Prussia speculations

[Lonecat Nekophrodite]

Here's my speculations.

Traits. Cultured (or Scientific) and Industrious; Contrary to popular cultures. Prussia began small, they had a limited capacity waging big wars so they only afford to fight war against ONE enemy at a time. (with weaker allies if they drag them along) and has to win DECISIVELY. (and so often ended it on a negotiation table after they satified with an objective of a war, which were generally expansions--Such As Silesian Wars which united Silesia and even Bohemia (Czech). with their preferred enemy being Austria. (much bigger rival, itself a threat to the very existence of Prussia). Prussia was not really successful when it comes to 'Big Alliances Wars', while they won, (usually... well under Frederick II) these wars strained Prussia too much (The Seven Years War was really a no-go, Prussia wanted to become equal to Austria, and sided with Britain, only to fight bigger enemies with a very limited British assistances, something Old Fritz was very disappointed with the Brits... Imagine that France to the West, Austria to the South, and Russia to the East. all were bigger empires with several times more men and resources. and the Seven Years Wars was when Prussia suffered some bad defeat on the battlefield (and the King had to flee, yelling 'There's no disgrace retreating' because he could not squander more men on a losing battle). and only with a change of leadership in Russia did Prussia stood. After Seven Years War, 'Prussia got what they want' and never went to war or join alliances against anybody for some 20 years. Except sending a rather unscrupulous officier to help American rebellions form a standing army some two decades later.

Unique Abillity would be 'Potsdam Giants'. all of their units should be 20% stronger, but more also 20% expensive and takes more upkeeps. (to represents accomplishness of rather small Royal Prussian Army and Navy could do).
Unique quarters: Manuevering Grounds.
The other could be 'Manor' (Similiar to Chateau, allows faster trainings)
UC: An artist of Sort
UU: Very difficult choices to take. there should be either:
- Garde du Curps: Superior cavalry available at the beginning.
- Unterseeboote: (U- Boat), Returns from Civ6. superior submarine ----------------- Most likely since this was really unique as German Empire (made out of Prussia) pioneered its use in war.
- Grenadier: Infantry class, This represents their regulars being nearly as good as Elite Guards of other countries. other names might also be 'Musketier' (Prussia and German Empire use this term to refer to standard footsloggers despite that they used advanced weapons quite early (1851, Dreyse Needle Rifle), or Schutzen.
- 'Big Bertha' or 'Kruppkanone'. (well the corporate still stood as part of ThyssenKrupp). Superior siege guns, bigger, badder, and -- even more expensives. available at the very beginning.
(the other idea could be Kruppkanone being field artillery replacements. )

Associated Wonder: Sansoucci.

Sanssouci - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Let's speculate. well if FXis did not reveal this civ tomorrow

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

We've already seen Brandenburg Gate in screenshots, so that would be the Associated Wonder.

 

[Uberfrog]

I strongly suspect it will be Germany and not Prussia.

I don’t know how it became accepted that Firaxis aren’t using modern nations, when America, Mexico and Russia are now confirmed. Given the strong Prussian character of the German Empire, I don’t think there is any need to separate it out into its own thing. Especially since leaders are now decoupled from civilisations.

 

[Lonecat Nekophrodite]

I strongly suspect it will be Germany and not Prussia.

I don’t know how it became accepted that Firaxis aren’t using modern nations, when America, Mexico and Russia are now confirmed. Given the strong Prussian character of the German Empire, I don’t think there is any need to separate it out into its own thing. Especially since leaders are now decoupled from civilisations.

so U-Boat is the most likely candidate UU ?

 

[Uberfrog]

so U-Boat is the most likely candidate UU ?

I think it’s highly likely, if a little unimaginative.

 

[Lonecat Nekophrodite]

I think it’s highly likely, if a little unimaginative.

