Ratings and Strategy for Unique Units!

[Phyr_Negator]

It is good to have several Cossacks with different promotions, such as - majority with Combat I+Pinch and some with Flanking II+Mobility -that'll allow you to move stack quite protected due to Schock and Combat and at the same time you can pillage important improvements due to Mobility right after you arrive to that cell.

 

[Thalassicus]

Alot of these units are upgrades to units whos core value i dont appreciate. Take the apache suggestion. Thats fine but under normal circumstances i hate the fact that helicopters cant use rails so i dont make them. Your upgrade a unit that i would only use if it was a UU and so its likely that ill view it as a trade off.

Likewise, I rarely use Marines or Navy Seals (unless on Archipelago). On the other hand, if the Americans had an Apache Gunship with faster movement and March, (in addition to the attack capability first strike provides) I'd use them greatly when they became available. With 5 move points, regardless of terrain or enemy territory, they'd make even better forward attackers/pillagers.

I agree about Panzers, which is why I add just a small bonus to them in my files. First strike is logical, with the associated Blitzkrieg tactics being the most notable distinction of German tanks (in addition to their anti-tank prowess).



I've been testing it out, and Jaguars are really great with Woodsman II (just II, not I) and an extra +10% vs cities. The Aztecs are Aggressive; giving you a 5.5 strength resourceless replacement for the swordsman, with 6.5 strength attacking cities (equal to swordsmen), and 9.5 defense in forests or jungle. I can kill or harass neighbors with these even if they have axemen, especially if I start out in the tropics. They're not good defending in open terrain, with 5.5 strength vs axemen's 7.5, and around established cities the forests are usually cleared. (I use axemen on the defense if I have copper or iron available.) These guys attack fast through jungle, making them excellent for taking outpost cities until you've got enough promotions to take on the capital.

They make mincemeat of barbarians. Even when axemen show up, 9.5 defense in forests (12(!) fortified on a hill), vs Axemen's 7.5 is amazing. Add in Shock and it's just suicide.

 

[GeneralMikeIII]

What do you think of these changes? (highlighted in bold)

Musketeer
- 9-2
- Ignores city defenses (gunpowder)
- Can upgrade Axemen, Swordsmen, Macemen to Musketeers (with promotions intact)

Apache (Replaces Gunship)
- 20-5
- 1 first strike
- +100% vs armored
- 25% withdraw chance
- Ignores terrain movement costs
- March

With the Musketeers, the main reason I don't use them is because they are the first in their upgrade path. If you could upgrade units to Musketeers, I would be the French even more often (I like using Napolean, but I usually concider the UU to be a handicap, since I usually go from Longbows-->Infantry in a relatively short period of time [which means Redcoats are just about useless too]. With this change, I would probably change the way I usually go up the tech tree, but it would be worth it).

About the Apache, I would definately prefer that over the SEAL. I usually have some Helicopters anyway, since that is what all of the cavalry eventually upgrade to. Don't use the helicopters too much, because there is no way to get them across water. I usually play on the team battlefield map (where one team is on the right half of the map, the other on the left, and split be a body of water that runs right down the middle).

 

[Joh]

It all depends on how you play.

I don't build enough swordsmen early on for that to factor in whether I should take musketeers. I might take one small civ with the swordsmen, then I prefer not to fight any wars until gunpowder. With the monarchy civic, I use the swordsmen I have as police in my cities to keep the war weariness down for the neverending wars in the rennaisence period.

On the other hand, I don't get riflemen or infantry untill much, much later after musketeers. In the game i posted, by the time I had upgraded to riflemen, my musketeers had conquered two civilisations and gone on a pillaging spree through a third. I stopped military research after gunpowder, and focused on economic techs to keep my economy strong during the war. This was still quite quick though because the movement of two essentially cut the invasion times in half - half the time than usual to get to the cities, then just one turn to stomp all over the longbowmen

This kind of approach has benefits well. Musketeers used against medieval units get promotions very rapidly, probably more so than swordsmen used against classical units, so by the time you do upgrade to riflemen, you can have some really good riflemen to use.

To use them well you do have to focus on them, but that's not different to many other civs.

 

[R3dKnight]

We need a civ with better siege units. lol i honestly am getting bored of the catapults. And i always thought british longbowmen are famous for their range & quite a major force in history.

 

[salty]

yeah somebody make a trebuchet or something

 

[Thalassicus]

About the Apache, I would definately prefer that over the SEAL. I usually have some Helicopters anyway, since that is what all of the cavalry eventually upgrade to. Don't use the helicopters too much, because there is no way to get them across water.

Actually, helicopters can be loaded on Transports.
They also don't lose their turn from unloading. I love getting 8 of these guys and offloading them on the enemy, going on a pillaging spree and killing workers

 

[Phoenix_56721]

I tried my first game with the French (Louis XIV, Creative and Industrious) on Noble level. And I really like the Musketeers, their not quite as potent as with Napoleon, but the Creative trait of Louis really helps with the land grab and defensive, combined with Industrious they are great at wonders and pumping out units from forges. In this game I wasn't able to get my hands on any horses but the Musketeers filled in the spot nicely with there their extra movement. I took out the Americans first and then the Chinese both with almost all Musketeers and a few catapults. My next game I'm going to try out Napoleon to see the true potential of the Musketeers.

 

[GeneralMikeIII]

Actually, helicopters can be loaded on Transports.
They also don't lose their turn from unloading. I love getting 8 of these guys and offloading them on the enemy, going on a pillaging spree and killing workers

Ohhhhhh. I tried loading them on carriers, but I didn't think about putting them on troop transports. Thanks for the tip, I can't believe I didn't think of trying that.

 

[Joh]

I took out the Americans first and then the Chinese both with almost all Musketeers and a few catapults. My next game I'm going to try out Napoleon to see the true potential of the Musketeers.

I find the +10% you get from napoleon eliminates the need for catapults if you can get the musketeers quickly.

With the right promotions, or even just plain old combat 3, they can take on longbowmen one on one.

I only started using cannons once the civs started to upgrade to riflemen and made the musketeers obselete.

The musketeers main strength lies in being able to rush a medieval enemy, so I think waiting for catapults to catch up to therm seriously undermines this.

Also, riflemen, infantry and marines with the free combat promotion are deadly