Procylon's Call to Power Project

[Decimatus]

Not sure if this was reported already but Crossbowman/Longbowman/ChoNoKu don't upgrade into machine gunners like they are supposed to. You have their unitupgardes listed as Row instead of Update like it should be. Simple fix. I corrected in my download and it works fine.

Yeah I saw that as well, sorry for the trouble. It will be corrected in V5. Going to finish this test game, do a slew of fixes, do a big balance pass(double or triple costs in industrial onward), do a second test game, do a few more fixes and balance tweaks, and then if it looks decent, launch it.

Just to fill some of you guys in, here are some of the bugs on my current fix list:

Fix Crossbow upgrade path.
Many units need an update so that they reflect being obsolete given the new era expansion.
Publishing house doesn't seem to be giving science.
DDX Civpedia is wrong/broken.
Statue of Zeus needs a text update to reflect that it needs ivory in the vicinity.
Museum comes before the opera house yet requires the opera house in it's construction.
Television, Server Farm, and Prison both seem broken when it comes to the reduced tile culture cost. Maybe others that do this too, not sure yet.
Academy text string is broken.

Those are the current bugs that I have noticed. There may be many more buildings that don't give their stated bonuses, so I will be looking even closer at that in my next playtest.

If you guys see anything that isn't on this list let me know and I will surely take a look at it.

So on top of the fixes, the new industrial system will be coming with V5. It seems to be working decently, though I need to take a closer look at the AI to make sure they are keeping up. They at least seem to be growing a little faster which is good, but I will add upon that and I also want to see about reducing late game player growth, perhaps by cutting the hospital down to 25% food kept among a few other minor tweaks in that area.

Also, if I can swing it, I will try for some aircraft stack limits. Thinking 5 to start out.

I have the same problem as catastrophe. I just went in and manually added back the ignore terrain for the scouts. Something minor: the text for mathematics says "Academy_TEXT_KEY_YIELD_SCIENCE yield improved by 2." I think it would just need to be changed to [ICON_SCIENCE] to achieve the beaker icon.

BTW, I love the mod. I feel bad that I can't really contribute anything significant, so I'll just do my best to inform you of minor problems. Can't wait for the next update

This was actually removed in the vanilla game as well as of the last patch. At some point I might actually create a line of scout units that upgrade through the eras that will scout at first, and later help you spot for artillery and airstrikes.

About the academy string... I actually spent a good 30-50 minutes on this before I launched V4 but couldn't seem to fix/update it. I will probably take another crack at it some other time.


Its fine. Every minor problem reported to me is one less problem that many other plays don't have to experience in the next version.

 

[Buddha2723]

Played through my first testing yesterday, didn't get very far though. Noticed another few TEXT_KEY_YIELD_SCIENCE in the tech tree. I disagree that a fusion plant would boost production so much, though I didn't get near that level on this epic game, to see if it was a problem. I like just about everything, but I think the units and settlers should represent more of an investment. On the higher difficulties I play, there is almost a stream of enemy units, and I think in most cases, an army group(I think of units in this game as massive armies with a primary focus, infantry, cavalry, etc.) requires several times the investment of a single building. Also with +50% settler policy settlers built too quick for the game I played. I recommend 3 to 5 times the cost for units, settlers, and workers(could lower improvement build times to compensate), to help reduce unit clutter in longer games, esp. when AI is emperor or up. I'd also remove uranium for missile requisite, and if possible change it to requisite for manhattan project. It is ridiculous, you shoot off a missile then reuse the uranium to make a new one? Make wmd missiles 10x more expensive, giving incentive to build new nuke plants, hydrogen bomb plants, and make the uranium choice be between power plants(2 uranium needed), wmd missile plants(1 uranium), or war walkers. Maybe Oak Ridge Wonder? (Haven't read all your wonders yet, so apologies if it's already there). I felt like I was too strong early game with my nearby rivers. To help offset the extra food you give around rivers, I'd change water mill to one food, no maint, maybe a coin or two to make it a more economic building. I agree with you on the hospital, I think there should be more 10% storage buildings, like granary along with aqueduct, so only fully built up cities keep more than 50% food.

Thanks for reading this, I will give you more feedback after I finish a normal speed game. Thanks for all your hard work so far. It's looking like a beauty! (And perfect for my scenario too!)