This because Germany pioneered submarine warfare. and these were what Allies feared most, until efficient anti-submarine warfare is developed later in WW2

 

[Krikkit1]

Of the 6 Traits
Cultural
Scientific
Economic
Militaristic
Diplomatic
Expansionist

Prussia..(or 1750-1950 Germany) probably has to have Militaristic and then probably either Cultural or Scientific (less likely Economic or Diplomatic)
[I'd lean slightly toward scientific over cultural but only slightly]

As for their actual ability/units/infrastructure/civics, etc.
I would agree probably production bonuses among others (since there is no "Industrious trait")

 

[Siptah]

I strongly suspect it will be Germany and not Prussia.

I don’t know how it became accepted that Firaxis aren’t using modern nations, when America, Mexico and Russia are now confirmed. Given the strong Prussian character of the German Empire, I don’t think there is any need to separate it out into its own thing. Especially since leaders are now decoupled from civilisations.

The only hint for Prussia is a screenshot that shows the Norman unlocks. Prussia would fit from the size, Germany or German Empire wouldn't.

That said, I also believe that we'll see a Germany. It's probably built around 1800-1918 (even though not united until 1871).

I think we'll see Great People for them, from Engineers to Artists, as civilian UU. They probably carry a stupid name like "Vordenker."
No clue on the UU: early airplanes, U-Boats, Ulan, Reiter... whatever
The only improvement I can think of is a "Kohlemine", which is super generic and probably exists as an improvement to get coal anyway.
So I would bet on 2 UBs and a UQ. Probably also with rather generic names, like "Institut" (Science) and "Zollamt" (Economy) creating a "Residenz" (Quarter) to highlight the federalist side of Germany. I don't think we see anything on industry, as this would be too similar with the America design.

Ability-wise: more CS but higher upkeep/production cost, as OP suggests, seem nice. On the other hand, we are missing a civ with an archeology bonus... could be that Britain in the DLCs will occupy that spot, could be that Germany does in the base game.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

so U-Boat is the most likely candidate UU ?

I seem to remember it might be the Panzer. We've seen screenshots of Sherman Tanks, T-34s, and Panzers. The first two had colors associated with leaders so they might be universal graphics, while the Panzer might be unique.

 

[Wohlauf]

I seem to remember it might be the Panzer. We've seen screenshots of Sherman Tanks, T-34s, and Panzers. The first two had colors associated with leaders so they might be universal graphics, while the Panzer might be unique.

Japan was using the panzer, so I would default toward universal graphics. Of course that was early so things might have changed. Though I would be dissappinted if they went with the Panzer 4 F1 of all tank models to make a UU, but its more than adequate as a cultural appearance.

The UU will probably be the U-boat. It's not terribly exciting, I just hope its more interesting mechanically than in 6.

 

[Lonecat Nekophrodite]

I seem to remember it might be the Panzer. We've seen screenshots of Sherman Tanks, T-34s, and Panzers. The first two had colors associated with leaders so they might be universal graphics, while the Panzer might be unique.

Not really what I like. German panzers began as weaker AFVs than their enemies (French, British, and later Soviets). they only have better Panzers in 1942-1943, though Panzerhampfwagen IV series remained German Army backbone from beginning to end of WW2. this because their hulls are more adaptive, to the point that it could be maxed out even in 1945. While Panzer III became obsolete too quickly. (only in 1942, too light to fight anyone effectively).

And remember that the word 'Panzer' which means 'armor' in German actually came from French (or Norman) word 'Pancier'. which means an armor component. (or a full armor ??)

 

[Lonecat Nekophrodite]

Japan was using the panzer, so I would default toward universal graphics. Of course that was early so things might have changed. Though I would be dissappinted if they went with the Panzer 4 F1 of all tank models to make a UU, but its more than adequate as a cultural appearance.

The UU will probably be the U-boat. It's not terribly exciting, I just hope its more interesting mechanically than in 6.

Confirmed?

Japanese army AFVs were really lousy. PzKfw chosen for them could present their alliance with Germany in WW2 but they never use any IRL.
Japanese tanks should actually be rather 'Last Year' experimental designs

 

[Wohlauf]

Confirmed?

Japanese army AFVs were really lousy. PzKfw chosen for them could present their alliance with Germany in WW2 but they never use any IRL.
Japanese tanks should actually be rather 'Last Year' experimental designs

I think the axis connection is best and only reason. In all fairness, there is the famous instance of Japan buying a Tiger tank, though it never made it to Japan, and was later bought back by the Germans. So there is a very loose precedant there.

