POLL: strongest civ in civ5

[Kboomch]

I'm proud to be one off the 2 votes for spain. Their UA could be awesome early game. Playing on immortal I have gotten 1000 gold in the first two moves ( both squares off the great barrier reef) thats 2 workrers right off the bat !! Pottery, sailing then buy a trieme which found another 2 wonders within the preceding 30-40 turns another 1000-- this money is HUGH earlly game no matter what stategy you play. The UU conqustador is way above average can settle oversea cities, defend while embarked and ATTACK CITIES WITH NO PEN !! Big difference from knight!! the other UU tercio is so-so -- good against mounted. Try Spain ---run with the bulls--- you'll be glad you did !!!

 

[Muskie]

Voted Greece though my highest score is with Japan. Haven't played with everyone. Mongolia holds little interest for me. Denmark isn't out on the Mac.

Why Greece?

Versatility. If you want you can war even without iron early on. And if the game goes long their city state special power makes them tough to beat diplomatically. I prefer them to Siam. The final kicker? Alexander is one of the worst neighbors, he will attack you and if you hold him off or he is on another continent he can still become a force. If I had to play for all the marbles I'd take Greece.

Arabia, China, and Babylon are personal favourites and I keep trying to do well with the Songhai. Next game I plan to give France another go, as I think they can get an early social policy advantage.

 

[Lyoncet]

Since I don't think anyone's done it yet, I'd like to point out that this poll is essentially meaningless since there's no "I haven't played all of the civs" option.

I'm proud to be one off the 2 votes for spain. Their UA could be awesome early game. Playing on immortal I have gotten 1000 gold in the first two moves ( both squares off the great barrier reef) thats 2 workrers right off the bat !! Pottery, sailing then buy a trieme which found another 2 wonders within the preceding 30-40 turns another 1000-- this money is HUGH earlly game no matter what stategy you play. The UU conqustador is way above average can settle oversea cities, defend while embarked and ATTACK CITIES WITH NO PEN !! Big difference from knight!! the other UU tercio is so-so -- good against mounted. Try Spain ---run with the bulls--- you'll be glad you did !!!

My first two games with Spain were ridiculous: in one I discovered GBR first and settler-spammed my entire continent away from Oda and Suleiman (on emperor). The game was decided by turn 10. The second time I discovered El Dorado and settled Fountain of Youth. Same result.

My problem with Spain is that it's probably the biggest offender of the "sometimes it's excellent, sometimes it's junk" UA. You're going to get bigger payoffs from it when it does work than the others (Germany and Ottomans), but then you can go ten games without finding any wonders until too late and not being able to settle any of them. So you have some of the highest peaks and lowest dips in terms of the ability's usefulness.

However unlike Germany and especially the Ottomans, they have two very solid UUs - even if they lag a bit behind other UUs. Tercios aren't quite Musketeers on their own, but the +vs mounted keeps on promotion and can certainly be valuable, and while Conquistadors aren't quite Mandekalu Cavalry, they're still pre-nerf Knights, which is nothing to scoff at. And I think they still have neutral strength vs. cities after promotions, unlike Mandekalu, which keep their +10% bonus but gain the -33% penalty on upgrading.

And they can found cities if you can't be bothered to build a settler and send them to another continent.

 

[Gallean88]

Reposting from other thread:
I've never understood why post-horsemen patch greece has continued to be ranked so highly. Horsemen and indeed companion cav have become such niche units that I just can't see them being anywhere near as useful as they once were. Companions are better than ordinary horsemen, but not by enough to merit top tier UU status, nor to rank them above far, FAR better UUs like Longbows, Jags, Jannisaries and Conquistadors.

Hoplites suffer from having an extremely small time window in order to be effective, and if you have iron (or your enemy does) they are rendered much less effective. Spearmen in general aren't great, since horses are pretty easy to deal with given that you can catch up to them. I've rarely had the chance to use hoplites as much more than barb police.

