I can take it for this weekend.
Have a trip on Monday, so I will do whatever I can finish before then.
Have a trip on Monday, so I will do whatever I can finish before then.
Rat44 CCM - Ultimate Challenge
- Thread starter ThERat
- Start date
AD 1827: Capture island up north. Carthage destroyed. Capture last Russian town and they are destroyed as well.
Hotchkiss can be sent via airports, so I turn on the main cities and switch to Infantry or Hotchkiss rather than wealth. Get one worker on the island in clear territory and you are going to be able to drop large numbers onto the right continent via airlift. They will never take the square back if you are dropping many units per turn and more quickly take the island.
I line up units and ships for transporting across. Also send supplied ships toward Portugal on 2 islands. It looks like it will take a bit of time to set up the attack.
I use planes for recon. Looks like Mayans and Nubia haven't fought much. They have a lot of units just milling about.
AD1828: Capture Faro from Portugal.
AD1829: Boring move troops round. I land a first set, but its more to distract the enemy than to get anywhere.
AD 1830: First set razed a Nubian town (forgot to note name first). We get some workers for eventual airport but land is still owned by Nubia from other towns.
A second much bigger landing and a 3rd medium size.
For Portugal, save and attack city and destroy Portugal.
IBT: An actual AI landing by Nubia on our home continent. Our landings are attacked but animation is off so I can't see casualties.
AD1831: Deal with landing so I don't forget and rush Dreadnoughts in nearby towns to sink the ships.
We raze Madjar and build our own city and airport (on mountain).
Iryshek is captured because that is Tank only and I don't expect it do well without Infantry, workers, or settlers. Capture will keep move one units from immediate attack. We get lucky and get a Worker in the city and can build an immediate airport. This means we can send across infantry and have a chance of making this a real beach-head.
Built more airports on new continent and some on old and shipped across Infantry for defense and Hotchkiss for attack.
I am not going to try to attack this turn. I don't have the workers needed yet.
Unfortunately, I accidentally ended the turn so won't have the workers. I will likely pick off units after their attacks.
Nubia and Maya have fought based on the pillaging done.
IBT: A landinng on an island we own. need to find it.
AD 1832: Attack and Capture Toshka near Irysek in the South.
Abandon city of Bolu on the island. That is where Nubia landed.
For the more northern landing the faster Mayan troops are nearby. I build a town to get to them.
Using planes I did some Recon and Mayans have many units.
We need a leader to make get one of the National mines to get Rails on the new island.
Abandon a few cities to get to 63%
AD 1833: This turn slaughters tons of Mayan units - perhaps as many as 200. There is probably another hundred plus left, but most big stacks are gone - I see only one with more than one screen of units.
I also capture Zatju and Aniba to the North.
Notes:
In the south I was able to rush the national Oil field using one of the 4 leaders I got (the 4th leader got sent back to the home continent so I got no more). This will get us rails next turn. Our limiting factor will likely be Workers, so we will want to transport more by airlift. The continent will fall quickly with the rails and enough workers.
There is only one continent after that, the Italian one. All islands are cleared. That continent is hard to reach so it will take a few turns to reach via rushed Freighters or bringing the ones we have north.
There is a big airfield in the desert of the second continent nearest the remaining civs (the Northeast). There is a stack of newer units near the air fields of the first continent. Also the first continent has a continental rally point near the capitol.
I used airplanes for recon on the last turn so you can see more of the enemy forces than normal. That will be visible for the AI turn but vanish once the player turn starts. I also cleared most of the darkness.
A final picture:
Hotchkiss can be sent via airports, so I turn on the main cities and switch to Infantry or Hotchkiss rather than wealth. Get one worker on the island in clear territory and you are going to be able to drop large numbers onto the right continent via airlift. They will never take the square back if you are dropping many units per turn and more quickly take the island.
I line up units and ships for transporting across. Also send supplied ships toward Portugal on 2 islands. It looks like it will take a bit of time to set up the attack.
I use planes for recon. Looks like Mayans and Nubia haven't fought much. They have a lot of units just milling about.
AD1828: Capture Faro from Portugal.
AD1829: Boring move troops round. I land a first set, but its more to distract the enemy than to get anywhere.
AD 1830: First set razed a Nubian town (forgot to note name first). We get some workers for eventual airport but land is still owned by Nubia from other towns.
A second much bigger landing and a 3rd medium size.
For Portugal, save and attack city and destroy Portugal.
IBT: An actual AI landing by Nubia on our home continent. Our landings are attacked but animation is off so I can't see casualties.
AD1831: Deal with landing so I don't forget and rush Dreadnoughts in nearby towns to sink the ships.