 

[Decimatus]

Played through my first testing yesterday, didn't get very far though. Noticed another few TEXT_KEY_YIELD_SCIENCE in the tech tree. I disagree that a fusion plant would boost production so much, though I didn't get near that level on this epic game, to see if it was a problem. I like just about everything, but I think the units and settlers should represent more of an investment. On the higher difficulties I play, there is almost a stream of enemy units, and I think in most cases, an army group(I think of units in this game as massive armies with a primary focus, infantry, cavalry, etc.) requires several times the investment of a single building. Also with +50% settler policy settlers built too quick for the game I played. I recommend 3 to 5 times the cost for units, settlers, and workers(could lower improvement build times to compensate), to help reduce unit clutter in longer games, esp. when AI is emperor or up. I'd also remove uranium for missile requisite, and if possible change it to requisite for manhattan project. It is ridiculous, you shoot off a missile then reuse the uranium to make a new one? Make wmd missiles 10x more expensive, giving incentive to build new nuke plants, hydrogen bomb plants, and make the uranium choice be between power plants(2 uranium needed), wmd missile plants(1 uranium), or war walkers. Maybe Oak Ridge Wonder? (Haven't read all your wonders yet, so apologies if it's already there). I felt like I was too strong early game with my nearby rivers. To help offset the extra food you give around rivers, I'd change water mill to one food, no maint, maybe a coin or two to make it a more economic building. I agree with you on the hospital, I think there should be more 10% storage buildings, like granary along with aqueduct, so only fully built up cities keep more than 50% food.

Thanks for reading this, I will give you more feedback after I finish a normal speed game. Thanks for all your hard work so far. It's looking like a beauty! (And perfect for my scenario too!)

Nice bit of feedback.

I agree with the unit cost increase, though I don't think it would be as high as 2-3x in the first few eras. I also want the player to build a good number of units. Maybe a 20-50% increase in unit cost in ancient to renaissance units, and then scaling up to the 3x, maybe 4x for industrial and beyond. Do another round of testing around those levels and reassess.

One thing I will point out though is that I do not view units as massive armies. They are divisions at most, and battalions at least. 100+ unit wars on standard maps is a general goal.

I think you are right about the settlers. It is a little too quick on continent coverage at the current rate. However, that system causes the AI to wage vicious wars in the early game around swords/knights which isn't necessarily a bad thing...


One thing you will notice about the +% production items is that they don't give as much as you might think. Once you get to that era you will understand. My second biggest balance goal(after production costs) for post industrial right now is to get the gold situation under control. First though I will set the production values and see how it goes from there, and maybe up the hurry multipliers on many units.


I like the idea of greatly increasing nuke cost, and especially separating them from the normal nuclear unit production buildings(which is in my current build). I will see about working that in. Oak Ridge is a good idea for a national wonder I think. Perhaps even make it so that the Oak Ridge city is the only city capable of building nukes.


I appreciate the feedback, especially on balance issues which can be the hardest part to gather info on. Enjoy.

 

[Numi]

I just wanna say that I was introduced to Civ on Call to Power 2 and looooved all the futuristic stuff then got civ 4 and was sad when it didnt have any of that to my suprise lol. But on that note i really appreciate what you are doing, especially once you get an artist to help on units, cant wait, keep up the good work.

 

[chicadee987]

Issue: There are few buildings with a limited build count. Info text says that you can build up to 4 and still you can only build one.

 

[darkedone02]

I won't play this mod yet until everything is a bit stable and hardly any visible bugs will be appearing that could break the game or crash it.

Although I do like how you are planning to do on this mod, from adding new technology and advancing from stone age to the future-era stage similar to Rise of Mankind for Civ 4. I wish we can expand it more by adding more technology for stone age and other ages so that each era last a bit longer. Add more units to each game, such as stone thrower's, javalin thrower's, longbowman and crossbow man, Ballista, bombard, zeppelin, and many other units that are historically accurate and place into the game.

I also wish there was a certain way where modder's be able to add in new leader music after each era, the background changes along with the costume of the leader after each era (like civ 3 for example), so that we had a accurate representation of the era. It be nice to change the Animation so that it be better too.

 

[Decimatus]

Issue: There are few buildings with a limited build count. Info text says that you can build up to 4 and still you can only build one.

Yeah I missed a couple of them when I changed it back to 1 per civ. I will see about hitting them with some other fixes.

I just wanna say that I was introduced to Civ on Call to Power 2 and looooved all the futuristic stuff then got civ 4 and was sad when it didnt have any of that to my suprise lol. But on that note i really appreciate what you are doing, especially once you get an artist to help on units, cant wait, keep up the good work.