The UA is in another vein entirely from these mediocre UUs. Influence degrading at half rate is certainly very impressive, and an excellent ability that isn't too situational. I just don't see it as one that deserves top tier status, however; UAs like those of the Inca, UBs like the Bazaar, and even culture UAs which allow civs to grab patronage policies can all mimic and even outperform the effects of Greece's UA in terms of saving you money. Greece is at very best good tier, but I strongly consider them to be a mid tier civ; Other civs with great UUs but mediocre UAs get the same treatment, so why shouldn't greece, with their good UA and mediocre UUs?

 

[Muskie]

Some of us play on the Mac. So these nerfs haven't necessarily affected us. Secondly I never used the Companion Cavalry much so nerfing them doesn't affect me when I play Greece.

I still think Greece is solid. And in a fair fight can win even on high difficulty levels. I think they are versatile and I really do think Alexander is the worst neighbor to have, worse than Oda Nobunaga, Catherine the Great, Askia, anyone. He is as close to Shaka and Stalin as Civ V has.

Cheers,

 

[Jim Bro]

Voted Greece though my highest score is with Japan. Haven't played with everyone. Mongolia holds little interest for me. Denmark isn't out on the Mac.

Why Greece?

Versatility. If you want you can war even without iron early on. And if the game goes long their city state special power makes them tough to beat diplomatically. I prefer them to Siam. The final kicker? Alexander is one of the worst neighbors, he will attack you and if you hold him off or he is on another continent he can still become a force. If I had to play for all the marbles I'd take Greece.

Arabia, China, and Babylon are personal favourites and I keep trying to do well with the Songhai. Next game I plan to give France another go, as I think they can get an early social policy advantage.

why do you say denmark isn't out for the mac. i have a mac and i could buy them through steam if i wanted to. i didn't cuz i think they are stupid (no drakkars!).

 

[Germnoble]

France, then Russia.

 

[Germnoble]

Babylone.

Say it with me now, Babylon. Emphasis on the non-existent E. I could forgive this if it happened once, but you spelled it that way every time. I can't let that slide. Learn to spell Civ names not just because you should, but to respect the game you love and the historic civlizations that helped shape the world and country you live in. Thanks.

Moderator Action: we really do not appreciate users acting as spelling/grammar police here. Please discuss the content of posts, not whether or not you think someone is spelling correctly.
Please read the forum rules: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=422889

 

[LAnkou]

Say it with me now, Babylon. Emphasis on the non-existent E. I could forgive this if it happened once, but you spelled it that way every time. I can't let that slide. Learn to spell Civ names not just because you should, but to respect the game you love and the historic civlizations that helped shape the world and country you live in. Thanks.

It's written "Babylone" in my version of Civ.
when i look in a book, being a dictionnary, a novel or whatever you may want, it's written "babylone".

even on wikipedia, it's written babylone...
http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Babylone

and i think the best way to respect them would be to spell it in babylonian...

 

[Germnoble]

It's written "Babylone" in my version of Civ.
when i look in a book, being a dictionnary, a novel or whatever you may want, it's written "babylone".

even on wikipedia, it's written babylone...
http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Babylone

and i think the best way to respect them would be to spell it in babylonian...

I've never seen it spelt that way in my life, and I'm 19. What country are you from? France? Yea, I see the fr. in the wiki link. Well you spelt every other civ right far as I could tell. Strange.

Moderator Action: Best not to continue this line, especially after you've been warned about it.
Please read the forum rules: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=422889

OT: I've felt I get off to great starts with egypt, but it just slows down too much when culture costs go up, and being Egypt you'll be going for a lot of culture. Any other Civs have similar issues?

 

[LAnkou]

well, the other civs have either a different pronounciation(germany, england, spain,...) or the same spelling (rome, siam, songhai, France, Inca, Aztecs...)

An advice for later posts: the fact that my sole mistake is on one word and is systematically the same, plus the fact that i have a big flag of Brittany and that my location is in Paris should have been hints that it may be an honest mistake from a foreigner. For a first remark on my spelling, you shouldn't be so rude and you should avoid writing "civlizations". You're welcome.

 

[jbevermore]

I think a lot of Greece's power comes from the way the AI uses it, post horse nerf I haven't been all that fond of them.