 

[j51]

I think the civilian unit is going to replace the commander. I bet it’s a Field Marshall and the graphic was that guy with the wig and the Hohenzollern flag.

 

[Lord Lakely]

Prussia largely expanded via inheritences and diplomatic annexations. They were exceptionally shrewd diplomats. "Realpoltik" is a term because of them. wouldn't be surprised if they had Diplomatic and Expansionist (specialist-focused) for their Traits, with a slight flavour towards Science with their Quarter and Buildings.

Cultural could also work in the light of the Kulturkampf, as a Civ that resists the Cultural influence of other Empire's while establishing their own.

Fritz - who is likely to have two persona's - can take on the Militaristic side of Prussia with one persona, and an Enlightened side with the other.

I definitely WANT the Civ to be Prussia over Germany proper, as it's more interesting and unique.

 

[Haig]

I agree with j51's suggestion, an unique commander.

For military unit maybe panzer this time, or stuka dive bomber, as now there is a new unit class dive bombers.

 

[Boris Gudenuf]

Prussia largely expanded via inheritences and diplomatic annexations. They were exceptionally shrewd diplomats. "Realpoltik" is a term because of them. wouldn't be surprised if they had Diplomatic and Expansionist (specialist-focused) for their Traits, with a slight flavour towards Science with their Quarter and Buildings.

Cultural could also work in the light of the Kulturkampf, as a Civ that resists the Cultural influence of other Empire's while establishing their own.

Fritz - who is likely to have two persona's - can take on the Militaristic side of Prussia with one persona, and an Enlightened side with the other.

I definitely WANT the Civ to be Prussia over Germany proper, as it's more interesting and unique.

Also note that it is hard to over-estimate the influence that 4 successive single-minded and competent Leaders had on Prussia's development. During the 30 Year's War Brandenburg-Prussia was basically a rug that foreign armies (HRE, Swedish) marched over at will, in the process stealing whatever wasn't hidden or nailed down.

From the Great Elector (Frederick William, reigned 1640 - 1688), through Frederick I "The Mercenary King" (1688 - 1713), to Frederick William I ("The Soldier King" (1713 - 1740) to Frederick II "The Great" (1740 - 1797) - they ranged from brilliant (Great Elector, Fred the Great) to competent - note that neither the Mercenary King nor the Soldier King got into any major wars, but the Mercenary managed to enrich his kingdom by 'renting' his army out to Britain and the Netherlands throughout the War of the Spanish Succession.` The Soldier King was a bit batty about his Giant Soldier regiment, but he kept careful control over his economy and so paid for his over-sized military without borrowing a pfennig, and grew his country's economy and resources enormously in the process.

So, IF we were to get 'Prussia' instead of 'Germany' as a playable Civ, I suggest that one 'Civ bonus' might be that any Leader of Prussia gets extra of whatever type bonuses they ordinarily provide: economic, military, or production.

 

[Isengardtom]

I strongly suspect it will be Germany and not Prussia.

I don’t know how it became accepted that Firaxis aren’t using modern nations, when America, Mexico and Russia are now confirmed. Given the strong Prussian character of the German Empire, I don’t think there is any need to separate it out into its own thing. Especially since leaders are now decoupled from civilisations.

maybe Germany will be 4th age - Information Age

then we can see America --> United Stated
French Empire --> France

I'm not a fan btw of this, but could see it happen

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

Considering the Kingdom of Prussia existed until 1918, within the German Empire, I could see them having uniques starting from the kingdom's founding in 1701 all the way up to the end of WWI.

 

[ehecatzin]

Considering the Kingdom of Prussia existed until 1918, within the German Empire, I could see them having uniques starting from the kingdom's founding in 1701 all the way up to the end of WWI.

Russia's design and civis already feel like they are about starting more agrarian and cultural, and turning that around into full production and science with bit of soviet flavour. I can see them doing something similar with Germany, start with Prussian flavour and civics, and you evolve them into unification and German civics.