stand up to enemy swordsman and crush the spearmen of other nations. Sounds about right. If they wanted to give them a historical disadvantage, à la the Viking Berserker, a combat penalty when flanked would be interesting. So Hoplites would roll over pretty much anything in a mass, but if they got isolated and surrounded they could be dispatched pretty easily.
I expect Rome in general to get early corps, similar to Phillip getting early fleets.
Legion:Replaces Swordsman, cover promotion, can build forts and medieval roads, bonus combat strenght the farther you are from your capital.
So the Legion would be all about getting them into early corps, and sending them out to conquer while building infraestructure, the combat bonus far from the capital would certainly encourage getting a wide empire, and the legion would help connect it and defend it.
I like the idea of cover promotion for legions and the possibility to build medieval roads. However, I think that the possibility to build forts would be too strong. Forts come with a late Renaissance tech, so getting them in Classical era would be too strong. Also I do not remember that Rome actually built significant forts. What the legion were very good at was that they could march somewhere and build temporary fortifications. So I think that legions should have doubled or tripled bonus when fortified. And a flat increase in combat bonus.
I like the idea of cover promotion for legions and the possibility to build medieval roads. However, I think that the possibility to build forts would be too strong. Forts come with a late Renaissance tech, so getting them in Classical era would be too strong. Also I do not remember that Rome actually built significant forts. What the legion were very good at was that they could march somewhere and build temporary fortifications. So I think that legions should have doubled or tripled bonus when fortified. And a flat increase in combat bonus.
The Romans most definitely built permanent forts- there are many of them all over Germany today. The fact that wherever they went they built temporary forts is to maintain their tactical options wherever they went compared to their main, permanent legionary camps. That's also why the temporary forts had the same layout as each other, and as the home permanent forts. Maybe search on the term castrum instead of fort and you can read more about it.
As far as gameplay, wasnt there an image set about iron age hill forts, castles, renaissance star forts and whatever else showing a progression of fortifications? Hopefully these are similar to the progression of roads and each has different attributes. Then yes, Legions making forts and roads makes sense, even if having this unit do this thing is getting a little repetitive by now.
The Romans most definitely built permanent forts- there are many of them all over Germany today. The fact that wherever they went they built temporary forts is to maintain their tactical options wherever they went compared to their main, permanent legionary camps. That's also why the temporary forts had the same layout as each other, and as the home permanent forts. Maybe search on the term castrum instead of fort and you can read more about it.
As far as gameplay, wasnt there an image set about iron age hill forts, castles, renaissance star forts and whatever else showing a progression of fortifications? Hopefully these are similar to the progression of roads and each has different attributes. Then yes, Legions making forts and roads makes sense, even if having this unit do this thing is getting a little repetitive by now.
Yes I know about castrum. I went too far with my previous post. What I wanted to say is that currently there is known only one fort improvement and that should come with a late Renaissance tech. That would be too much for Rome to build in classical era. If there is a fort progression, that would be awesome and would suite Rome very well and I'm 100% into it.
On the other hand a unique feature of the legion system was their fortification after each day march. This could be easily implemented in the current system I think. Like Legion autofortification at end of turn, or legion always defends at fortification level + 2.
...changed this way for Spain. Maybe they want to avoid leaks of Varu, Bath, Acropolis, Stave Church, Stepwell, Ngao Mbeba, Legion, Viking Lo.... ehh that's too much isn't it
TL;DR if it's really Trireme, you might see Trireme only in the tooltips if you're playing as Greece.
...changed this way for Spain. Maybe they want to avoid leaks of Varu, Bath, Acropolis, Stave Church, Stepwell, Ngao Mbeba, Legion, Viking Lo.... ehh that's too much isn't it
TL;DR if it's really Trireme, you might see Trireme only in the tooltips if you're playing as Greece.
Yes, if they changed the way Tooltips are presented since the last stream. We don't know for sure because they never showed the tooltip for the tech that Unlocks the U Boat. Maybe it would have crossed out the Submarine. We don't know.
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