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R.E.D. World War II development thread

Discussion in 'R.E.D. World War II Edition' started by Gedemon, Jul 14, 2011.

  1. ZeroZeroSix

    ZeroZeroSix Prince

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    Well, after a given distance. Let say 5 or 10 depending on the size of the map there is a penalty increasing with the distance!
     
  2. Natan35

    Natan35 Mayor of St. Natansburg

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    I'd actually suggest bonus increasing with distance. It takes more time for the supply to arrive.
     
  3. Gedemon

    Gedemon Modder Moderator

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    I don't understand your reasoning here...
     
  4. ZeroZeroSix

    ZeroZeroSix Prince

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    Wow, inland....what I mean is city in the main country with an harbor, not an island like Hawaii as an example.
     
  5. Gedemon

    Gedemon Modder Moderator

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    BTW, I've just found out that BNW is not required to use the visual representation of trade routes, I'll be able to reuse it for the units supply line :)
     

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  6. Gedemon

    Gedemon Modder Moderator

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  7. gertjantommel

    gertjantommel Chieftain

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    I think we should. We know how the German advance into Russia was halted by an early winter (which makes me think about this other mod which has seasons in it...worked also nice with tougher conditions during winter time...) and supply lines that were overstretched. I think a supply line limit of say 15 should work fine. I see it as follows. At a supply line of 10 all is fine. At 11, 12, 13, 14, and 15 the supply will decrease by 20 percent with each step. So at 11 it is 80%, 12 60%, 13 40%, 14 20% and 15 0%...this means that there is some incentive to capture cities as well.

    This is a difficult one I guess. I would suggest that a typical supply route would be to have big cities with most supplies, supply the smaller cities which then supply the units. Whenever, of course, these smaller cities are nearer than the big cities. This also poses some nice features whenever a city is encircled...as long as the city has supplies the units that are connected with this city (inside the circle so to say) are supplied, but whenever the supplies run out, the units cannot be resupplied.

    We might think about some mechanism that takes into account whether a railroad or road is provided. This means that the supply line that runs almost exclusively along a railroad can be 1.5 times the length of a road supply line. Without a road in the vicinity (say 3 hexes) the supply line is 50% of the normal length. The overflow of city bombing can then also be applied to railroads and roads to interfere with supplying units. For example, a bombed railroad counts as a road, and a bombed road counts as "no road"
     
  8. Gedemon

    Gedemon Modder Moderator

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    I've coded the supply line efficiency this way:

    The mod simulate a land convoy with 8 moves (cruiser tanks have 6 for reference, that number can be tweaked), then if the convoy can't reach the unit in one turn, a penalty is applied, proportional to the movement points needed to reach the unit.

    This way road, rails, hills, forest, rivers, etc... are directly affecting the supply line efficiency.

    The code is using the closest city ATM, I may tweak that later depending on the tests, but I need to code the resources transfer between cities first.

    About seasons, I'm trying to keep the new version able to save/reload from in game, which is mandatory to change terrain type mid game while keeping the mod relatively users-friendly.
     
  9. gertjantommel

    gertjantommel Chieftain

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    This seems like a simple but adequate solution to my suggestion indeed! :D I am not sure what you mean by "proportional to the movement points needed to reach the unit"? And is the penalty applied to the unit or to the convoy? I would suggest that a penalty would be the already implemented "bleeding". The unit is out of supply thus a "bleeding" penalty suffices. The convoy should imho not be affected.

    Makes sense to me. But how does this work then if a city has only limited resources?

    Wow, that would be whicked! In game loading...:D This weather/seasons thing is a really nice feature I would say.

    Gedemon, when do they offer you a job at 2k?
     
  10. Gedemon

    Gedemon Modder Moderator

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    the "land convoy" is virtual, it won't be on the map as the "sea convoy"

    see the attached screenshot for the effect of distance/terrain on supply line efficiency.

    say that the maximum reinforcement per turn is 100 personnel and 20 materiel, an unit with a supply line efficiency of 50% will only get 50 personnel and 10 materiel max.