Personally voted for Siam, but Songhai has been my consistent favorite so far. Love setting up island maps, building up fleets of frigates, and burning cities with an amphibious trained longswordsman.

 

[RealHuhn]

For me, it's a tie between India, Persia and Babylon. But I voted India after my last game.

India + Landed Elite + Scholatism is a research powerhouse. On emperor, standard size/speed, I had 8 huge cities plus one puppet after an early rush (rush-bought 3 war-elephants and conquered germany).
At turn 240 ( ~ year 1650), I had giant death robots (they didn't really matter because I destroyed everything with modern armor, england had some longbowmen ^^) !!! At turn 242, I won by domination with a score of 5506. 1180 science beakers per round.
And I never tech-block with research agreements. NC after 3 cities.

Most ridiculous game I've ever played. I could delay colloseums for a long time and didn't need any social policy to increase happiness.

Yeah, India for sure!

 

[apocalypse105]

The special ability from japan is way to powerfull

 

[1stcontact2035]

I find America is a very easy civ to play with if you want to go on a conquering spree. I just build tons of ranged and siege units and sit them one hex out of site of the city/unit I am fighting and blast the oblivion out of my enemy, as the UA of America is increased range of sight. The UU's of America help with this too, the minuteman avoids terrain movement costs so it's really hard for it or any upgraded versions of it to get bogged down in a fight I don't want it to be in, and the B-17 is my pet city killer... seriously, I often just wait until I can build B-17s and then its game over since the B-17 has siege promotion. Also the extra range of sight UA means I can just go settling the countryside with unprotected settlers for the most part as the settlers will be able to see any threat coming in enough time to move out of the way, that is given the proper terrain is there (hills nearby, open plains, etc.).

 

[jagdtigerciv]

My games with Spain resulting with me trying to get a bunch of scouts and triemes, costing me the opportunity cost and not even first discovering a single wonder once. I was playing on Immortal, which means the AI starts with a lot of scouts and warriors...

So i completely understand when people place Spain low tier. They are very luck dependent and you really can go into a Spain game saying "okay, im going to take advantage of X when i get X." It's more like "huzzah, I got lucky and made 500 gold, lets see what I can do". It's sort of like relying on goody huts for your culture build. You really can't.

 

[jbevermore]

The special ability from japan is way to powerfull

Made up for by the fact that their UU's are kinda meh. It all balances out.

Dunno what Germany's excuse is though.

 

[sylvanllewelyn]

Disagree with China. +10% GG bonus is small (Polynesia?), more great generals don't stack and you won't have the units for multi-front wars unless you are already ahead. UU is too weak to hurt longswords and knights, I much rather have normal crossbows. That leaves the paper maker, which is strong, except it's suitable for liberty-style expansion, and the Chinese are meant for the honour policies.

 

[jbevermore]

Disagree with China. +10% GG bonus is small (Polynesia?), more great generals don't stack and you won't have the units for multi-front wars unless you are already ahead. UU is too weak to hurt longswords and knights, I much rather have normal crossbows. That leaves the paper maker, which is strong, except it's suitable for liberty-style expansion, and the Chinese are meant for the honour policies.

Keep in mind that GG's can also be used for golden ages.

Not a China fan myself, but they're more versatile then you're giving them credit for.

 

[wcbarney]

I find America is a very easy civ to play with if you want to go on a conquering spree. I just build tons of ranged and siege units and sit them one hex out of site of the city/unit I am fighting and blast the oblivion out of my enemy, as the UA of America is increased range of sight. The UU's of America help with this too, the minuteman avoids terrain movement costs so it's really hard for it or any upgraded versions of it to get bogged down in a fight I don't want it to be in, and the B-17 is my pet city killer... seriously, I often just wait until I can build B-17s and then its game over since the B-17 has siege promotion. Also the extra range of sight UA means I can just go settling the countryside with unprotected settlers for the most part as the settlers will be able to see any threat coming in enough time to move out of the way, that is given the proper terrain is there (hills nearby, open plains, etc.).

Yeah! I've been saying this for months, but you said it way better!