We raze Madjar and build our own city and airport (on mountain).
Iryshek is captured because that is Tank only and I don't expect it do well without Infantry, workers, or settlers. Capture will keep move one units from immediate attack. We get lucky and get a Worker in the city and can build an immediate airport. This means we can send across infantry and have a chance of making this a real beach-head.
Built more airports on new continent and some on old and shipped across Infantry for defense and Hotchkiss for attack.
I am not going to try to attack this turn. I don't have the workers needed yet.
Unfortunately, I accidentally ended the turn so won't have the workers. I will likely pick off units after their attacks.
Nubia and Maya have fought based on the pillaging done.
IBT: A landinng on an island we own. need to find it.
AD 1832: Attack and Capture Toshka near Irysek in the South.
Abandon city of Bolu on the island. That is where Nubia landed.
For the more northern landing the faster Mayan troops are nearby. I build a town to get to them.
Using planes I did some Recon and Mayans have many units.
We need a leader to make get one of the National mines to get Rails on the new island.
Abandon a few cities to get to 63%
AD 1833: This turn slaughters tons of Mayan units - perhaps as many as 200. There is probably another hundred plus left, but most big stacks are gone - I see only one with more than one screen of units.
I also capture Zatju and Aniba to the North.
Notes:
In the south I was able to rush the national Oil field using one of the 4 leaders I got (the 4th leader got sent back to the home continent so I got no more). This will get us rails next turn. Our limiting factor will likely be Workers, so we will want to transport more by airlift. The continent will fall quickly with the rails and enough workers.
There is only one continent after that, the Italian one. All islands are cleared. That continent is hard to reach so it will take a few turns to reach via rushed Freighters or bringing the ones we have north.
There is a big airfield in the desert of the second continent nearest the remaining civs (the Northeast). There is a stack of newer units near the air fields of the first continent. Also the first continent has a continental rally point near the capitol.
I used airplanes for recon on the last turn so you can see more of the enemy forces than normal. That will be visible for the AI turn but vanish once the player turn starts. I also cleared most of the darkness.
A final picture:
One other point. We got rails to the south, but our tank forces are mainly in the north. I think we need to link the north and south to get the rails in the northern landing, so I would concentrate on the link up first. This might be a bit tricky with all the jungle between. I have tried to send more Hotchkiss to the south for the last 2 turns, but I don't think I got the balance quite right. More workers and Hotchkiss would have been better to the south. I realized this too late (that rails would be south only - I had to abandon our National oil city to build it on the new continent). Also getting the leader to the south this early was lucky despite my leader fishing as the units started as vets and tank counts were more limited.
The south was meant as a decoy for the main northern attack. It just got lucky with the Worker and then the Leader.
Oh I also made a mistake of rushing the oil in a city that might flip, so keep it garrisoned to prevent this. I think we should have more culture so 4-6 units should do it - maybe even just 2 if we are 4x culture.
The south was meant as a decoy for the main northern attack. It just got lucky with the Worker and then the Leader.
Oh I also made a mistake of rushing the oil in a city that might flip, so keep it garrisoned to prevent this. I think we should have more culture so 4-6 units should do it - maybe even just 2 if we are 4x culture.
Northern Pike
Deity
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Sounds like good progress. 
So I guess whoever has free time next should claim this and play it.
I was thinking I should have been setting up the attack on Italy already. My advice is to send the fleets north. I believe this continent will fall quickly.
I also noticed that we have an absurd number of transport boats (over 116) that we will never use again. The Nubians tried landing so finding any boats out in the oceans would be useful. Problem is I don't think our 116 are placed well. Still some may be able to help. Some may be fortified.
I was thinking I should have been setting up the attack on Italy already. My advice is to send the fleets north. I believe this continent will fall quickly.
I also noticed that we have an absurd number of transport boats (over 116) that we will never use again. The Nubians tried landing so finding any boats out in the oceans would be useful. Problem is I don't think our 116 are placed well. Still some may be able to help. Some may be fortified.
Northern Pike
Deity
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Well, that's the endgame on a huge map--it's just much faster to rush up a new transport fleet for each invasion than to send ships on long journeys between theatres.
I've observed before that the slowness of water movement, for most of history the fastest and most efficient form of transport, may be the single least realistic feature of the Civ series. OTOH, veteran gamers know that letting naval units cover as much distance in one turn of a strategic-level game as they could in RL tends to produce an unplayable mess--even in the board-wargame era designers wrestled with this, e.g. successfully in Third Reich, unsuccessfully in War in the Pacific.
