[Religion and Revolution]: Mod Development

[Schmiddie]

Do we already have the "River Feature" in our list for a later release?

I suggest to do that.

 

[Tigranes]

2. Include War of Independence from TAC (with minimal changes of my own)

Unless, I am missing something REF still has the same (small) number of MoW as in pre TAC WoI versions

Icons for Salt and Stone Salt units look the same when loaded in transports...

Cocoa Fruit has the same icon as Cocoa in Custom House screen.

TXT_KEY_UNIT_HIDES appear for hides when loading on transport from city.

Valuable wood is overvalued by French AI.

Spoiler :

They would not sell me it even for 4000 gold Danish colonies would sell the same stuff for 95 gold, Europe buying price was 7 gold for a piece of valuable wood.

 

[Tigranes]

B) Port Royal

I know it is useless to talk about Release 2 features when Release 1 is so close, but just so I will not forget later -- one very simple question:

Why Port Royal should be a Screen?

Africa and Europe are very far away and using screens and tiles on the Water (sail to Africa) is logical. But Port Royal is a city on the New World map, capital of Jamaica! On random maps this city can be generated on some island... Even though it belonged to Brits it can be the only city belonging to Pirate ("hidden Indian" but not future Barbarian) civilization, which cannot be DoWed or conquered until random Earthquake Event destroys that city in late game... Trade can go like with usual civilization.

Privateers and Criminals DID also originate in Europe. And one certainly did not go to Port Royal to buy a Criminal and put him working on your plantation On the other hand, for example, Henry Morgan were recruiting his brethren for an attack on Porto Bello in Panama. So instead of Criminals one should be able to get here new special unit Buccaneers -- which can act as a land Pirate with hidden nationality, attacking even cities without declaring war, but never able to step ashore except when capturing the city... This can be the only unit one could load on Privateer ship, except usual cargo.

I think it is possible to make it so that Port Royal would allow ships with Hidden Nationalities to enter to its harbor (like indian villages do now). Buccaneers (amphibious special unit) and Privateers (ship) can be hired through usual diplomacy screen while talking to Pirate "Chief". One can even bargain with him. When one hires Buccaneer he will appear as a unit on Port Royal tile.

This civ can use all the profits from trade with you to hire their own unique units -- their Buccaneers (unit) and Privateers (ship) with hidden nationalities to attack your own transports as well, so each player should think carefully to what extent he wants to trade with Pirate civilization.

Perhaps even in later releases this unique civilization can become playable

 

[raystuttgart]

Unless, I am missing something REF still has the same (small) number of MoW as in pre TAC WoI versions

The inital size of RES will not really be big.
It should be bigger though, after you have played a normal game and declare independence then.

But of course, you need to start a new game for these changes.
(Savegames will not work to test this.)

What I really want to know:
1. Is it possible to declare War of Independence without bugs.
2. Does Royal Fleet come in Waves.

The rest is balancing.
(And our balancing is not finished yet. I will need more feedback.)

Icons for Salt and Stone Salt units look the same when loaded in transports...

Thanks, I will check.

Cocoa Fruit has the same icon as Cocoa in Custom House screen.

Thanks, I will check.

TXT_KEY_UNIT_HIDES appear for hides when loading on transport from city.

No idea.

Valuable wood is overvalued by French AI.
They would not sell me it even for 4000 gold Danish colonies would sell the same stuff for 95 gold, Europe buying price was 7 gold for a piece of valuable wood.

This might have different reasons, but I will check.
(There is nothing configured that says "French does not want to sell but Danish do.")

I know it is useless to talk about Release 2 features when Release 1 is so close, but just so I will not forget later -- one very simple question:

This will not be part of Release 2 either.
We will see, when we might get to implement this.

Why Port Royal should be a Screen?

Because
1. It needs to work with every map and not only scenarios.
2. It needs to be understood by AI.
3. It needs to be implemented with reasonable effort.

Features are not only about "What would be cool ?"
It is also about efforts, risks, technical possibilities, ...

If we can do a flashy cool and complex implementation, we will try to.
But sometimes we need to go with something easier and more stable.

But currently having detialled brainstorming about Africa / Port Royal really does not make a lot of sense, since we do not know, when we will start working on those topics.

When we will know that we will find the time to eventually implement, we will do a detailled brainstorming to the topic again anyways.
Currently long discussions about that topic are really not very useful, because so many things can change until then.

 

[raystuttgart]

Do we already have the "River Feature" in our list for a later release?

Are you talking about the "Large Rivers" mentioned here ?

The problem is, that it really only makes sense to plan that feature if we find the appropriate graphics or somebody willing to create them ...
(Transitions between "Large Rivers" and "Normal Rivers" would be needed.)

 

[Schmiddie]

Alright, but I just wanted to saveguard this idea for a later Release. I can do the graphics in November.