Thanks, I hope you enjoy it. And yeah, definitely can't wait to get some quality art. There is already progress on the unit front, and as soon as they get the animations down we should see a gradual flood of new unit graphics.

I won't play this mod yet until everything is a bit stable and hardly any visible bugs will be appearing that could break the game or crash it.

Although I do like how you are planning to do on this mod, from adding new technology and advancing from stone age to the future-era stage similar to Rise of Mankind for Civ 4. I wish we can expand it more by adding more technology for stone age and other ages so that each era last a bit longer. Add more units to each game, such as stone thrower's, javalin thrower's, longbowman and crossbow man, Ballista, bombard, zeppelin, and many other units that are historically accurate and place into the game.

I also wish there was a certain way where modder's be able to add in new leader music after each era, the background changes along with the costume of the leader after each era (like civ 3 for example), so that we had a accurate representation of the era. It be nice to change the Animation so that it be better too.

Well the game is perfectly stable. I have yet to see an issue where this mod causes a crash, and the only real visual bugs are bugs that already exist in Vanilla.

The biggest issue right now is the need for more balance adjustments for the post-industrialism economy, and some tweaks to get the AI to grow it's cities in a similar fashion.

There is a fair chance that I will puff the Ancient and classical ages out to be 3 techs wide, so you should see more playability in that area sometime in the future, perhaps immediately following the final future era implementation.

I probably won't be adding a prehistoric era unless I have accomplished the majority of my other goals.

Music, art, and animations will all see growth as we move forward. Slow growth perhaps, but we will get there.

 

[ikillu64]

Hey, I just wanted to say thanks for all of your hard work on this mod, I enjoy it very much especially since the future era is my favorite. I have a few suggestions and critiques though. First off, it seem there are WAY too many great scientists in my last game I only actually researched 2 techs, the rest I got from great scientists. You should probably not have as many buildings that give you great scientists, and for that matter all great people. I had tons of great engineers last game. Second, maybe you could get some ideas from the Beyond the Future mod, it has some neat techs. Third, I don't know if this is a vanilla game problem or if its your mod, but I have never seen another civilization launch a nuke. I have launched tons at others even ones with nukes, but they never fire back, or attack with them. Fourth, I don't see a use for the micro UAV team. I rather use mass driver artillery because by then they both take the 1 turn to make, and the mass driver artillery can move farther, and do more damage, so I don't see a use for the micro UAV team. Finally, again iI don't know if this is caused by your mod, but I was having a war with Germany and I was about to attack one of their cities, but it wouldn't let me attack unless I went to war with Arabia because THERE WAS A SUBMARINE. This wasn't even by an ocean either it was surrounded by land, so I had no choice but to go to war with Arabia too. One last thing, I think there should be a new advanced worker after exoskeletons that makes improvements quicker. Again, thanks for your hard work.

 

[Decimatus]

Hey, I just wanted to say thanks for all of your hard work on this mod, I enjoy it very much especially since the future era is my favorite. I have a few suggestions and critiques though. First off, it seem there are WAY too many great scientists in my last game I only actually researched 2 techs, the rest I got from great scientists. You should probably not have as many buildings that give you great scientists, and for that matter all great people. I had tons of great engineers last game. Second, maybe you could get some ideas from the Beyond the Future mod, it has some neat techs. Third, I don't know if this is a vanilla game problem or if its your mod, but I have never seen another civilization launch a nuke. I have launched tons at others even ones with nukes, but they never fire back, or attack with them. Fourth, I don't see a use for the micro UAV team. I rather use mass driver artillery because by then they both take the 1 turn to make, and the mass driver artillery can move farther, and do more damage, so I don't see a use for the micro UAV team. Finally, again iI don't know if this is caused by your mod, but I was having a war with Germany and I was about to attack one of their cities, but it wouldn't let me attack unless I went to war with Arabia because THERE WAS A SUBMARINE. This wasn't even by an ocean either it was surrounded by land, so I had no choice but to go to war with Arabia too. One last thing, I think there should be a new advanced worker after exoskeletons that makes improvements quicker. Again, thanks for your hard work.

Thanks.

What speed and mapsize did you play on? And how many cities?

Most games I play use tons of great scientists and I still have to research the majority of the techs. Also, the tech era and the date usually match up pretty well.

Great engineer improvements now give about +24 production by the end of the game. If you have too many, plop them down on your deserts and tundras.