I've observed before that the slowness of water movement, for most of history the fastest and most efficient form of transport, may be the single least realistic feature of the Civ series. OTOH, veteran gamers know that letting naval units cover as much distance in one turn of a strategic-level game as they could in RL tends to produce an unplayable mess--even in the board-wargame era designers wrestled with this, e.g. successfully in Third Reich, unsuccessfully in War in the Pacific.
CommandoBob
AbstractArt
Don't tell me, let me guess...you have copies of both games?
- Joined
- Aug 15, 2001
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ThERat
Deity
Am back from Bali and have some time this weekend.
got it
got it
ThERat
Deity
Strange, after hitting enter, the game is stuck...
anyone can check whether it is just me
anyone can check whether it is just me
Northern Pike
Deity
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Don't tell me, let me guess...you have copies of both games?
Indeed--in TR's case, a playing copy and a mint archival copy.
War in the Pacific is a much rarer item, first because it was from SPI, second because, like a lot of their huger efforts, it didn't really work (Campaign for North Africa, LK?
).Rat, sorry; I don't have the game where I am, so I hope someone else will help you quickly with that.
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Don't think I have that one in my game closet with 100s of games.Campaign for North Africa, LK?
CommandoBob
AbstractArt
It is not stuck, just slow.Strange, after hitting enter, the game is stuck...
anyone can check whether it is just me
With us and 3 other civs, this seems an odd time for it slow down. But it could have been because so much of the AI movement was now visible to us. I'm guessing that the game determines each units movement path and then begins deciding if we can see that movement (each unit, each tile) and if that movement can be seen puts that data into a bucket that it will use to show us the AI movement later. Thus, when we see the movement, it happens all at one time, per AI. Not sure if this is the case, but it could be.
Anyway, this is the timeline of the IBT:
At four minutes into the IBT we had a screen jump to watch a fight or some movement. I had IE open and that blocked my view. It may have been Rome's movement.
At the 28 minute mark the Mayans started moving. This went on for about two minutes.
At 1:01 the Nubians started moving.
At 1:02 the city builds pop-ups began. I just Okayed what was suggested.
One Small Wonder was completed; Nation Oilfield I think.
Saved the game at the first chance.
Total elapsed time: 1 hour and 5 minutes.
During this time the Civ exe was using about 50% of the CPU (WinXP SP3, 3.0GHz, 2GB RAM).
I have attached that save file, 1834 AD, no action taken.
ThERat
Deity
Thanks CommandoBob,
I have been playing until turn 9 and all but Rome is dead. The Roman Island turns out to be this forest filled nightmare and progress is slow, top that with a lack of Great Artists and no rails and progress is slow.
They are down to maybe 4-5 cities, I am thinking of finishing this in the few extra turns it will take, unless someone else wants to take over this monster of a game.
I have been playing until turn 9 and all but Rome is dead. The Roman Island turns out to be this forest filled nightmare and progress is slow, top that with a lack of Great Artists and no rails and progress is slow.
They are down to maybe 4-5 cities, I am thinking of finishing this in the few extra turns it will take, unless someone else wants to take over this monster of a game.
I would go ahead and finish. It should be very straightforward.
When our GA started, I couldn't decide if we would win before it ended - I thought we might be able to. If we missed it, I think it could be done with better planning. I had some pauses in my turns. However, minimizing this is not always easy. The fleets can make it if they start moving in time.
The comments on ship movement remind me that we copied LKEndter's world map ship movement playing the large AW games. I think the ship speed was boosted by 2 or 3. Civinator, since this game is always on a large map, you may want to consider this as well - at freighters, start increasing ship movement a bit more. I am not sure how fast transports go in your game if you have them.
When our GA started, I couldn't decide if we would win before it ended - I thought we might be able to. If we missed it, I think it could be done with better planning. I had some pauses in my turns. However, minimizing this is not always easy. The fleets can make it if they start moving in time.
The comments on ship movement remind me that we copied LKEndter's world map ship movement playing the large AW games. I think the ship speed was boosted by 2 or 3. Civinator, since this game is always on a large map, you may want to consider this as well - at freighters, start increasing ship movement a bit more. I am not sure how fast transports go in your game if you have them.
CommandoBob
AbstractArt
Yes, please do this. I know I won't have much free time in the next few weeks to take a turnset.
Was/is this ship movement similar to what was used in SGOTMs? IIRC, Coastal waters cost 3MP, while all sea/ocean was only 1MP. The ship's MPs may have been boosted also, but I'm not sure.
ThERat
Deity
I will complete it, just that I will need to wait for the weekend to have some time to get at it again.
The turns are frustratingly long with heaps of MM.