 

[raystuttgart]

Alright, but I just wanted to saveguard this idea for a later Release. I can do the graphics in November.

Ok, then let us discuss this after Release 1 is out.

@team and partners:

New revision available in SVN.

Several small improvements.

Most importantly:
1. Improved balancing for TeachUnitClasses.
2. Corrected References of several buttons.

 

[raystuttgart]

@Schmiddie:

I took a look at the EuropeScreen graphics of Caravela Redonda.
They are just amazing !

@colonialfan:

Your improvements to the diplomacy texts are fantastic.
Great work as usual.

 

[drwcody]

Well done with the Inuit natives

 

[drwcody]

Just a quick reminder to all members and partners, MORE fresh and interesting idea's are needed!

Who will brainstorm up the next great feature?

1) So first of all. What are we going to call our mod? Religion and Revolution is a start...
Shall we keep this name or not? Let's talk about it!

2) Feature list and ideas:
Someone has to start ! Let's go then:

a) Storms and Winds and even more! Nothing ever happens in Civ4Col on ocean tiles. I added some terrain features in my Storm and Light mod. But I would like to do even more. I would like to add ocean events. Vimaire33 from French forum even suggested me to add illness events on ocean plots (by the way Ray, he might be able to help us with game texts, I'll contact him)

b) Religion. Here's my point. Why did everyone want to go to the New World? Answer one: because of the riches of the New World. Answer two: because of the religious wars. There really is something missing here. I would like to add religious features.
I like Ray's second parent idea. He will probably tell us more about is.

c) Wild Animals and Pirates. It's quite funny how you can cross the ocean, or even land without any problems. I really want us to be slowed down by animals, pirate, and even events. We really should have to "fight" if we want to explore...

d) Slavery,Africa, Port Royal. Slavery is part of American and European history. Moreover, I would really like to be able to sell/buy stuff in Africa and/or in Port Royal!

 

[raystuttgart]

Who will brainstorm up the next great feature?

Team, partners and community can do brainstorming of ideas and concepts.
Decisions (if, how and when a feature will be implemented) are made by the team.
Implementation is done by the team. (Sometimes in cooperation with another project.)
Alpha testing, first feedback and finetuning of the features is done by the team and the partners.
Then when we release again, the whole community can give feedback or ideas and thus help us further improve.

Just a quick reminder to all members and partners, MORE fresh and interesting idea's are needed!

There are still a lot of ideas and concepts on the list, that we did not implement yet.
But fresh ideas are welcome.

In only one week (August 26.), we will have our public release as download.
(Please wait with further large brainstorming until then, because we are really busy currently.)

Then the complete community will have acces to the mod (and not only team, partners and other modding projects).
(A lot of fresh ideas and wishes should arise then.)

People that show that they really want to get involved with us might become partners.
Our partners are simply involved a lot stronger with us and always have access to our current work in SVN.
(It is also a way of rewarding participation.)

Partners might also become team members if they want to actively participate in the mod creation and share our vision.

Modders from other projects can also have access to our SVN.
(Because we believe that strong cooperation between all projects will benefit everybody.)

Please excuse that it took us so long to create our Release 1.
(But we simply wanted to create quality.)

Only one more week !

 

[raystuttgart]

@team and partners:

New revision available in SVN.

Wordsizes LARGE and HUGE also have 6 European Players now.

Many community members do not have strong enough machines to play GIGANTIC.
But I think they should still be able to play with all 6 Europeans.
(Even without always having to start a "Custom Game".)

Everybody ok with that ?
(If not I will undo. )

 

[Tigranes]

Just a quick reminder to all members and partners, MORE fresh and interesting idea's are needed!

It is my understanding that the supply of ideas is more that modders can possibly consume They need playtesting of existing ideas more than discussions about stuff for Releases.

RnR is a good name, we even have a good opening screen. The name was around for so long! I was just surprised to find more new features about yields and less new features about ... well Religion and Revolution !

I am mostly waiting for the first release in hopes that modders will reevaluate priorities for next release and then approach to them with ideas. Most of the ideas I keep in my sleeve are actually about Religion and Revolution.

Here is example. Religion did not only acted as a force that was driving immigration. It also contributed to the morals of simple people. So, just like we have learning by doing mechanics we could have Crime and Bankruptcy mechanics -- downgrade of specialists and Free Colonists. If given colony generates too little crosses (many times I just don't build churches preferring to get my colonists via wars with Europeans) -- then player should expect Free Colonists turning into Criminals and Specialists getting into debts, closing businesses and becoming Servants. This random transformation become even more probable if there is a Tavern in the colony and some alcohol production. Probability is even higher if there is no Education generated or no School available. New born young Free Colonists do not see any school in their colony, do not see any crosses but see plenty of liquor -- this will corrupt them and contribute to the crime in the New World! Master Blacksmith will drink in Tavern to the point that he has to sell his business, loose his skills and become debtor servant!