    If an unit is connected to 2 cities, one with resources one without, it also means that the 2 cities are connected, and they will share their resources.
     

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  11. Gedemon

    Gedemon Modder Moderator

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    RED WWII Reloaded <- updated
    RED WWII Data files <- updated
    RED WWII 3D Leaders <- *new*


    RED WWII DLL <- updated

     
  12. ZeroZeroSix

    ZeroZeroSix Prince

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    Not too sure if I builded it right but there is no maps or scenario.
     

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  13. Gedemon

    Gedemon Modder Moderator

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    scenarios are now independent:

    They've just been updated, but remember, all this is pre-alpha, not playable, you'll have to add units via IGE or firetuner.

    You can test combat rules, stacking and view supply line efficiency, but healing itself is not coded yet.

    Comments on the combat rules and map layout (ie city placement on world map for example) are welcome.
     
  14. gertjantommel

    gertjantommel Chieftain

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    This is a very nice way of coding it!:goodjob:


    This is obvious I would say. However, I was more thinking about the combination of
    1. The nearest city is 8 hexes away and completely surrounded with only a tiny road/route (i.c. 1 hexes corridor) available to other cities and units(e.g., like Stalingrad in WWII)
    2. Other cities are much farther away (more than 8 hexes from each other and the unit)

    The other cities can share their resources but the same restriction should apply to transfers between cities as with the virtual convoys. Don't you think?

    Imho: total demand is 200 personnel and 100 material for the units. The city can only provide 10 and 5 (no buildings only production), while the other cities are at 10 hexes away and can provide the rest. Supply of 10 hexes is 80%, thus only 80% of 190 personnel and 95 material can be deliverd...so a total of 162 personel and 81 material can be supplied to the units.

    Another thing: shouldn't oil/fuel also work in the same fashion als personnel and material?
     
  15. Gedemon

    Gedemon Modder Moderator

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    Yes I plan to apply the convoy rules between cities and fuel will use the same mechanism.

    But now all this become a bit more complex when you have multiple units to supply, for example I don't want the first unit to get all resources and leave nothing for the rest...

    That's why I'd like to keep it relatively simple on the code side, else I'm afraid to waste some of the speed gained from Lua to C++ in complex loops.

    So my actual though on the code at the beginning of a player turn is as follow:
    - apply the resource sharing between cities first to restock where needed
    - do a first pass on all the player's units to assign supply lines between units and cities (could be weighted on stock and distance, and I'd prefer 1 supply line per unit, I dont see how to handle more with sharing in mind)
    - calculate how much resource per linked unit each city could provide
    - do a second pass to send the calculated share from cities to units

    then apply the healing as described in one of my previous post (see 2 pages back)
     
  16. ntchapin

    ntchapin Chieftain

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    Are you ever going to update the Mac version? Ever? Overtime I see a new update for this, and I die a little inside because I can't play it. :(
     
  17. Jenyariy

    Jenyariy Chieftain

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    Gedemon, are you going to ever add some strategic significance to rivers? The whole battle of Stalingrad was to control Volga and not to let soviet ships deliver reinforcements to soviet troops. Maybe you may add river convoys or something else that could let the control of rivers be important? Also, I suggest adding an ability to destroy bridges and roads when retreating.
     
  18. Gedemon

    Gedemon Modder Moderator

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    That could be done only if Aspyr find a way to allow DLL modding (or something similar)

    Also I'll need a Mac (don't buy one for me yet, the first statement is not technically possible AFAIK)

    Rivers may be used for resources/reinforcement routes in the future (like the "land convoy" in the development version)
     
  19. DEathgod65

    DEathgod65 Chieftain

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    One small problem I noticed with the new unit icons


    This is the wrong Kirov :lol:
     
  20. Gedemon

    Gedemon Modder Moderator

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    Thanks, if you found others, let me know, I'll ask Urzahil if he can change them.
     

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