RA Free Strategy: Challenge #1

[tommynt]

this is for immortal and restarting till you get dream land?

I am pretty sure that no RAs doesnt mean that conquering is no1 prio, what should be n1 prio is definatly haviing some big growing core cities which will do a massive science output, conquering wont get you much in medium run if you dont gain also new lux to get bigger overall.

Problem with puppets is that you cant put scientists into universities - so maybe 1 core city with university is better as 2 puppets without?

Maybe even a civ5 vanilla like ICS with buying unis might work if you can finance them.

 

[ifinnem]

Turn 239 science victory.

My last GS popped later than i tought and had to wait 4-5 turns before completing the last part. Had to build 2 parts from capital only because i couldn't start them all at the same time.

With some more raw , i think it's possible to cut 10 turns and fly with a sub 230 turn win but it's a hard task to do.

Here is the save.

Good work - I think you still posted the quickest time even though things didnt go exactly right at the end.

 

[ifinnem]

I don't think any Civs should be eliminated initially. For that matter...the ideal candidate to eliminate would be Babylon! Bowman rush is VERY effective for early warmongering...and obviously their UA make them well equipped for science VC.

Yeah I thought about them after I posted the possible exclusion list.
Again the spirit of the challenge is to find new ways to tech without using RAs or mass bulbs so I'd prefer not to exclude civs but also dont want everyone to just take Babylon.

I think I might do the following - only exclude Babylon and leave all other civs up for grabs. Not everyone likes to war I think so maybe some folks will try different approaches...

 

[Vo01985]

Just make it a challenge with a posted save, I've always enjoyed those.

 

[Tabarnak]

I am pretty sure that no RAs doesnt mean that conquering is no1 prio, what should be n1 prio is definatly haviing some big growing core cities which will do a massive science output, conquering wont get you much in medium run if you dont gain also new lux to get bigger overall.

Getting a lot of GS is the trick here. I popped 14-15 of them. My cities were pretty low because i runned scientists until turn 80. Had to ally 2 maritime cs to manage a decent growth without crippling production.

I agree with a no Babylon game, but now Siam has a little advantage if you can build the Oracle. I agree to start from the same save too.

 

[ifinnem]

Thanks for the input - I am torn about whether to use a starting save (and hence have everyone use the same civ). Started the new challenge thread here - please answer the poll to decide whether I post a map and if so what civ

 

[tommynt]

Getting a lot of GS is the trick here. I popped 14-15 of them. My cities were pretty low because i runned scientists until turn 80. Had to ally 2 maritime cs to manage a decent growth without crippling production.

true - just need enough production in the cities to get universities up

 

[w a i n y]

I am pretty sure that no RAs doesnt mean that conquering is no1 prio, what should be n1 prio is definatly haviing some big growing core cities which will do a massive science output, conquering wont get you much in medium run if you dont gain also new lux to get bigger overall.

Problem with puppets is that you cant put scientists into universities - so maybe 1 core city with university is better as 2 puppets without?

On deity, playing as Babylon (presumably your best bet, aside from maybe Korea), you'll generally want to bowman rush someone just to get some breathing room. Obviously you won't just keep them as puppets, though! Annexing cities is so powerful now with broken courthouses that remove the 3 per-city unhappiness. The AIs will have quite large cities due to their growth bonuses, which should give you some solid core cities by early-mid game. I'd argue it's better than building them all yourself!

This is one of those ways in which high-level single-player differs from multiplayer.

 

[tommynt]

Babylon

pay money to get op stuff?

broken courthouses that remove the 3 per-city unhappiness

bug abuse as core strat?
The courthouse description clearly states ADDITIONAL unhappynes, so its obviously a bug

 

[TomeTraveler]

This is only my third victory on Immortal. In addition to no RAs, I decided to forego bulbing techs as well, settling all my Great Scientists. I took Arabia and came in with a 312 turn victory.

Settled two cities, got DOWed by the US and took New York as a puppet. GL was built quite early in another land but I went with Stonehenge for a boost in social policies: Liberty through the finisher which was too early for the Education wonders, but I settled Damascus in a very hilly area with the intention of using that early Great Engineer to build the HG, which I did. The oracle a couple of turns later started me down Patronage, which I took the left half of until gaining Rationalism. For most of the rest of the game I varied between rationalism picks and order picks. A short war with India ended with a good peace deal for me but no exchange of cities.

Meanwhile, Spain began a series of wars against me that followed a simple pattern: Isabella DOWs, I take one of her cities as a puppet, she grants me a good peace deal. This repeated until I took Madrid, leaving her only Cordoba. NC got built late, turn 115, and then I entered a period of peaceful building until turn 229, when need for population drove me to attack the Ottomans. 18 turns of war and Suleiman capitulated, giving me all of his cities except Istanbul. I sold one of those to China, another to India, and two more back to Suleiman to bring happiness to manageable levels, leaving my empire with 6 settled cities, 2 annexed (Madrid, and Boston which I annexed by mistake), and 10 puppets.

Gandhi built the Manhattan project on turn 297, denounced me on 308, and I held my breath the final few turns until launching the spaceship on 312.

Beaker summaries:

Turn 93: 31 BPT
115 (after building NC): 62
154 (after an observatory built in Mecca): 160
193 (after first Public School): 300
246 (Planned Economy): 633
268 (Sovereignty): 1081
At the finish I was pulling 1423 BPT

This will be the first time I've tried to attach a save to a post, hope it works!

View attachment Arabia Victory ImmConStd (No RA).Civ5Save

 

[ifinnem]

This is only my third victory on Immortal. In addition to no RAs, I decided to forego bulbing techs as well, settling all my Great Scientists. I took Arabia and came in with a 312 turn victory.

Thanks for participating and appreciate the info. Hope you enjoyed seeing the power of cranking out those beakers!