 

[raystuttgart]

It is my understanding that the supply of ideas is more that modders can possibly consume

Indeed.
That is why we have slowed down discussing new ideas.

They need playtesting of existing ideas more than discussions about stuff for Releases.

We need both.
But currently (so short before our Release 1), we really do not have the time to get into long feature discussions ...

RnR is a good name, we even have a good opening screen. The name was around for so long! I was just surprised to find more new features about yields and less new features about ... well Religion and Revolution !

This is only our first release.
The base for all things to come in later releases.
Some features simply had to be done first.

Religion and Revolution is designed as a long term project, that might go for years.
(Depending on the amount of team members and partners we find ...)

Impatience does not help anybody ...

Here is example.
...

As I said:
Please let us wait with long brainstorming of new features for one more week.

 

[drwcody]

lets give um somethin' to talk about

 

[Robert Surcouf]

Hi everyone,

I've updated the SVN:
1) Main Interface Screen: Native gold will only appear with the no variables hidden option (European gold is unchanged)

2) Civilopedia: Yields section appears correctly now (font size and "box")

3) French translation. I was unable to update the "New Resources" file since it was updated before I could update...

Edit: If I'm correct you only modified TXT_KEY_UNIT_CATTLE_HIDES into TXT_KEY_UNIT_HIDES... If so my last update is correct. Otherwise... Well I guess I might have don something wrong. I hope I read the log correctly ...

 

[raystuttgart]

I've updated the SVN:
1) Main Interface Screen: Native gold will only appear with the no variables hidden option (European gold is unchanged)

2) Civilopedia: Yields section appears correctly now (font size and "box")

Great.
(I will check tomorrow.)

3) French translation. I was unable to update the "New Resources" file since it was updated before I could update...

You could simply have done an update and automatical merge (on your local copy).

Edit: If I'm correct you only modified TXT_KEY_UNIT_CATTLE_HIDES into TXT_KEY_UNIT_HIDES... If so my last update is correct. Otherwise... Well I guess I might have don something wrong. I hope I read the log correctly ...

Today I have only corrected that single TXT_KEY.

Everything should be correct.
(I also checked SVN log.)

Edit:
Found a small error, but fixed it.

 

[Robert Surcouf]

Great.
(I will check tomorrow.)

OK

You could simply have done an update and automatical merge (on your local copy).

How can I do an automatical merge ?

Today I have only corrected that single TXT_KEY.

Everything should be correct.
(I also checked SVN log.)

Edit:
Found a small error, but fixed it.

OK.
I've updated the SVN. I've fixed the uncoded special characters and I've done the Domestic market screen. The Infos displayed are correct, however it looks ugly:


I don't know how to make those buttons invisible... And I'll also have to prevent the popup to close itself when you click on a button... I don't know how to simply display an info inside a popup except with popupSetBodyString

 

[raystuttgart]

How can I do an automatical merge ?

When you did changes in your local copy and somebody else commited his own changes to the SVN in the mean time,
you can simply do an Update anyways.

Tortoise should then offer you to merge the recent changes in SVN with your local changes automatically.
(This always worked perfectly for me. At least with XML.)

I've fixed the uncoded special characters and I've done the Domestic market screen.

Great.

The Infos displayed are correct, however it looks ugly:
... I don't know how to simply display an info inside a popup except with popupSetBodyString

I just looked but I could not find any method that fits myself.
I really thought it would be possible to easily create a table ...

I will also continue to try to find something.

Edit:

What does popupCreateSpinBox do ?

Edit 2:

I just saw, that you can use this:
(I am writing pseudo code, hope you understand.)

Spoiler :

gDLL->getInterfaceIFace()->popupSetHeaderString(pPopup, gDLL->getText("TXT_KEY_HEADER"));

for ( ...) <--- Loop through yields
{
yieldIcon = ...
yieldStored= ...
yieldDemanded = ...
yieldPrice = ...

CvWString domesticMarketInformation = gDLL->getText("ROW_IN_DOMESTIC_MARKET_SCREEN", yieldIcon, yieldStored, yieldDemanded, yieldPrice);

gDLL->getInterfaceIFace()->popupSetBodyString(pPopup, domesticMarketInformation);
gDLL->getInterfaceIFace()->popupAddSeparator(pPopup);
}

So you can create several lines with using popupSetBodyString several times after each other.
(popupAddSeparator is optional of course.)

 

[Tigranes]

The work to build a good domestic market screen looks very promising! It already helps me alot in my current game. I just wanted to ask not to list any goods that will never be sold on domestic market, like food or wood. This way we can have only essential information. Perhaps clicking on the box could bring up Warehouse subscrean?