I have never seen an AI launch a nuke in either vanilla or my mod either. I might look into this down the road, but in general I plan on making nukes quite a bit more expensive anyway.

The cost difference between units should actually be apparent in V5, so cheaper units will be worthwhile. Also, since mass driver artillery will require an advanced auto plant, you can build micro UAV teams in other cities that don't have them.

I don't understand, there was a submarine where? In 1 hex you wanted to move into? A ground hex?

I might create a new line of worker, but it is hard to make a new unit that is noticeably different due to the fact that the current worker gets so many bonuses throughout the eras that he is pretty fast by the endgame. If I change this I would likely need to revamp the entire worker system. Maybe someday, but not anytime soon.


Thanks for your feedback.

 

[Buddha2723]

One thing I will point out though is that I do not view units as massive armies. They are divisions at most, and battalions at least. 100+ unit wars on standard maps is a general goal.

One thing you will notice about the +% production items is that they don't give as much as you might think. Once you get to that era you will understand. My second biggest balance goal(after production costs) for post industrial right now is to get the gold situation under control. First though I will set the production values and see how it goes from there, and maybe up the hurry multipliers on many units.

I like the idea of greatly increasing nuke cost, and especially separating them from the normal nuclear unit production buildings(which is in my current build). I will see about working that in. Oak Ridge is a good idea for a national wonder I think. Perhaps even make it so that the Oak Ridge city is the only city capable of building nukes.

That's the other way to look at units. I don't because they can't stack, and I feel divisions and down could stack on one tile. That's not a deal-breaker by any means though.

I see what you are saying about the production, but what are the gold issues? I didn't notice any issues in my first test.

I think maybe Oak Ridge would give +200% to building nukes, so only one city could build them economically, but you wouldn't be left nuke-less if that city got taken.

 

[Jennar]

Sun Tzu's Art of War Wonder is not giving XP to either the city it is built in nor any other city.

You have building list as Sun_TZU and the upgrade referencing Sun_TSU. Still isn't working. Not sure why.

Think I found it. Despite being able to load multiple BuldingFreeExperiences into the table it will only recognize the last one.

 

[Decimatus]

Sun Tzu's Art of War Wonder is not giving XP to either the city it is built in nor any other city.

You have building list as Sun_TZU and the upgrade referencing Sun_TSU. Easy to fix, checked in my version and working.

Nice catch. Will be fixed for V5.

That's the other way to look at units. I don't because they can't stack, and I feel divisions and down could stack on one tile. That's not a deal-breaker by any means though.

I see what you are saying about the production, but what are the gold issues? I didn't notice any issues in my first test.

I think maybe Oak Ridge would give +200% to building nukes, so only one city could build them economically, but you wouldn't be left nuke-less if that city got taken.

Personally I think there are many reasons that it is better to view units as divisions instead of massive armies.

1 You don't really flank with entire armies.
2 It becomes difficult to conceptualize artillery, air, sea, and missile units if units are considered to be armies.
3 A division is 10,000 to 30,000 troops which isn't exactly small.
4 Map sizes really don't reflect how truly massive earth is, and of course the different sizes makes armies better in some cases and divisions better in others.
5 It is precisely because they can't stack that makes them more suited as divisions. 1UpT is pretty much tailored for the more detailed combat system that you get with individual divisions.

Anyway, that is just my view...


Did you get past industrial/modern in your game? Gold is fine until that point. Eventually though, you can buy all the missiles and planes you want because of your vast hoard of gold.


I suppose that could be a better way to handle nukes. I would of course still require a Nuclear Plant for the nukes.

 

[Decimatus]

There seems to be some persistent problem where strategic resources past iron and horses do not display in their proper places. However, the game still recognizes that you have them since you are able to create resource requiring buildings.

My best guess is that it does not display since there are no units requiring those resources anymore. This may in fact be the only way the game really knows if something is strategic or not.

This also seems to cause another incidental problem where city states won't give you what it considers bonus resources. Since the game doesn't view oil as strategic for instance, the city states also do not consider them as such and therefore do not trade them to you.

So, I am going to do 1 more test game after this one to see if this is the case.


If my assumptions are correct, then I am going to have to have a few units requiring resources.

Likely candidates are nukes for uranium, battleships for oil, and stealth/hypersonic bombers for aluminum.

 

[Decimatus]

Version 5 is now uploaded. See the OP for details on the new Strategic Building system and other patch notes.

