Prince On Steroids

[Leeksoup]

Okay, so while I know I'm not even close to being good at this game, I can beat Noble consistently. You know, keep a bit ahead in tech, conquer some people, etc. It began to get boring, so I stepped up to Prince level.

I got my !@# handed to me on a silver platter.

That was insane. The AI got to the Industrial Age in 1600 AD. Okay, let's try again. It was probably just a fluke.

They got to the Industrial Age in 1400 AD this time.

Bemused, I tried different strategies. Building didn't work, I got out-teched and past the WFYABTA limit too fast. Warmongering didn't work, my units cost way too much to have enough to conquer even one city without divine intervention. Cottage-spam, Specialist Economy, Axeman rush, and even in desperation a full-fledged Roman Praetorian assault.

NOTHING WORKS.

I can't beat these AIs! Nothing I do makes any difference! The latest I've seen them win the Space Race was 1715, and the earliest was 1490!

I'm gonna go hide in my Noble corner now. *cry*

 

[carl corey]

Space Race in 1490?! What the heck kind of settings are you playing with? I've never seen that even at Monarch level in Warlords 2.08. There have been fast-pace teching games but nowhere near that speed. I don't think even one game finished before 1800. I'm really curious how that could happen. Honestly, are you *sure* it's Prince level?!

 

[Michelangelo]

Sounds like duel speed modifiers on a marathon game

 

[cabert]

sounds like strange settings indeed

work a bit on your diplomacy to make sure the AIs are at war often enough (=even when you're not), this should bring the pace down a few notches

 

[Leeksoup]

Space Race in 1490?! What the heck kind of settings are you playing with?

Large map, Fractal. Usually 12 or 13 AIs, but I gave up near the end and went with the standard amount.

Honestly, are you *sure* it's Prince level?!

Yes. My game hates me. I can't wait to see what Deity will look like...

 

[Leeksoup]

work a bit on your diplomacy to make sure the AIs are at war often enough (=even when you're not), this should bring the pace down a few notches

I can't. No one likes me enough, unless I'm their religion, but that means I die very early because I get mobbed by an Aggressive AI's infinite [insert unit here].

 

[carl corey]

The only thing I can see is they might trade too much between them. What's the normal number of AIs for that map size?

And by the way, what are you playing: vanilla or Warlords? Even for post-patch Warlords it seems too much to finish in 1500...

 

[manu-fan]

Maybe Fractal is a bit too tough for you.

Try Pangea or Continents. Build 3 or 4 cities, build up your army and take the nearest neighbor, and go from there.

I can't believe Warmongering didn't work. Do you make sure you've got about 8-10 untils before your first war?

Cheers.

 

[Leeksoup]

And by the way, what are you playing: vanilla or Warlords? Even for post-patch Warlords it seems too much to finish in 1500...

Warlords.

I can't believe Warmongering didn't work. Do you make sure you've got about 8-10 untils before your first war?

Can't afford them. By the time I get 3 or 4 cities I'm already at 60% with between -1 per turn and -5 per turn. Add 8 units that's between -9 per turn and -13 per turn. I can't afford that! That drives my research down to 20%, and I'm getting Alphabet in 25 turns. (I tried that already, can you tell?) I men, I pushed on, but it ended up with me being so far behind that my enemy got crossbows and I lost.

 

[TG Empire]

I gotta see this to believe it. Post a saved game.

I went from noble to prince, and then discovered that my same strategies were working just as well as they had on noble - so i just went straight on to monarch, where things have balanced out (not bragging, i am just on okay player). From what you wrote you sound like you know what you are talking about so a saved game is really the only way for us to know how to help you.

What speed do you have it on?

 

[Sisiutil]

Have a look at the early ALC game threads (links in my sig). From Monty through Alexander, they were all played on Prince level--8 sample games in total, all ending in wins of various types (4 domination, 2 space race, 1 cultural, 1 conquest, IIRC).

This isn't ego talking; the threads feature voluminous debate from very good players (many of them better than me!) that reveals much about their strategies, tactics, and thinking when playing at Prince level (and higher). I learned a huge amount from the threads and from everyone who contributed to them, and many other people say they have as well.

 

[ratrangerm]

One thing that hasn't been asked: How far apart are you putting your cities? While land grabbing and blocking off the AI is something to consider, you shouldn't do it to the extent that you end up spending too much on city maintenance.

 

[JoeBlade]

Leeksoup, you may want to try dropping map size by 1 (i.e. to standard) rather than difficulty level.

I usually play large maps as well (sometimes huge) and I find that they can indeed be much harder than standard size at times, although it is extremely random.
The problem is that a handful of AIs can get very lucky, e.g. having lots of very good land to themselves or being the only warmonger among peaceniks. Those civs will tend to run away in terms of, well, pretty much everything and become impossible to beat because they have so many cities.
In particular, there's an odd quirk in the standard map generator that may cause several civs to be packed next to one-another leaving far too much land to the remaining civs. I've seen four literally adjecent capitals (i.e. bordering BFCs) in one instance, which is plain silly.

Be careful with city placement as well: I've found that upkeep doesn't scale all that well with map size. Even 4 cities can indeed prove sufficient to kill your economy when they're too far apart.
And build cottages early of course.

Still, I agree that the examples you've provided are really excessive. Are you using specific mods perhaps?

 

[Galileo44]

How did you have it that early? I just don't believe it(not that i don't believe you). I have never seen the AI win space race before 1850 on Emperor. That's not the Prince I remember!

I too would like to see a save from one of these games near the end if not at the end.