The turns are frustratingly long with heaps of MM.
ThERat
Deity
Unfortunately I have no screenshots, my registration with the database is lost somewhere unknown
1834AD - Turn 1
Continue to clear the Mayan/Nubian continent, defeating some units, razing 2 towns and capturing 2. I'll try to connect the south and the mid section so that we can RR the entire mini continent faster and wipe the enemy out
Ship a whole lot of units over
IT our GA ends and we get WW2 ships, not that it matters
1835AD - Turn 2
Raze 2 more Nubian cities and we got a connection to RR whatever we want
Manage to open up the Mayan eastern flatlan taking Kaminaluju
At the end of the turn Nubia is left with 2 cities and Mayans with 7
1836AD - Turn 3
Reduce Nubia to 1 city very difficult to access though
Manage to take the Mayan capital and Copan, load troops onto freighters to sail to the last enemy Italy
Take out the last city and Maya are gone
1837AD - Turn 4
We can't make a landing on Roman land yet, as they block the whole shore
1838AD - Turn 5
Take out last Nubian city and only Rome is left, make landfall there
IT we get a new tech, doesn't matter really, Rome attacks but fails to take out our stack
1839AD - Turn 6
After defeating 11 units, Venice is ours
take out lots of troops and with more troops landing manage to raze Naples and Pisa
1840AD - Turn 7
Rome came at us with numbers, but we got a lot of units there now. Rush the silk supply center
capture Milan
IT Rome still does have quite a few units running towards us
1841AD - Turn 8
capture Rome, behind is all badly accessible land
1842AD - Turn 9
capture Turin. find a fast route to attack Genoa next turn
1843AD - Turn 10
capture Florence and abandon it after moving troops to the next city
capture Genoa, culture bomb it for troop movement, abandon a few Itlaina cities, there are only 3 left in the enemy's hands
1844AD - Turn 11
raze Modena and Bologna, one Italian city left
1845AD - Turn 12
raze Padova and Italy is gone, we're victorious
congrats to the Team
I attached the save after taking out Italy, for a finish, simply end the turn and don't bother about all those troops etc.
1834AD - Turn 1
Continue to clear the Mayan/Nubian continent, defeating some units, razing 2 towns and capturing 2. I'll try to connect the south and the mid section so that we can RR the entire mini continent faster and wipe the enemy out
Ship a whole lot of units over
IT our GA ends and we get WW2 ships, not that it matters
1835AD - Turn 2
Raze 2 more Nubian cities and we got a connection to RR whatever we want
Manage to open up the Mayan eastern flatlan taking Kaminaluju
At the end of the turn Nubia is left with 2 cities and Mayans with 7
1836AD - Turn 3
Reduce Nubia to 1 city very difficult to access though
Manage to take the Mayan capital and Copan, load troops onto freighters to sail to the last enemy Italy
Take out the last city and Maya are gone
1837AD - Turn 4
We can't make a landing on Roman land yet, as they block the whole shore
1838AD - Turn 5
Take out last Nubian city and only Rome is left, make landfall there
IT we get a new tech, doesn't matter really, Rome attacks but fails to take out our stack
1839AD - Turn 6
After defeating 11 units, Venice is ours
take out lots of troops and with more troops landing manage to raze Naples and Pisa
1840AD - Turn 7
Rome came at us with numbers, but we got a lot of units there now. Rush the silk supply center
capture Milan
IT Rome still does have quite a few units running towards us
1841AD - Turn 8
capture Rome, behind is all badly accessible land
1842AD - Turn 9
capture Turin. find a fast route to attack Genoa next turn
1843AD - Turn 10
capture Florence and abandon it after moving troops to the next city
capture Genoa, culture bomb it for troop movement, abandon a few Itlaina cities, there are only 3 left in the enemy's hands
1844AD - Turn 11
raze Modena and Bologna, one Italian city left
1845AD - Turn 12
raze Padova and Italy is gone, we're victorious
congrats to the Team
I attached the save after taking out Italy, for a finish, simply end the turn and don't bother about all those troops etc.
Northern Pike
Deity
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Rat, fine work; and I echo your congratulations to the team. 
Although we ended up conquering the world with WWI technology as usual in CCM, the idea of letting the AI build settlers from the start did produce an exciting position which could easily have been lost without very accurate play. The crisis just came early, which is hard to avoid in a game as front-loaded as Civ III.
Although we ended up conquering the world with WWI technology as usual in CCM, the idea of letting the AI build settlers from the start did produce an exciting position which could easily have been lost without very accurate play. The crisis just came early, which is hard to avoid in a game as front-loaded as Civ III.