 

[Buddha2723]

There seems to be some persistent problem where strategic resources past iron and horses do not display in their proper places. However, the game still recognizes that you have them since you are able to create resource requiring buildings.

My best guess is that it does not display since there are no units requiring those resources anymore. This may in fact be the only way the game really knows if something is strategic or not.

This also seems to cause another incidental problem where city states won't give you what it considers bonus resources. Since the game doesn't view oil as strategic for instance, the city states also do not consider them as such and therefore do not trade them to you.

So, I am going to do 1 more test game after this one to see if this is the case.


If my assumptions are correct, then I am going to have to have a few units requiring resources.

Likely candidates are nukes for uranium, battleships for oil, and stealth/hypersonic bombers for aluminum.

Simple fix=New non-combat units requiring those resources/med-evac chopper--or MASH if you liked the show-- (Industrial-modern; 5 STR, starts with medic)requiring oil; mobile city(Modern-digital; superworker, 20 STR) requiring uranium; Crane choppers(Modern; 4 move worker) requires aluminum. If that works it will re-recognize resources with units that are optional.

 

[chicadee987]

I forgot to mention this in my last post:

Utopia project is way too cheap, I finished it in 3 turns ca. 1700.. Also tech went on too rapidly from classical era onward: Had armies which I shouldnt have had until 1940s. Wonder prices also needs to get higher cos I made every wonder from medieval era onward. Played huge map with prince.

Also gold should be more scarse cos I was able to buy everything later on.

 

[Gazebo]

Impressive! I will be looking at this more and more as it develops.

Let me know if you want to add my diplo mod to your work, if in fact you plan on adding such a feature. It will save you some time.

G

 

[chrome-rome]

Hey just a few typos that I noticed as I was clicking through the buildings:

1. the aircraft plant description says "OIL" instead of "Oil"
2. the industrial warehouse says "10% Food. in this city." Probably should be "10% Food in this city."
3. the laser manufacturing module reads "TXT_KEY_BUILDING_LASER_MANUFACTURING_MODULE_DESC" where the game info should be. I don't know if this is just a place holder until a description is developed or a typo in the code somewhere.

These are all minor problems I know, but I see this mod as having so much potential that anything that could be fixed should be. Keep up the good work; this is currently my favorite mod!

 

[Decimatus]

Hey just a few typos that I noticed as I was clicking through the buildings:

1. the aircraft plant description says "OIL" instead of "Oil"
2. the industrial warehouse says "10% Food. in this city." Probably should be "10% Food in this city."
3. the laser manufacturing module reads "TXT_KEY_BUILDING_LASER_MANUFACTURING_MODULE_DESC" where the game info should be. I don't know if this is just a place holder until a description is developed or a typo in the code somewhere.

These are all minor problems I know, but I see this mod as having so much potential that anything that could be fixed should be. Keep up the good work; this is currently my favorite mod!

Fixed, Fixed, and Fixed. Thats why this is alpha, thanks for the report.

Simple fix=New non-combat units requiring those resources/med-evac chopper--or MASH if you liked the show-- (Industrial-modern; 5 STR, starts with medic)requiring oil; mobile city(Modern-digital; superworker, 20 STR) requiring uranium; Crane choppers(Modern; 4 move worker) requires aluminum. If that works it will re-recognize resources with units that are optional.

I have a placeholder system in for now. Once I add the multiple tech pages I am going to add some optional units such as heavy tanks and paris gun type units that will require resources and be stronger.

I forgot to mention this in my last post:

Utopia project is way too cheap, I finished it in 3 turns ca. 1700.. Also tech went on too rapidly from classical era onward: Had armies which I shouldnt have had until 1940s. Wonder prices also needs to get higher cos I made every wonder from medieval era onward. Played huge map with prince.

Also gold should be more scarse cos I was able to buy everything later on.

What gamespeed?

Gold won't be more scarce, but you will use a lot more of it. Production costs have been increased across the board. The hurry modifier has also been increased. May not be perfect yet, but it should be better.

Utopia project will cost 20000 production in V6. Once I implement the new social policies, I will see if I can change it's requirement to be something like 20-30 full branches instead of 5.

Impressive! I will be looking at this more and more as it develops.

Let me know if you want to add my diplo mod to your work, if in fact you plan on adding such a feature. It will save you some time.

G

Maybe at some point down the line.

Hope you enjoy it!

 

[strategyonly]

I am trying to get more ideas, in another thread, hope you dont mind? I have posted your Tech Tree as an "example." Great work btw